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7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
What are you talking about exactly? Who was the garden of Eden serpent, if not Satan?You have it backwards, what it is telling you in Revelation 12:9. It is telling you the beast in the bottomless pit in Revelation 17:8a is the garden of eden serpent. It is not Satan himself in the bottomless pit, but the most cunning of the all the beasts.
That passage says no such thing. Not even close. You are trying to make scripture say whatever you want it to say. Why would God want to resurrect some evil person from long ago? That's complete nonsense. You can't be taken seriously with this stuff.God is the One who does bring the person back to life, in Isaiah 14:18-20.
Premils and Amils all agree with this. You know that, right?This present heaven and earth will be destroyed right before the Great White Throne Judgement after the 1000 years have expired.
Revelaiton 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
The serpent. Who do you think named the serpent the serpent?What are you talking about exactly? Who was the garden of Eden serpent, if not Satan?
You are confused. No-one is being resurrected from long ago in Isaiah 14:18-20. The person has not even been killed yet.That passage says no such thing. Not even close. You are trying to make scripture say whatever you want it to say. Why would God want to resurrect some evil person from long ago? That's complete nonsense. You can't be taken seriously with this stuff.
You have it backwards, what it is telling you in Revelation 12:9. It is telling you the beast in the bottomless pit in Revelation 17:8a is the garden of eden serpent. It is not Satan himself in the bottomless pit, but the most cunning of the all the beasts.
It is indicating that it is the person, possessed by the serpent spirit, who will make war against them - and over come the two witnesses.Rev 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
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It is indicating that it is the person, possessed by the serpent spirit, who will make war against them - and over come the two witnesses.
In Revelation 13, afterwards, because he kills the two witnesses, the world says 4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
The beast in the bottomless pit does not have a physical body, but is a disembodied spirit.Where in the world did you come up with the "serpent spirit" term?
Did it come from the same place as your interpretation of Daniel 9:27?
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It's from Daniel 7:27
And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
A week can be a 7 day period or a 7 year period. The context here makes it clear that it's referring to a 7 year period. The verse does not specifically mention a rebuilt temple, but sacrifices can only happen in the temple. In order for sacrifices to cease, there needs to be a temple in which they are happening.
For the flesh Jews, the temple is the epitome of their religion; they desperately want their temple back. They are not followers of Jesus and so have not moved on to Jesus' new way where the body of believers is the true temple.
I believe this prophecy is referring to two different people at the same time, but in two very different ways. It is obviously referring to Jesus as he is the messiah, but Jesus will not overspread abominations. It is the AntiChrist (or Beast) who will do that. This person, the Beast, will make an agreement for 7 years (i.e. 1 week) most likely with the Jews to rebuild their temple (and in return they'll support his rise to political dominance, along with the rest of the world). But in the middle of this 7 year period, he reneges on this agreement and performs some shocking act to blaspheme the temple.
On the other hand, Jesus makes an agreement for this final, 7 year period to build his temple, a spiritual gathering of his body, i.e. the 144k mentioned in Revelation 14. This concept of the physical vs the spiritual is a common theme all throughout Jesus' teachings and an Angel in the Revelation even has a shot at this newly rebuilt temple, "And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified." The "great city" is Jerusalem, which is only important because it is where the temple is (or should be) located. The people's stubborn insistence on going back to a physical temple makes this once Holy City spiritually desolate.
Neither do I. Look carefully at what I said; the first 3.5 years will be a kind of fake peace. Then, in the "middle of the week" the AC will renege on his agreement and start his persecution of the saints, the 42 months, 1,260 days, etc. This second half of the 7 year period will be the Great Tribulation; 3.5 years only.
The 7th (and last) trumpet of this Great Tribulation is the return (and rapture) of Jesus for his followers.
I'm not saying Jesus didn't establish the NT, putting an end to sacrifices etc. I'm not saying the rebuilt temple is a good thing; I'm saying it's the opposite, it is an abomination precisely because of Jesus' sacrifice. Rebuilding the temple is a slap in the face of a God who already sacrificed himself for us, which is partly why I believe it will be in the interest of the AC to rebuild it. On the surface it will bring political clout to him; he will be seen as a brilliant peacemaker, but underneath I believe he will take some sadistic joy in knowing that the physical temple is an affront to Jesus' sacrifice.
The 70 weeks were meant for Daniel's people (i.e. the Children of Israel) and started at the commencement of the rebuilding of the 2nd temple. 69 of those "weeks" (or 463 years) later culminated in the death of Jesus. There should have been one, final, 7 year period after that, but as Jesus was "cut off", so too were God's people as a visible, united organization. As your screen name suggests, the flesh Jews were finished as God's people. The veil was torn, making the physical temple irrelevant; God now lives in the body of believers as his temple.
That final, 7 year period was put on hold. This does not invalidate Jesus' sacrifice at all; it's just an issue of timing. No group or organization on the earth can claim to be the Kingdom of Heaven, but, a time is coming when Jesus will unite 144k of his faithful followers into 12 tribes for one, final week (7 year period) in which they really will be the Kingdom of Heaven on earth, as a witness to the world during the Great Tribulation (which will be the second half of this 7 year period).
The onset of this destruction will be sudden. It will be sudden because they're not paying attention. It does not make sense for the world to say, "peace and safety" after its just been ravished by 3.5 years of Great Tribulation, "such as the world has never seen". This period of time must be immediately before the Great Tribulation.
Satan declares the end to those who claim to be of Christ at that time. No one can practice Christianity and the Atonement of the Cross.Sorry, but would you mind clarifying how you think this relates to what I was saying?
