Can someone explain Lutheran confession/absolution?

[Tangible]

... But ... the pastor does forgive your sins, especially the ones you have confessed. And the forgiveness he gives you is God's forgiveness, given in the stead and by the command of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[godenver1]

Ok, does it differ to Catholic confession at all?

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Ok, does it differ to Catholic confession at all?

I can't speak for other churches, but it's usually just meeting with the pastor in his office. No secretive little booth. And there's no penance given.

 

[godenver1]

Sorry to 'bump' a relatively old thread, but another question came to me. It's a hypothetical.

Does one have to be a member to ask for, and go to confession?

Could one, say on holidays, or from a different denominational background, all of a sudden ask a Lutheran pastor to hear confession and receive absolution?

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Sorry to 'bump' a relatively old thread, but another question came to me. It's a hypothetical.

Does one have to be a member to ask for, and go to confession?

Could one, say on holidays, or from a different denominational background, all of a sudden ask a Lutheran pastor to hear confession and receive absolution?

Again, speaking for our church and my husband only, ABSOLUTELY.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Sorry to 'bump' a relatively old thread, but another question came to me. It's a hypothetical.

Does one have to be a member to ask for, and go to confession?

Could one, say on holidays, or from a different denominational background, all of a sudden ask a Lutheran pastor to hear confession and receive absolution?

Again, speaking for our church and my husband only, ABSOLUTELY.

Speaking from conversations I have had with a couple of our Pastors, the answer would be a "qualified" yes. One Pastor told me that he would try to discover, through conversation, the motivation for approaching him, rather than one's own Pastor; however he told me that regardless of the reason; he would hear the confession; offer what ever council was appropriate, and give Absolution.

Know that in our tradition, each Divine Service (Mass) begins with a corporate confession and absolution. We do not ask visitors to leave; rather they participate in the confessional rite, and receive holy absolution with everyone else.

Be mindful that neither we, nor the Catholic Church teach that the words of the Absolution forgive sins in and of themselves; rather one needs to be repentant; that is sorry for the sins that they have committed, and recognize the need to amend their life.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Ahem. What Mark said. This is most certainly true.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

So just to clarify:

Lutheran confession differs because the clergyman doesn't forgive the sins of the confessor but declares God's forgiveness?

How much detail must one go into? must we confess (for example) sexual immorality or the specifics therein?

I addressed the last part in a previous post; as to the first bit (not sure why I missed it); it's my understanding that in the Catholic Church the teaching is the same as ours.

From our liturgy:

"Upon your confession, I by virtue of my office, as a called and ordained servant of the Word, announce the grace of God unto all of you, and in the stead and by the command of my Lord Jesus Christ I forgive you all your sins in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit."

 

[godenver1]

Thank you. so according to my understanding:

-At a private confession, one receives the forgiveness of Christ (absolution), the pastor is, under the command of Christ, speaking absolution unto the repentant confessor

-In most cases a Lutheran pastor will hear the confession of anyone whom he sincerely believes wants it?

Just for the record, I'm going on holidays later and this will be an optimal time to experience a Lutheran service. I've been indirectly told (from a Baptist upbringing) not to confess to a priest. However with this understanding that it is Christ's forgiveness I feel as though I may ask for a pastor to me. I'll have to pray on it

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Thank you. so according to my understanding:

-At a private confession, one receives the forgiveness of Christ (absolution), the pastor is, under the command of Christ, speaking absolution unto the repentant confessor

-In most cases a Lutheran pastor will hear the confession of anyone whom he sincerely believes wants it?

Just for the record, I'm going on holidays later and this will be an optimal time to experience a Lutheran service. I've been indirectly told (from a Baptist upbringing) not to confess to a priest. However with this understanding that it is Christ's forgiveness I feel as though I may ask for a pastor to me. I'll have to pray on it

I will pray for you as well. I don't know why they would've said to not confess to a priest - confession IS good for the soul. God's blessings on your journeys.

 

[Tangible]

It's just Baptist Romophobia rearing its ugly head.

 

[MDIVGRAD]

I have read the LC-MS website on this issue but I am still a little confused. My question is ultimately this: For a Christian's sins to be forgiven, must he or she confess them to a pastor and receive absolution? If not, which is to say that our sins can be forgiven simply by confessing them privately without a pastor, then why should we go to confession at all?



I have read several of Luther's writings on this but still need to dig into it deeper. He seems to, at times, contradict himself on this one. Therefore, it would be helpful to have a very simple explanation of it given here.

Justin

Justin,
I did not read any of the responses so far given. It's not about "having" to do anything, but about getting to do something that will enable you to move forward in the grace of God. Confession is good for the soul because in doing so, you recognize before God and the rest of the believers that you are a sinner and because you are a sinner, you don't deserve God's grace through His Son, but the beauty of all this is that you get salvation in spite of your sins. Hearing God's forgiveness from the Pastor's lips as his called and ordained servant in the stead and by the command of Christ forgives you your sins. Its not the Pastor forgiving you, but God through the Pastor announcing that you are clean and that you should go and sin no more. We call this the office of the keys which we find in John 20:23. If you forgive a man his sins, they are forgiven, but if you bind a man to his sin, they are still with him.

Now one can do it in Corporate confession as we do in the first part of our "Divine Service", or it is available from the Pastor in the privacy of his office.

I hope this clears up your question. I do encourage you to read Luther on this as well as Chemnitz and Pieper, or any other church father outside the Roman Catholic faith that is.

 

[MDIVGRAD]

I addressed the last part in a previous post; as to the first bit (not sure why I missed it); it's my understanding that in the Catholic Church the teaching is the same as ours.

