Can't accept Christianity

[razzelflabben]

I was just finishing a discussion with someone who offered this analogy/metaphor. Religion tries to put a coat of paint over old paint, the end result is chipping peeling, bubbling paint. But Jesus comes along and helps us remove the old coat of paint, providing us with a clear surface to work with. Hope that helps.

 

[TrillTexas]

I was just finishing a discussion with someone who offered this analogy/metaphor. Religion tries to put a coat of paint over old paint, the end result is chipping peeling, bubbling paint. But Jesus comes along and helps us remove the old coat of paint, providing us with a clear surface to work with. Hope that helps.

Thats True

 

[TeChNoWC]

" In any case, my main situation is this: I know all there is to know about Christianity, or at least enough. I highly doubt someone could present to me a perspective I am not familiar with. Yet I cannot accept it. My heart wants nothing to do with God and I only think of him bitterly. I don't want to go back to where I was in high school because that relationship was too flimsy and fake, but I would like something to give me a sense of purpose and security in life. Right now I am terrified of death for fear of hell, but I just don't want God. If that's where my heart is, what can I do about it?"

Honesty is the first step. Before we are born again we are enmity towards God. Our hearts are wicked and we hate God. We might, some of us, love the idea of God or a god our mind conjures up (idolatry), but ever presented with the true God, as I believe you know Him at least intellectually, we hate Him. That's because we are evil, and He is good, so naturally, we hate good. But, you have a conscience, and you have a fear of the Lord (the beginning of wisdom) and this is good.

What you need to do brother, is get down on your knees and ask God to change your heart. Are you also repentant of your sin? To come to Christ we need to repent and trust in Him. If you feel you cannot do this, you need to ask the Lord to help you.

 

[razzelflabben]

Are you calling God gay?

I got to ask....where did you get God is gay from the quote you are referring to???

 

[BlackSabb]

I'll take the challenge of presenting some "new" takes on the old traditions of the church....
I would like to ask you a couple of questions if I might, it might get a bit uncomfortable for you, so if your the kind that reports every discomfort please say so upfront, otherwise here are my first questions....
1. At 6, why did you come to Christ? Was it out of fear of hell or out of love for God, or maybe out of "presure" from the family??? (those are the most common, there could be others)

That is an excellent question. Let me just say this. To become a "Christian" at age 6 is not normal!! Normal 6 yr olds are not thinking about religion. This suggests to me that you were raised in a family of fanatics and extreme religious zealots. And being fanatics, I am sure you were coerced into "accepting Christ" from a fear of Hell and pressure from the family.

I would say that your faith has been built on a wrong foundation to begin with. Hence your doubts and misgivings.

 

[razzelflabben]

That is an excellent question. Let me just say this. To become a "Christian" at age 6 is not normal!! Normal 6 yr olds are not thinking about religion. This suggests to me that you were raised in a family of fanatics and extreme religious zealots. And being fanatics, I am sure you were coerced into "accepting Christ" from a fear of Hell and pressure from the family.

actually, I came to Christ at the age of 6, it was out of a desperation to survive in a world that hated me. And in reality, I, yes at the age of 6, led my family to Christ. In fact, I don't recall ever going to church or praying before that night long, long ago. Nor did I go to church events or VBS type stuff. Though I was told that we went on Easter and Christmas, I have no memory of it at all. As to hell, personally, I didn't even know hell existed until much much later. I guess the point is, that you can pigeon hole people all you want, but truth is found in the individual, not the genrealizations that make us comfortable.

I would say that your faith has been built on a wrong foundation to begin with. Hence your doubts and misgivings.

Personally I think that anyone who comes to Christ to avoid hell, and not for the purpose of finding life in the Savior is missing the mark, but I do agree with you here.

 

[TheAcherMan]

Honesty is the first step. Before we are born again we are enmity towards God. Our hearts are wicked and we hate God. We might, some of us, love the idea of God or a god our mind conjures up (idolatry), but ever presented with the true God, as I believe you know Him at least intellectually, we hate Him. That's because we are evil, and He is good, so naturally, we hate good. But, you have a conscience, and you have a fear of the Lord (the beginning of wisdom) and this is good.

