Can atheists pray?

[wonderment]

What do people think about the possibility of atheists having a spiritual life and praying?

The whole theory and practice is set out at the atheistprayer.blogspot.com website. I'm also including the summary from a different site.

“Atheist prayer is a spiritual practice developed by D. Midbar. Midbar argues that all human beings have spiritual needs, and that prayer is the universal vehicle for the expression of these needs. To deny such needs is to lead a diminished life.

Atheists are not prevented from accessing human spirituality because they have concluded that God does not exist. On the contrary, they are in a position to have deeper and more authentic religious experience because they have freed their minds from theistic myths and irrational beliefs.

Midbar suggests that many great theological thinkers of the past may have been "closet atheists," prevented from declaring their true beliefs for fear of reprisals by religious authorities. Midbar quotes Christian mystics like Meister Eckhart and "The Cloud of Unknowing" as evidence of atheistic thinking within the prayer tradition.

Midbar's text is an explanation of the paradox of atheistic prayer. Midbar acknowledges that "atheist prayer" may strike the reader as an oxymoron but upon deeper examination is a consistent philosophy that provides a valid spiritual paradigm for the 21st century and beyond."

 

[Blackguard_]

Problem is, if these are Materialist Athiests as is most liley by far, they can't have ANY spirituality since they have no spirit.

Athiest prayer boils down to knowlingly talking to an imaginary freind or to your plants or something, so much for "more authentic religious experience because they have freed their minds from theistic myths and irrational beliefs."


I don't see why an athiest coldn't pray, but I also don't see how it;s not either madness or just talking things out to no one in particular, which is more like a session with a shrink than praying.

What kind of prayers are we talking about anyway? They have nothing to praise and no one who will grant them requests.

 

[Hnefi]

Since becoming an atheist, I don't see the need for praying. It will do me no good, so why do it? Instead, when facing difficult situations in which I am very nervous or scared, I simply turn that fear on its head and realize that the situation won't improve if I go around worrying about it. I use the fear and turn it into resolve. "I'm worried about this" is exchanged for "I will get through this".

I have been surprised of how easy it is to turn fear into resolve. The problem lies in keeping it that way.

 

[ena33]

On another forum I read that some atheists prayed but it was only to cement their disbelief

 

[wonderment]

Problem is, if these are Materialist Athiests as is most liley by far, they can't have ANY spirituality since they have no spirit.

Athiest prayer boils down to knowlingly talking to an imaginary freind or to your plants or something, so much for "more authentic religious experience because they have freed their minds from theistic myths and irrational beliefs."


I don't see why an athiest coldn't pray, but I also don't see how it;s not either madness or just talking things out to no one in particular, which is more like a session with a shrink than praying.

What kind of prayers are we talking about anyway? They have nothing to praise and no one who will grant them requests.

Well, I think you have to read the Midbar text to understand what s/he means by prayer. Closer to Christian contemplation perhaps and other devotional exercises.

 

[wonderment]

Since becoming an atheist, I don't see the need for praying. It will do me no good, so why do it?

Read the Midbar text or the writing of Dan Cupitt. Both address atheists and write from an atheistic point of view.

 

[wonderment]

On another forum I read that some atheists prayed but it was only to cement their disbelief

Funny, but not really accurate. Atheists should be respected as religious people, perhaps more religious than "believers."

 

[The Nihilist]

Yeah, I'm going to need more convincing

 

[Eudaimonist]

What do people think about the possibility of atheists having a spiritual life and praying?

I have a spiritual life, but we probably mean different things by the word "spiritual".

I'll pass this information on to the Fellowship of Reason. Martin Cower, the founder of the group, has been promoting spiritual exercises for some time that are perhaps similar to Midbar's "atheist prayer". The seed idea comes from ancient Stoic practices of personal contemplation.

I bet the word "prayer" will tweak many atheists and drive them away from the concept. Call it "atheist meditation" or "atheist contemplation", and the allegeric reaction might be avoided. In any case, I wish Midbar good luck.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[ExistencePrecedesEssence]

I have a spiritual life, but we probably mean different things by the word "spiritual".

I'll pass this information on to the Fellowship of Reason. Martin Cower, the founder of the group, has been promoting spiritual exercises for some time that are perhaps similar to Midbar's "atheist prayer". The seed idea comes from ancient Stoic practices of personal contemplation.

