Caution! Rick Joyner is coming with more "revelations"!

[Frogster]

He as on Bakers sellathon show this morning, with a bit of self abasement, to hide the bragging.

He was telling about all of these encounters with Elijah, and even talking with Enoch, sounded like lengthy chats with them too.

He says people beg him, to learn about supernatural stuff, as he said few know this insight/path, of course, he does though. Jim Baker sat there like a young boy, just drinking this in. Sorry, with all due respect to Jim, that is what I saw, perceptions come at us, and we can't help but to notice..


Rick, as most know is one of those NAR super apostles running around out there. They make no apology for their self proclaimed status.


He says, that they said, that we will all look so happy, that the world will think we are, ummmm...retar--ded. Sorry for the word, but just quoting him. I might be wrong, but I don't think Baker liked that particular comment though, because he is always using fear, to sell his products to survive the end times tribulation, so we have a conflict there, be happy all the time, or scared enough to buy Baker's survival solar generator and canned foods!

As usual, for the most part, it was all about his revelations and visions...he says he used to have to go to his mountain retreat, to get his revelations, but wow...now they are almost always being downloaded, he said he ascended, with more insights into the supernatural, and is eager to share them with us!

 

[Frogster]

PS...

These are the people that talk all about the glory...forgetting that paul taught, that the glory came via afflictions and sufferings, so this happy "retar---ded" state, that he said Elijah spoke of, is not really balanced, according to scripture, that teaches suffering does good things. I found the descriptive word he used to be offensive.

 

[cyberlizard]

for once I agree with Frogster.

 

[Willie T]

Uh.... "due respect" to Jim Baker?

 

[talitha]

Hmm, when I read Rick Joyner's words, he seems very balanced, for example (a somewhat random excerpt):

Nothing in the whole creation will ever be as interesting as the Creator, and nothing in this world will ever be as interesting as His kingdom, but we have a duty. He so cares about this world that He has declared that He is going to make His home on earth and dwell on earth among men. Just thinking about this makes it hard to think about anything else, but we do have work to do to prepare for Him. In Matthew 6:31-34, the King gave us some important instructions:
“Do not be anxious then, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or 'What shall we drink?’ or ‘With what shall we clothe ourselves?’
“For all these things the Gentiles eagerly seek; for your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things.
“But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness; and all these things shall be added to you.
“Therefore do not be anxious for tomorrow; for tomorrow will care for itself.”
We must be resolved to seek the kingdom first. He promises that if we will do this, everything else will be taken care of. Anxiety is a desperate enemy of those who are called to walk by faith, not by fear. Those who are building their lives on His kingdom have the peace of God, which the world cannot even comprehend.

And the Final Quest series is very revelatory about the Church. An excerpt:

Then I turned and saw the army of the Lord standing behind me. There were thousands of soldiers, but we were still greatly outnumbered. Only a small number were fully dressed in their armor so that most were only partially protected. A large number were already wounded. Most of those who had all of their armor still had very small shields which I knew would not protect them from the onslaught that was coming. The majority of these soldiers were women and children.
Behind this army there was a trailing mob similar to the prisoners who followed the evil army, but very different in nature. These seemed to be very happy people, and were playing games, singing songs, feasting and roaming about from one little camp to the next. It reminded me of the atmosphere at Woodstock. I tried to raise my voice above the clamor to warn them that it was not the time for this, that the battle was about to begin, but only as few could even hear my voice. Those who did gave me the "peace sign" and said they did not believe in war, and that the Lord would not let anything bad happen to them. I tried to explain that the Lord had given us armor for a reason, but they just retorted that they had come to a place of peace and joy where nothing would happen to them. I began praying earnestly for the Lord to increase the faith (shields) of those with the armor, to help us protect those who were not ready for the battle.

 

[Tobias]

You know, the type of people who usually see visions and such are generally the ones least able to express themselves in a socially acceptable manner. Very few people have both the ability to navigate the spiritual realm, as well as having the grace and poise to tickle the ears of their human peers when they tell their story.

 

[Yitzchak]

Is there a link so that we can see for ourselves ?

 

[Frogster]

for once I agree with Frogster.

well..amen! I think we agree on the tithing thing too, not sure, but amen here, frog.

 

[Frogster]

Is there a link so that we can see for ourselves ?

it was on the jim bakker show today...

 

[Frogster]

You know, the type of people who usually see visions and such are generally the ones least able to express themselves in a socially acceptable manner. Very few people have both the ability to navigate the spiritual realm, as well as having the grace and poise to tickle the ears of their human peers when they tell their story.

well..he teaches, and has been around for awhile, so for one to, being shy, or inarticulate, or whatever, as they write books too, does not jive..

i mean, i know the guy is a transcendant master, living in the high places, and he has to snap out of it to teach and all...lol!

 

[Frogster]

Uh.... "due respect" to Jim Baker?

well.....

 

[Frogster]

it never fails, whenever one is going on and on about visions, or his gifts etc, the attention is on the person, not the Lord, reminding me of Col 2:18, vision boasting, inflation, and this verse...


John 7:18 Those who speak on their own seek their own glory; but the one who seeks the glory of him who sent him is true, and there is nothing false in him.

 

[Yitzchak]

it never fails, whenever one is going on and on about visions, or his gifts etc, the attention is on the person, not the Lord, reminding me of Col 2:18, vision boasting, inflation, and this verse...


John 7:18 Those who speak on their own seek their own glory; but the one who seeks the glory of him who sent him is true, and there is nothing false in him.

Can you give me one example of someone having visions today that you approve of ? Or is your position that visions faded away with the first century church ?