What you need to do brother, is get down on your knees and ask God to change your heart. Are you also repentant of your sin? To come to Christ we need to repent and trust in Him. If you feel you cannot do this, you need to ask the Lord to help you.

This is theology I've heard before and been taught. To me, it makes sense. However, I've already tried asking God to change my heart. I've tried to be as humble as possible and give everything to him, but it never worked. I think that deep down I don't really want him to change me. I think I enjoy resting in the bitterness and power of rejecting God. Of course that is just my self-psycho-analysis, so who knows? As for repenting, that has also been near impossible. Again, my heart is not in the right place for that. What's got me stumped is how I'm supposed to ask God earnestly to change my heart when, until he changes it, I don't earnestly want it changed.

That is an excellent question. Let me just say this. To become a "Christian" at age 6 is not normal!! Normal 6 yr olds are not thinking about religion. This suggests to me that you were raised in a family of fanatics and extreme religious zealots. And being fanatics, I am sure you were coerced into "accepting Christ" from a fear of Hell and pressure from the family.

I would say that your faith has been built on a wrong foundation to begin with. Hence your doubts and misgivings.

I don't think my family was fanatical. I think they just took me to church and taught Christianity to be true like any Christian family would. But I won't say it's impossible that my foundation was wrong. After all, I was only 6 and my main motivation was avoid hell and being like everyone else I knew. But I recognized that a long time ago and renewed my faith many times when I learned new things and realized my foundations before may have been faulty. Still, the issue may be that I never really took the gospel to heart, but instead only believed the facts. At this point, it's impossible for me to look back and know for sure how real my faith was.

 

[BlackSabb]

I don't think my family was fanatical. I think they just took me to church and taught Christianity to be true like any Christian family would. But I won't say it's impossible that my foundation was wrong. After all, I was only 6 and my main motivation was avoid hell and being like everyone else I knew. But I recognized that a long time ago and renewed my faith many times when I learned new things and realized my foundations before may have been faulty. Still, the issue may be that I never really took the gospel to heart, but instead only believed the facts. At this point, it's impossible for me to look back and know for sure how real my faith was.

I don't mean to disparage you or anyone else, but how on earth can any 6yr old make such a committment to be a Christian? What does any 6yr old know about life in general to make such an important decision and committment?

I mean for goodness sakes, when you're 6yrs old, you've only just come out of kindergarten! You've only just learnt the alphabet and numbers and nursery rhymes. It is ridiculous to suggest that a 6yr old has the mental faculties to be thinking about the implications of religious beliefs.

I'm sorry, but this is just not normal behaviour.

 

[TheAcherMan]

I don't mean to disparage you or anyone else, but how on earth can any 6yr old make such a committment to be a Christian? What does any 6yr old know about life in general to make such an important decision and committment? I mean for goodness sakes, when you're 6yrs old, you've only just come out of kindergarten!

That's why I said, "But I won't say it's impossible that my foundation was wrong. After all, I was only 6 and my main motivation was avoid hell and being like everyone else I knew....At this point, it's impossible for me to look back and know for sure how real my faith was."

I've known plenty of people who "became Christians" at that age and are still strong believers, but they probably didn't really understand enough until they were older. On the other hand, it's not impossible for a 6-year-old to feel guilt and want forgiveness. I think it's hard to really know in most cases, but I'm willing to admit that my 6yr old decision may not have been the solid foundation I thought it was. That's why I said, "But I recognized that a long time ago and renewed my faith many times when I learned new things and realized my foundations before may have been faulty."

 

[razzelflabben]

I don't mean to disparage you or anyone else, but how on earth can any 6yr old make such a committment to be a Christian? What does any 6yr old know about life in general to make such an important decision and committment?

I mean for goodness sakes, when you're 6yrs old, you've only just come out of kindergarten! You've only just learnt the alphabet and numbers and nursery rhymes. It is ridiculous to suggest that a 6yr old has the mental faculties to be thinking about the implications of religious beliefs.

I'm sorry, but this is just not normal behaviour.

there is a big difference between "normal" and reality. The truth is that some 6 year olds are capable of such thought and reasoning, but most are not. This issue came up recently in our church, when a parent was worried about the young age of their child and that moment of "decision". Point being, the point you are making is a good one and one that many should take to heart, however, it is not as definative as you seem to be trying to make it. There are definately 6 year olds that are capable, and 6 year olds that are not.