I bet the word "prayer" will tweak many atheists and drive them away from the concept. Call it "atheist meditation" or "atheist contemplation", and the allegeric reaction might be avoided. In any case, I wish Midbar good luck.


eudaimonia,

Mark

Would you compair it to Descartes and Socrates who meditated all day? Descartes was said to write rarely, but when he did it would almost always occur after a period of deep thinking, and he would only write fervently for a few pages and then quit for a number of weeks. If it is this same method i can find it completely reasonable.

 

[IzzyPop]

Atheist Prayer that I found a few weeks ago. I'm thinking of whipping it out for the next family gathering...
Let us take responsibility for our own actions, inactions, strengths and frailties and not project them onto ghosts, spirits, stars, portents and gods unseen.
Let us have the courage to accept that one person's faith is another person's bloody-minded pig-headed refusal to accept the obvious.
Let us have the courage to accept that the person at the front of all crowds, including this one, doesn't know all the answers.
Let us have the wisdom to accept that if our ancestors had fared differently in wars our communities would be holding different absurdities up as sacred truths, and the willingness to accept those absurdities would be seen as the badge of social trustworthiness or even the right to be allowed to draw breath.
Let us accept that the difference between a prophet and a madman is not what they say but whether the crowd accepts the story and tells their children to believe it.
Let us have the courage to accept that wanting to believe in something with every fibre of our being does not and cannot make it true.
Truth needs no help, no believers, no bowed heads and no amens.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Would you compair it to Descartes and Socrates who meditated all day? Descartes was said to write rarely, but when he did it would almost always occur after a period of deep thinking, and he would only write fervently for a few pages and then quit for a number of weeks.

Yes, it is much like that.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Eudaimonist]

Atheist Prayer that I found a few weeks ago. I'm thinking of whipping it out for the next family gathering...
Let us take responsibility for our own actions, inactions, strengths and frailties and not project them onto ghosts, spirits, stars, portents and gods unseen.
Let us have the courage to accept that one person's faith is another person's bloody-minded pig-headed refusal to accept the obvious.
Let us have the courage to accept that the person at the front of all crowds, including this one, doesn't know all the answers.
Let us have the wisdom to accept that if our ancestors had fared differently in wars our communities would be holding different absurdities up as sacred truths, and the willingness to accept those absurdities would be seen as the badge of social trustworthiness or even the right to be allowed to draw breath.
Let us accept that the difference between a prophet and a madman is not what they say but whether the crowd accepts the story and tells their children to believe it.
Let us have the courage to accept that wanting to believe in something with every fibre of our being does not and cannot make it true.
Truth needs no help, no believers, no bowed heads and no amens.

A little confrontational, but that is an excellent prayer!


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[ExistencePrecedesEssence]

I find it reasonable in that sense then.

 

[wonderment]

>>"That God does not exist, I cannot deny, That my whole being cries out for God I cannot forget. ">>

That quote is definitely consistent with the writing of Midbar and Cupitt, and I think Paul Tillich as well, who was an precursor of atheist spirituality. Tillich in the 1950s talked about "ultimate concerns" as a spiritual point of departure shared by believers and atheists.

 

[wonderment]

I look forward to checking out the Fellowship of Reason. Thanks.

 

[Gracchus]

I became an atheist in the second grade. (Of course, I was smart enough to conceal this epiphany.) Nevertheless I was forced to pray, so I know that atheists can pray.

But if God is omniscient, knowing our hearts, minds, and needs, and if God is benevolent and omnipotent, able and willing to meet our needs ... Why Pray? Does he want us to beg and grovel?

 

[ExistencePrecedesEssence]

>>"That God does not exist, I cannot deny, That my whole being cries out for God I cannot forget. ">>

That quote is definitely consistent with the writing of Midbar and Cupitt, and I think Paul Tillich as well, who was an precursor of atheist spirituality. Tillich in the 1950s talked about "ultimate concerns" as a spiritual point of departure shared by believers and atheists.

It actually concerns oneself with the emberassment that god does not exist, and that the abandonment is something we would rather avoid.

 

[DailyBlessings]

Atheists have far more access to the divine than they realize- I see no reason at all why they or anyone would be unable to pray, or even deeply meditate, if they so choose.

 

[IzzyPop]

A little confrontational, but that is an excellent prayer!


eudaimonia,

Mark

I'm an atheist on a Christian board. Confrontation is fun!!