Wasn't it the Apostle Paul who saw the vision on the road to Damascus and actually claimed that Jesus appeared to him ?

Or what about Isaiah who claimed to see the throne room of Heaven and to interact with angels.

Is it now impossible for someone to have that sort of experience today ?

 

[Frogster]

Can you give me one example of someone having visions today that you approve of ? Or is your position that visions faded away with the first century church ?

Wasn't it the Apostle Paul who saw the vision on the road to Damascus and actually claimed that Jesus appeared to him ?

Or what about Isaiah who claimed to see the throne room of Heaven and to interact with angels.

Is it now impossible for someone to have that sort of experience today ?

please don't set me up as a cessationist, when you know I am not, go take a peep in the GT section, i have a healing thread going..click link below.


http://www.christianforums.com/t7790053/

Paul was reticent to share about his visions in 2 Cor 12, because it says he did not want people to think too much of him, and some things were not permitted to be uttered, and he wrote Col 2:18 also..

far cry from today's people always bragging, or talking about these so called visions, where they confirm John 7:18.


they are the center, along with their experiences...actually it is starting to sound like a church without Christ, it should now be called.. .."The first church of visions and mighty gifted ones"

 

[Yitzchak]

please don't set me up as a cessationist, when you know I am not, go take a peep in the GT section, i have a healing thread going..click link below.


http://www.christianforums.com/t7790053/

Paul was reticent to share about his visions in 2 Cor 12, because it says he did not want people to think too much of him, and some things were not permitted to be uttered, and he wrote Col 2:18 also..

far cry from today's people always bragging, or talking about these so called visions, where they confirm John 7:18.


they are the center, along with their experiences...actually it is starting to sound like a church without Christ, it should now be called.. .."The first church of visions and mighty gifted ones"

That does not answer the question. Whether you want to apply a label to it or not is besides the point. Those are your labels , not mine. The question stands.


Can you give a single example of someone today who has reported visions , angel sightings and that sort of thing which you approve of ? If you cannot name a single person which you approve of , then it seems that your issue is not with Joyner , but rather with the practice itself. If you declare 100% of the currently known reports of visions as fake , then that makes Joyner just one of many that you disapprove of.

So once again , I am asking for clarification on whether you are against the practice of seeing angels and having visions today ?

If your answer is no , then please provide an example of someone doing it the " right " way , today. If you cannot give a single example , than what am I to think ? It does not take discernment to say 100% of them are false. The thing that takes discernment is to tell the difference between the true and the false.

 

[Frogster]

That does not answer the question. Whether you want to apply a label to it or not is besides the point. Those are your labels , not mine. The question stands.


Can you give a single example of someone today who has reported visions , angel sightings and that sort of thing which you approve of ? If you cannot name a single person which you approve of , then it seems that your issue is not with Joyner , but rather with the practice itself. If you declare 100% of the currently known reports of visions , then that makes Joyner just one of many that you disapprove of.

So once again , I am asking for clarification on whether you are against the practice of seeing angels and having visions today ?

If your answer is no , then please provide an example of someone doing it the " right " way , today. If you cannot give a single example , than what am I to think ? It does not take discernment to say 100% of them are false. The thing that takes discernment is to tell the difference between the true and the false.

so you did not call me a cessationist, when you talked about visions fading with the first century church? Please try not to see them everywhere, if you look for it, you will think you see it. You asked a question, well...are ya happy?

you may want to understand, that though some do not introject every vision seeing, glory dust talking people, hanging out with angels daily people, it does not mean cessationism!


now, with all due respect, sorry, but as far as you questions, because of your tone, and cross examination style with me, i will feel no need to be put on a witness stand.

 

[Frogster]

Col 2:18 Let no one disqualify you, insisting on asceticism and worship of angels, going on in detail about visions, puffed up without reason by his sensuous mind,


KJV Col:18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,


It's the flesh, when people brag about this stuff..."sensuous minds"...


and this angel stuff...worship..oh my!


Even Rodney Howard Brown mocks those who have muffins with angels, as he attacks this hyper familiarity they seem to tout, along with glitter dust, and feathers, and the flattering prophecies too..

Is Rodney a cessationist?


Now, lets celebrate diversity, and love conservative frog! just joking with ya..., have a blessed day..

 

[talitha]

Whatever Yitzach's tone, he does have a good question. I'm curious too. I remember when a friend of mine had a powerful end-time vision - she spoke at church with many tears - it was difficult to talk about but impossible NOT to talk about. I think that's how I would feel too. Do you think people still have visions like Isaiah, Paul, and John did? If so, to what point is it okay to talk about them, and to hope that others will have them too? *curious*

 

[hopeinGod]

I have witnessed only healing miracles in my 40 years as a Christian and they took place during two Kathryn Kuhlman meetings. All that followed afterwards, all the showmen and wannabe miracle workers that came either out of the local body or from out of town, were deceptive and manipulative toward those folks who attended in agony and last resort thinking. These past few decades have been dry as dead bones as I see it, like a never ending wilderness. Perhaps, after the next ten years passes, bringing the total to 40 years, God may bring deliverance. That would be nice.

 

[Yitzchak]

I have witnessed only healing miracles in my 40 years as a Christian and they took place during two Kathryn Kuhlman meetings. All that followed afterwards, all the showmen and wannabe miracle workers that came either out of the local body or from out of town, were deceptive and manipulative toward those folks who attended in agony and last resort thinking. These past few decades have been dry as dead bones as I see it, like a never ending wilderness. Perhaps, after the next ten years passes, bringing the total to 40 years, God may bring deliverance. That would be nice.

That sounds discouraging. It is dry a lot of places.