Can the JW or Mormon be saved by their Jesus?

[SNPete]

I would like some opinions.



What I am wondering is whether a Mormon or JW can be saved if they accept the Jesus of their religion as savior. What I mean by: “the Jesus of their religion” is the JW Jesus, who is a small-g god or the archangel, Gabriel. The Mormon Jesus, who is an exalted man and the brother of Lucifer.



On one hand I feel that God might honor a decision made for Christ, based on the best understanding of an individual, even if it is not the Jesus of the Bible.



On the other hand, I tend to think God might not honor accepting a false Jesus as savior. Even if this false Jesus is the only concept of Jesus the person knows or accepts. I base this idea on the experience I had while trying to understand Mormonism. God gave me John 4:24 as my key to understanding Mormonism. “Those who worship God must worship Him in Spirit and in TRUTH”. What this said to me is that one has to worship the True God. One could possibly expand this idea to accepting the true Jesus also.



(For this discussion, my definition of Know means this is the only concept of Jesus that a person is aware of. Accepts means the person has had teaching of the Biblical Jesus, but accepts the Mormon or JW Jesus as true.)



So what do you think?

 

[Knee V]

On the one hand, the JW and LDS churches are false religions. They may possess pieces of truth, but "The Truth" is not there. On the other hand, it is wrong to assume that an individual cannot be the recipient of God's mercy because of their affiliation (just as it is wrong to believe that someone IS the recipient of God's mercy because of their affiliation).
They do not possess the truth, but "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion". God judges righteously, so if when I am in heaven I meet someone who was a Mormon, I'll know that God did the right thing, even if I don't understand.

 

[ScottBot]

On the one hand, the JW and LDS churches are false religions. They may possess pieces of truth, but "The Truth" is not there. On the other hand, it is wrong to assume that an individual cannot be the recipient of God's mercy because of their affiliation (just as it is wrong to believe that someone IS the recipient of God's mercy because of their affiliation).
They do not possess the truth, but "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion". God judges righteously, so if when I am in heaven I meet someone who was a Mormon, I'll know that God did the right thing, even if I don't understand.

Perfect. I think it is a bad idea for humans to try to impose limitations on God's mercy.

 

[Singinman]

I think it would be hard for a Mormon to be saved by "their" Jesus, because Mormon theology denies that God's grace through Jesus is sufficient for salvation. In other words, when Joe Mormon says, "I believe in Jesus (as taught by Mormons)" he is saying that he believes that Jesus' death on the cross made it possible for Joe to achieve salvation by adhering to Mormon law. Joe does not know from Mormon teaching that it is God's grace that saves.

"none but Jesus can do helpless sinners good."

 

[Paleoconservatarian]

As I adhere to a Christian worldview, and therefore that salvation is through Christ Jesus of the Bible alone, I can only answer that our friends from the Watchtower and Salt Lake City cannot be saved by their Jesuses. Jeses. Jesii. Whatever.

 

[ScottBot]

As I adhere to a Christian worldview, and therefore that salvation is through Christ Jesus of the Bible alone, I can only answer that our friends from the Watchtower and Salt Lake City cannot be saved by their Jesuses. Jeses. Jesii. Whatever.

Not to hijack the thread, but this isn't the Christian Worldview. Since there are more "Romanists" in the world than all of the "non-Romanists" in the world combined, the Christian view does not adhere to a Bible-Alone worldview.

 

[Paleoconservatarian]

Not to hijack the thread, but this isn't the Christian Worldview. Since there are more "Romanists" in the world than all of the "non-Romanists" in the world combined, the Christian view does not adhere to a Bible-Alone worldview.

I didn't even hint at a "Bible-Alone" worldview. I mean to distinguish the Christ of the Bible, which still happens to be the scriptures used by Rome unless I'm mistaken, as opposed to the Jesus of the cultic scriptures.

 

[ScottBot]

I didn't even hint at a "Bible-Alone" worldview. I mean to distinguish the Christ of the Bible, which still happens to be the scriptures used by Rome unless I'm mistaken, as opposed to the Jesus of the cultic scriptures.