Nope. That's a fairy tale that can't be supported by scripture. The one who confirms the covenant is clearly referring to the Messiah, who was the last individual who was focused on before Daniel 9:27. And, it's clear that Jesus fulfilled everything listed in Daniel 9:24 long ago.
In fairness, it's easy to get confused by your nonsensical, unbiblical beliefs.You are confused. No-one is being resurrected from long ago in Isaiah 14:18-20. The person has not even been killed yet.
Where does scripture teach that? It's not in Isaiah 14, so where? You're making things up to support your doctrine. That's not good.The person is killed, his soul in hell a few days. The God then casts his soul out of hell, his body not even buried yet, still in the casket. And the person's lifeless body comes back to life as the whole world sees it happen.
God bringing the person back to life - is the strong delusion that God sends to them who will believe the Antichrist's claim of having achieved God-hood.
You have no discernment. The serpent was Satan.The serpent. Who do you think named the serpent the serpent?
Genesis 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
Genesis 1:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
The serpent was physically changed for his part in getting Adam and Eve to sin.
Genesis 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
Satan was not cusred to slither on his belly. That original serpent beast eventually died and it's spirit ended up in the bottomless pit.
I agree that there needs to be a temple for sacrifices to cease because that's where the sacrifices were performed. But, it's not speaking of a rebuilt temple. Which temple was standing when the Messiah was cut off? The second temple. And it was that temple standing at the time that Jesus declared to be desolate even before His death.
I don't take any of those time periods to be literal. The number 7 in prophetic scripture is a number representing completeness. So, a reference to 42 months, 1260 days is referring not to all time, but a certain period of time in history, which is the New Testament time period, in my opinion.
Hi OHC. Yes, I was already aware of all this, but thanks for sharing it, anyway. I believe your view is limiting the scope of the harlot Babylon a bit too much, though. I don't believe it refers to the RCC, though I can see why it could be interpreted that way as there are definitely a lot of things wrong with the RCC.SJ
Douggg's theology is one of the positions of the Jesuit teaching and that of the RCC it is counter reformation teaching (Jesuit Futurism) and is used to fulfill prophecy concerning the harlot and her daughters, which he does not address that I have seen over the years of reading his posts, but I could be wrong as they have been many posts by him.
Revelation 17 King James Version (KJV)
1And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great harlot that sitteth upon many waters:
2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth. (The "Dominus Iesus" faith declaration says, “It must be always clear that the one, holy, catholic and apostolic universal church is not the sister, but the mother of all the churches.”ii)
6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration
harlot of Babylon
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Reformation view
Historicist interpreters commonly used the phrase "harlot of Babylon" to refer to the Catholic Church. Reformation writers Martin Luther (1483–1546, author of On the Babylonian Captivity of the Church), John Calvin (1509–1564), and John Knox (1510–1572, author of The First Blast of the Trumpet Against the Monstruous Regiment of Women) taught this association.[36][37]
Most early Protestant Reformers believed, and the modern Seventh-day Adventist Church teaches, that in Bible prophecy a woman represents a church.[38][39] "I have likened the daughter of Zion to a lovely and delicate woman." (Jeremiah 6:2 nkjv) A harlot, it is argued, is representative of a church that has been unfaithful:
"Woman, Pure True Church Jeremiah 6:2; 2 Corinthians 11:2; Ephesians 5:23-27
Woman, Corrupt Apostate church Ezk. 16:15-58; 23:2-21; Hos. 2:5; 3:1; Rev. 14:4"
Bible Symbols Chart
Satan is not "the beast" in the bottomless pit. Satan was behind the serpent beast's actions. And Satan will be destroyed by Jesus. But Satan was not the serpent "beast".You have no discernment. The serpent was Satan.
To me, when it says all whose names are written in the book of life worship the beast (Rev 13:8), I take that very literally (which some may find ironic since I'm Amil and we get falsely accused of spiritualizing everything). I believe literally all whose names are not written in the book of life, without exception, worship the beast and that has been the case for a long time.
"Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."
The end of this 70 weeks marks everlasting righteousness; that is the Kingdom of Heaven of Earth. Is that what happened 3.5 years after Jesus was killed? No way! His followers were hunted, persecuted, and killed. The world is incredibly evil at the moment.
I believe you are being too literal here. There is a sense in which Christ brought in everlasting righteousness long ago by making eternal life available by way of His death and resurrection. I believe the 70th week is fulfilled. Attributing any part of it to a future Antichrist is a mistake and takes away from what Christ accomplished long ago. Here is my understanding of how Christ fulfilled the 6 things listed in Daniel 9:24 that had to be fulfilled within the 70 weeks.You say that it was the middle of this 7 year period when Jesus was killed, but then 3.5 years later everything should have been fixed up and finished. Look again at what the prophecy says about the completion of this time:
"Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."
The end of this 70 weeks marks everlasting righteousness; that is the Kingdom of Heaven of Earth. Is that what happened 3.5 years after Jesus was killed? No way! His followers were hunted, persecuted, and killed. The world is incredibly evil at the moment.
Notice also that in Revelation 10 there is a special angel who, at the sounding of the 7th trumpet, lifts his hand to Heaven and swears that there will be time no more. I believe this is a reference to the completion of the final 7 years of Daniel's prophecy, the one that brings in everlasting righteousness. Compare this with the description of the 7th trumpet from Revelation 11:15,
"And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever."
This sounds a lot like the everlasting righteousness mentioned at the end of the 70th week in Daniel's prophecy.
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