From our liturgy:

Read again the quote you put in for the liturgy. Yes the Pastor announces the Grace of God, but he also forgives the sins as he stands in the stead and by the command.

As for the Roman Catholic position, they hold to "doing penance" to show their remorse, but Luther said we must be penitent.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Read again the quote you put in for the liturgy. Yes the Pastor announces the Grace of God, but he also forgives the sins as he stands in the stead and by the command.

As for the Roman Catholic position, they hold to "doing penance" to show their remorse, but Luther said we must be penitent.

"Doing penance", is the only difference.

 

[Athanasias]

Mark is right, penance is the only difference but from a Catholic perspective ones sins are forgiven and eternal punishments remitted/ wiped away at the moment when absolution is given or pronounced (even if penance is never performed by the penitent).

 

[MissingtheMark]

Just for the record, I'm going on holidays later and this will be an optimal time to experience a Lutheran service. I've been indirectly told (from a Baptist upbringing) not to confess to a priest. However with this understanding that it is Christ's forgiveness I feel as though I may ask for a pastor to me. I'll have to pray on it

This thread--and what you said above remind me of something I recently watched (and you can easily find it on Youtube). It was a lecture by Pastor Bryan Wolfmueller (LCMS) on his journey out of evangelicalism and into confessional Lutheranism. He made a point I never considered.

That point was that many churches actually conduct some form of confession and absolution under the term "pastoral counseling." Though no formal confession and absolution takes place, it's not uncommon among many to discuss a problem or particular sins with their pastor. Many times in the meetings, the pastor will respond with the reassurance that their sins have been forgiven, so it ends up being a kind of de facto confession and absolution.

From the gift of our liturgical tradition (grounded thoroughly in God's Word), there is a more solid form of confession and absolution, which ensures that every time a penitent sinner departs, he or she has definitely heard their sins forgiven by Christ's authority.

In my experience, there is little discussion of private C & A in either WELS or LCMS these days. I could be wrong, but it seems that WELS is trending towards the pastoral counseling model while some in LCMS are trending toward traditional private Confession and Absolution. (There's even a local LCMS parish whose pastor holds set weekly hours for it.) I have no insight on ELCA in this regard.

 

[godenver1]

I will pray for you as well. I don't know why they would've said to not confess to a priest - confession IS good for the soul. God's blessings on your journeys.

Oh it's done with good intentions, whether right or wrong. It comes from believing only Christ (read: God) can forgive sins, and is most likely born out of a misunderstanding of Roman Catholic theology. For what it's worth, when this was said I don't think the person rejects Catholics as Christians or anything like that.

 

[godenver1]

Mark is right, penance is the only difference but from a Catholic perspective ones sins are forgiven and eternal punishments remitted/ wiped away at the moment when absolution is given or pronounced (even if penance is never performed by the penitent).

Interesting. Hypothetically, if one would receive absolution from confession and then instantaneously die, would that person go to purgatory (according to the Roman Catholic teaching)?

 

[godenver1]

This thread--and what you said above remind me of something I recently watched (and you can easily find it on Youtube). It was a lecture by Pastor Bryan Wolfmueller (LCMS) on his journey out of evangelicalism and into confessional Lutheranism. He made a point I never considered.

That point was that many churches actually conduct some form of confession and absolution under the term "pastoral counseling." Though no formal confession and absolution takes place, it's not uncommon among many to discuss a problem or particular sins with their pastor. Many times in the meetings, the pastor will respond with the reassurance that their sins have been forgiven, so it ends up being a kind of de facto confession and absolution.

From the gift of our liturgical tradition (grounded thoroughly in God's Word), there is a more solid form of confession and absolution, which ensures that every time a penitent sinner departs, he or she has definitely heard their sins forgiven by Christ's authority.

In my experience, there is little discussion of private C & A in either WELS or LCMS these days. I could be wrong, but it seems that WELS is trending towards the pastoral counseling model while some in LCMS are trending toward traditional private Confession and Absolution. (There's even a local LCMS parish whose pastor holds set weekly hours for it.) I have no insight on ELCA in this regard.

Again, very interesting and not something I probably would of considered

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

This thread--and what you said above remind me of something I recently watched (and you can easily find it on Youtube). It was a lecture by Pastor Bryan Wolfmueller (LCMS) on his journey out of evangelicalism and into confessional Lutheranism. He made a point I never considered.

That point was that many churches actually conduct some form of confession and absolution under the term "pastoral counseling." Though no formal confession and absolution takes place, it's not uncommon among many to discuss a problem or particular sins with their pastor. Many times in the meetings, the pastor will respond with the reassurance that their sins have been forgiven, so it ends up being a kind of de facto confession and absolution.

From the gift of our liturgical tradition (grounded thoroughly in God's Word), there is a more solid form of confession and absolution, which ensures that every time a penitent sinner departs, he or she has definitely heard their sins forgiven by Christ's authority.

In my experience, there is little discussion of private C & A in either WELS or LCMS these days. I could be wrong, but it seems that WELS is trending towards the pastoral counseling model while some in LCMS are trending toward traditional private Confession and Absolution. (There's even a local LCMS parish whose pastor holds set weekly hours for it.) I have no insight on ELCA in this regard.

In Lutheran Church Canada, there was a short while ago a resolution at the Synod Convention to encourage private confession. Certainly, we Lutherans are all instructed in the virtues of the "Office of the Keys and Confession" when we study the catechism. In our Congregation this is put to practical use, as it is the practice that one privately confesses prior to Confirmation.