Oops, sorry, I misjudged your intention. I agree, salvation essentially requires an accurate understanding of Christ. I am hesitant, however, of "condemning" someone who has been lead astray by a false teacher and through no fault of their own, are never exposed to the authentic Jesus.

 

[deu58]

Hi singingman

I think it would be hard for a Mormon to be saved by "their" Jesus, because Mormon theology denies that God's grace through Jesus is sufficient for salvation. In other words, when Joe Mormon says, "I believe in Jesus (as taught by Mormons)" he is saying that he believes that Jesus' death on the cross made it possible for Joe to achieve salvation by adhering to Mormon law. Joe does not know from Mormon teaching that it is God's grace that saves.

"none but Jesus can do helpless sinners good."

There are christians right here in the christians only forum that believe in works based faith,

If a mormon or JW tels me he/she is a christian I will not judge him/her, Let God make that call. They claim to be his servants so I just do not bother worrying if they are saved or not,

I will argue and condemn their doctrines all day long but I will not judge the individual believer lest I find myself in the end being judged by God for doing so,

I can remember when I was young Catholics and Protestants judged each other as not being saved, But some where that all changed,

So who is to say that the judgment of religious men of the Mormon and JW is just??

I do not bid them God speed because they teach another gospel, But we are all indoctrinated to one degree or another, We simply can not understand why other people can not see what we see so we judge them as unworthy,

But the truth is if you were born a Mormon in a devout Mormon family then right now you would be on the otherside wondering why peolle can not see the the simple truth of Mormonism.

Maybe even thinking I wonder if their Jesus can really save them???

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[ps139]

God will show mercy to whom He shows mercy.

That is the short answer, but I do not think that any amount of scriptural analysis will give us a more specific answer than that.

 

[PaladinValer]

If Christ wishes to allow a Mormon or Jehovah's Witness into heaven, then that's His Will.

 

[Maharg]

Just to broaden the discussion, what about a Bible-believing Christian who hasn't fully understood the Biblical revelation of Jesus and doesn't have a full understanding of him?

Can any of us really understand fully who Jesus is? Can we perfectly know him?

 

[SNPete]

Just to broaden the discussion, what about a Bible-believing Christian who hasn't fully understood the Biblical revelation of Jesus and doesn't have a full understanding of him?

Can any of us really understand fully who Jesus is? Can we perfectly know him?

I don't think a person has to fully understand Jesus to be saved or to accept Him as savior. What saves a person is trusting in Jesus and accepting His atoning sacrifice for one's salvation.



To put it another way: For by grace you have been saved through faith and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works (or even acheiving a full understanding, which could be viewed as a type of works), lest anyone should boast.



Faith in a way is the opposite of understanding. So we are saved by faith and not by fully understanding or perfectly knowing Jesus.

 

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings,

What does the scriptures say?

2 Cor 11:1-4 Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me. 2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. 3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

Here Paul is saying that he feared for the souls of the Corinthians that they may receive a PERVERTED Gospel and be led astray from the ONE TRUE GOSPEL.

Gal 1:6-9 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: 7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

The JWs believe that Michael, the archangel, was the Lord Jesus Christ. They have many doctrines that are perverted. What does Paul say about them?

The Mormons believe the angel Moriah(sp?) gave Joseph Smith a golden plate with the NEW gospel upon them. Jesus is considered the "spirit brother" of Jesus. What do you think Paul is saying about them?

Are we not to know and be able to discern those who would pervert the Gospel of Jesus Christ? When a young JW or Mormon appears at your door, what is he doing? This is part of their training and this evangelical approach stays with them all the days of their lives.

Are you prepared to give an answer for the hope that is within you? Discernment is not observation by outward appearances, but it is based upon the Holy Spirit IN YOU. If you do not have Him and the discernment He brings to you, I suggest you get it.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[deu58]

Hi Dad Ernie

Greetings,



Are we not to know and be able to discern those who would pervert the Gospel of Jesus Christ? When a young JW or Mormon appears at your door, what is he doing? This is part of their training and this evangelical approach stays with them all the days of their lives.