And while the topic is open, the generally acceptable biblical age of accountability was 13. Which should be a word of caution to all bible believing families that long for their children to come to Christ, and want to push them into it.

 

[nathan57]

Some people find Him and sometimes He finds you. Reading your post made me think of a claim made by CS Lewis:

You must picture me alone in that room in Magdalen, night after night, feeling, whenever my mind lifted even for a second from my work, the steady, unrelenting approach of Him whom I so earnestly desired not to meet. That which I greatly feared had at last come upon me. In the Trinity Term of 1929 I gave in, and admitted that God was God, and knelt and prayed: perhaps, that night, the most dejected and reluctant convert in all England

I personally believe that if you pursue faith you will find it, I do not think it is something that is as easy as flipping a light switch. Give it time and and it will grow in you

 

[TheAcherMan]

Thank you all for your replies. I think that at this point there is nothing I can do to change my own heart and I can only patiently seek more understanding of myself and God. So I will try to do that, even though seeking God will be hard with my bitter predisposition.

 

[razzelflabben]

Thank you all for your replies. I think that at this point there is nothing I can do to change my own heart and I can only patiently seek more understanding of myself and God. So I will try to do that, even though seeking God will be hard with my bitter predisposition.

May your mind be opened, your heart softened, and truth revealed so that there is no mistake in you as to what truth is....

 

[TeChNoWC]

Daily confess that you have a love for God that is growing deeper and deeper, and a relationship that is growing stronger. Speak it into being! Take positive action and take charge. It seems you WANT to love God, but you don't, or at least nowhere near as much as you would like to. But that's exactly it; you can't change your heart, only God can, so start believing His promises to you who accepts Him as Saviour and believe and confess that He will perfect the work in you that He started when you were 6! The devil is trying to stop you from achieving this and dishearten you and quell your love, and your flesh is easily bowing to it. MAKE WAR using the tools of God's Word.

 

[annrobert]

I was raised in a Christian home, accepted Jesus when I was 6 and led a Christian life with Christian fellowship since then. But in late high school things started to fall apart. While I should have had a faith that welled up from inside and which gave me peace, I found it a strain to love God or even give a crap about what he'd done. I finally decided that I couldn't force myself to love God and that I had to be honest with myself. I released my heart and it quickly fled far away from God. I wasn't happy, but I finally felt genuine and not suffocated.

We cannot force ourselves to Love Jesus,we come to Him and get to know Him and taste that He is good.We come to Him and ask Him to forgive us and ask Him for rest and peace.
Rebelling against God may make a person feel genuine,however we were meant to Love and obey our Saviour and Lord,and that is the way to true genuineness.
Jesus is Truth.
We shall know the truth and the truth shall make us free.
No one a person is not happy with God since Jesus is the way and the Truth and the Life.
Without Jesus we are lost , deceived and dead.
Jessu gives peace and joy and love.
Without Jesus we can do nothing.
We cannot change our hearts but Jesus makes all things new.
We are weak but Jesus is strong.
Jesus is the sure foundation.
He takes our feet out of miry clay and sets us on a Rock.
Jesus is our Refuge and Fortress.
We can do nothing without Him.
Jesus says to love Him with all our heart and soul and mind and strength.
So when we come to Jesus and ask Him to change us He does.
From the inside out.
Jesus gives us hope and Life.
Jesus makes all things new.
Jesus invites us to come to Him for rest and to taste and see that He is good.We caanot force it,
We can choose to believe in Jesus and ask Him to forgive our sins and to be our Lord and our Saviour and to change us and lead us and comfort us and heal us and fix us.
We can choose to surrender to our Lord and Saviour , all our fears and doubts and rebellions etc.Just surrender to Jesus and trust Him.
It is so easy.
Choose to ask Jesus to forgive us and save us and we make Jesus our Saviour and Lord and surrender to Him and trust Him.
Get to know Jesus through pouring our hearts out to Him in prayer and tasing and seeing that He is good.