Are you prepared to give an answer for the hope that is within you? Discernment is not observation by outward appearances, but it is based upon the Holy Spirit IN YOU. If you do not have Him and the discernment He brings to you, I suggest you get it.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

I am not being critical of you I am just making an observation, If we follow your line thought then that means there is only one true Physical church and only one true interpretation of the Bible,

And it must be you and like minded peoplewho agree with you who belong to this church and hold to this doctrine that have the real truth,

Every body else is just on the outside looking in,

I agree that the doctrines of these groups is false and I freely tell them so when they come to my door, But I can not see the heart of the individule,
So how can I and where in scripture am I permitted to judge the hearts of Men???

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[Pac Shady]

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! (Galatians 1:8,9)

Sounds pretty straight forward to me: Mormons, Jw's, Oneness, etc. are not saved by their 'Jesus''s.

God Bless

'Shady

 

[Dad Ernie]

I agree that the doctrines of these groups is false and I freely tell them so when they come to my door, But I can not see the heart of the individule,
So how can I and where in scripture am I permitted to judge the hearts of Men???

Greetings Deu,

Have you considered:

1 Cor 2:11-16 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. 16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

I think a more appropriate term for US to use is "discernment", rather than "judge or judgment", for it is not to us to "judge", but rather we have the spirit and mind of Christ IF we are His. My own experience tells me that the Christ Spirit in another person, I am able to discern by their actions and their words and their love. The three are inseparable. As much as it depends upon us, we are to live at peace with all men, but to have fellowship, that is the Greek word "Koinonea", we should keep that for the Christian community. We are to have no fellowship with the dark. Jesus should always be our example, first winning the souls of men and women to Him, and THEN having fellowship with them.

I am sort of strange, I enjoy the JWs or Mormons coming to my door. They are like a gift of God just waiting to hear all about Jesus, and that is what I do. I have never converted one, but I know I've planted many seeds. It is our job always to bring glory to the Name of Jesus Christ. We cannot passively stand by and let another gospel be preached without speaking up for the hope that is in us, but with gentleness and respect for the individual.

When Jesus commissioned His disciples to go and preach to the Jewish community, they were told also to use "discernment", that if they and their Gospel message was rejected, that they should shake the dust off their feet and move on. We are to do no less.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[jasperbound]

I'm sure they're as saved by their Jesus as somebody who worships somebody alive today named Jesus.
Sure, they might all be named Jesus, but are they all the Word of God?

 

[Firebird73]

I am an exmormon so maybe i can give you a little insight.first of all, The Mormons beleive that they are the only one's that will attain Celestial glory (the 3rd heaven) people that have followed the teachings of christ in other churches attain the terrestrial glory, and the wicked the telestial glory. If you could see the telestial glory (or kingdom) you would commit suicide just to get there!(this is what a missionary taught me) Perdition is for the devil and his angels and followers, people that kill in cold blood, and those that have commited the sin against the Holy Ghost.

I left the church after 2 1/2 years of membership, after finding out the origins of this church; things the missionaries or preisthood never tell, like the alterings of the book of mormon just for example.

This was in 1993 (when I left) and since up until very recently, left me extremely bitter and dis-illusioned with religion, although I still beleived in God during this period of being a fully fledged sinner. I desire to follow the teachings of Jesus and in becoming a Christian, finding a church to join (I was christened C of E as an infant) is not going to be an easy task.

I dont harbour feelings of anger or hate towards the LDS any more, for all their faults and false teaching, there are people within the church who are truly loving and friendly and would do anything for anybody; and this is a good quality for any human to have.

As for JW's, I honestly dont know a lot about this sect, except for the door knocking thing!
Blessings to all.

God is light and in him there is no darkness at all.

 

[Lynn73]

As I adhere to a Christian worldview, and therefore that salvation is through Christ Jesus of the Bible alone, I can only answer that our friends from the Watchtower and Salt Lake City cannot be saved by their Jesuses. Jeses. Jesii. Whatever.

I believe I have to agree. The Jesus of the Bible is the true Jesus and provides true salvation. The question has to be asked that if one doesn't believe in the true Jesus but instead believes in the cult Jesus, can they have true salvation? I really don't think so but that's just my opinion.