Still, concerned for my eternal soul, I attended a Christian college for 2 years, but nothing changed. I can now "argue" on the side of the Christian or the atheist. To be honest, I probably argue for Christianity better and I find it hard to shake some of the beliefs.

christian college cannot change us only Jesus can.
without Jesus...........
2 Timothy 3:7
Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.



The main theological problems I have mainly revolve around sovereignty vs. free will and the seemingly never ending arguments around things like baptism. It really bugs me that Christians can't agree on so many things that seem to be big deals. Why didn't Jesus teach clearly?


It does not matter all the things people argue over , Jesus taught very plainly and clearly.

1. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
   John 3:15-17 (in Context) John 3
2. John 3:36
   He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
   John 3:35-36 (in Context) John 3
3. John 4:14
   But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
   John 4:13-15 (in Context) John 4
4. John 5:24
   Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
   John 5:23-25 (in Context) John 5
5. John 6:27
   Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
   John 6:26-28 (in Context) John 6
6. John 6:40
   And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
   John 6:39-41 (in Context) John 6
7. John 6:47
   Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
   John 6:46-48 (in Context) John 6

1 Timothy 1:16
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

Acts 13:46
Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.

Daniel 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.


Romans 9
30What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.

31But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone; 33As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of
offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.


In any case, my main situation is this: I know all there is to know about Christianity, or at least enough. I highly doubt someone could present to me a perspective I am not familiar with. Yet I cannot accept it.

1. Romans 8:6
   For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
   Romans 8:5-7 (in Context) Romans 8
2. Romans 8:7
   Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
   Romans 8:6-8 (in Context) Romans 8

Our minds won't accept the things of God.
It is a choice and after we make the choice Jesus gives us a new heart and makes all things new.
We ignore our rebellion and our carnal minds.

Romans 10:10
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.


Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

My heart wants nothing to do with God and I only think of him bitterly. I don't want to go back to where I was in high school because that relationship was too flimsy and fake, but I would like something to give me a sense of purpose and security in life.

Only Jesus can give us peace and rest and security.
Only Jesus saves and makes all things new.
Only in Jesus is safety and a sure foundation.
Only Jesus is our Refuge and Fortress.
Only Jesus can melt a heart.
Only Jesus gives us a hope and a future and restores our soul and leads us beside still waters.
Only Jesus is the Good Shepherd who lays down His life for the sheep.
Only Jesus has power to forgive sins .
Only Jesus loves unconditionally and changes hearts.
Jesus if full of mercy and compassion.
Only Jesus has all authorty.
Jesus can and will givea real relationship.
Our job is to come and ask Jesus to forgive us and to be our Lord and Saviour.Surrender.
Jesus says he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.
All things are possible with God.

1. Matthew 19:26
   But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
   Matthew 19:25-27 (in Context) Matthew 19
2. Mark 10:27
   And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
   Mark 10:26-28 (in Context) Mark 10
3. Luke 18:27
   And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
   Luke 18:26-28 (in Context) Luke 18

 

[annrobert]

continued from last post

Right now I am terrified of death for fear of hell, but I just don't want God. If that's where my heart is, what can I do about it?[/quote]

1. Matthew 19:26
   But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
   Matthew 19:25-27 (in Context) Matthew 19
2. Mark 10:27
   And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
   Mark 10:26-28 (in Context) Mark 10
3. Luke 18:27
   And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
   Luke 18:26-28 (in Context) Luke 18

Romans 10:10

For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.


Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:


Make a choice to believe in Jesus and call out to Him to forgive you and to Save you and to be your Lord and Saviour and to change you.
Surrender to Jesus


blessings
annrobert

 

[doubting]

Thank you all for your replies. I think that at this point there is nothing I can do to change my own heart and I can only patiently seek more understanding of myself and God. So I will try to do that, even though seeking God will be hard with my bitter predisposition.

I am much like you in background. I have more anger than answers. I will tell my own story soon.

 

[razzelflabben]

continued from last post

Right now I am terrified of death for fear of hell, but I just don't want God. If that's where my heart is, what can I do about it?

Can I ask a question? What or why don't you want God, what do you think you will loose if you follow God, love God....? Maybe another way to ask the question is what part of God do you not want?