Calendar of Hillel

[gadar perets]

If I lock in Nisan 16 with Sunday, then it freezes ever other date. If I lock in First fruits with Sunday "after the Sabbath", then Passover can happen any day of the week.

Abib 16 does not always fall on a Sunday. What do you mean by "freezes every other date"?

Why can't Passover fall on any day of the week? Because man says it can't?

 

[gadar perets]

As you may already be aware Yahweh's Torah instructions and the actual Passover timeline doesn't always parallel or juxtaposition with today's Rabbinic Judaism's timeline for the days of the Feast of Passover and Unleavened Bread.

I don't know what you are referring to.

Don't be too hasty to conclude that just because someone disagrees with you they are wrong

It is not a matter of disagreeing with me, but with Torah. The lambs were killed on the 14th, not the 13th. Therefore, Yeshua was killed on the 14th, not the 13th. Provide your Scriptural evidence supporting the 13th.

 

[AbbaLove]

Abib 16 does not always fall on a Sunday. What do you mean by "freezes every other date"?

Why can't Passover fall on any day of the week? Because man says it can't?

visionary said: ↑
If I lock in Nisan 16 with Sunday, then it freezes ever other date. If I lock in First fruits with Sunday "after the Sabbath", then Passover can happen any day of the week.​

Please pay attention! Vis said, "then Passover can happen any day of the week." Instead of being so intent on always finding fault to the point of misinterpretation. Try to be open to the possibility that any one that differs with you is NOT automatically wrong.

 

[visionary]

The 15th is Sunday, and no regular work was to be done that day ALSO. The Women did not attend Christ,s grave that Sunday, because it was against the law.
The Passover and the Festival of Unleavened Bread
4 “‘These are the Lord’s appointed festivals, the sacred assemblies you are to proclaim at their appointed times: 5 The Lord’s Passover begins at twilight on the fourteenth day of the first month. 6 On the fifteenth day of that month the Lord’s Festival of Unleavened Bread begins; for seven days you must eat bread made without yeast. 7 On the first day hold a sacred assembly and do no regular work.

On the first day of the Festival of Unleavened Bread is a Sabbath, the "high day"

John 19:31 Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day, that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.... 42 Therefore on account of the Jewish day of preparation, because the tomb was nearby, they laid Yeshua there.

Luke 23:52…this man (Joseph of Arimathea) went to Pilate and asked for the body of Yeshua. 53 And he took it down and wrapped it in a linen cloth, and laid Him in a tomb cut into the rock, where no one had ever lain. 54 And it was the preparation day, and the Sabbath was about to begin.

After this Sabbath [first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread] had passed, you have preparation day for the weekly Sabbath. The women could not obtain the necessary items to properly anoint His body and bury Yeshua. However, once the High Sabbath was over, the women could buy what they needed for this task.

Mark 16:1 And when the Sabbath was over, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, bought spices, that they might come and anoint Him.

On the day after the High Sabbath, the women purchased the spices and spent the day preparing them to anoint Yeshua’s body. However, they were once again delayed, this time by the weekly Sabbath.

Luke 23:55 Now the women who had come with Him out of Galilee followed after, and saw the tomb and how His body was laid. 56 And they returned and prepared spices and perfumes. And on the Sabbath they rested according to the commandment. 1 But on the first day of the week, at early dawn, they came to the tomb, bringing the spices which they had prepared.

 

[gadar perets]

visionary said: ↑
If I lock in Nisan 16 with Sunday, then it freezes ever other date. If I lock in First fruits with Sunday "after the Sabbath", then Passover can happen any day of the week.​

Please pay attention! Vis said, "then Passover can happen any day of the week." Instead of being so intent on always finding fault to the point of misinterpretation. Try to be open to the possibility that any one that differs with you is NOT automatically wrong.

I was asking her questions to clarify her position. Is that no longer permitted on this forum? It is obvious you have something against me based on other discussions we had on theology. So your reaction to me questioning here is naturally adversarial.

 

[AbbaLove]

I don't know what you are referring to.

Please pay closer attention!

It is not a matter of disagreeing with me, but with Torah. The lambs were killed on the 14th, not the 13th. Therefore, Yeshua was killed on the 14th, not the 13th. Provide your Scriptural evidence supporting the 13th.

The lamb(s) were killed and roasted on the Day of Preparation, 13 Nissan and more likely eaten sometime before the end of 13 Nisan and into the beginning of 14 Nisan.

No, i'm actually less adversarial than are you. Remember, when i previously posted at the end of a lengthy thread that you have a habit of misrepresenting member posts, saying unkind words, and making false accusations. When you come up against someone that can hold their own and don't back down you resort to misrepresentation, unkind words and false accusations.

So, you believe the people worked/labored on 14 Nissan killing and roasting the lambs with fire. What do you think the Day of Preparation meant if not to prepare for the Lord's Last Supper that begin toward the end of 13 Nissan and continued into the beginning of 14 Nissan.

 

[Bob S]

No, it isn't, but the NC isn't in effect yet. If it were, we would never sin.

Anyway, you are teaching your beliefs in the wrong section. If you wish to debate, you need to find a neutral sub-forum and start a new thread.

Thanks for your advice. I didn't realize this forum has such restrictions until I just read the rules. I sadly will leave and not come back. The reason I am sad is because of your opening paragraph. I leave you with 2Cor 3:7-18. May G-d bless you in every way.

 

[visionary]

Tuesday night – Passover Seder (meal), prayer in Gethsemane, arrested, brought before the Jews
Wednesday morning – before Pilate, on the cross by 9 a.m., dead by 3 p.m??
Wednesday night – Yeshua in the tomb – first night, High Sabbath begins
Thursday – Yeshua in the tomb – first day, High Sabbath, First day of Feast of Unleavened Bread
Thursday night – Yeshua in the tomb, second night, end of High Sabbath
Friday – Yeshua in the tomb, second day, preparation day, women bought & prepared spices
Friday night – Yeshua in the tomb, third night, weekly Sabbath begins
Saturday – Yeshua in the tomb third day, weekly Sabbath
Saturday Night – Yeshua NOT IN THE TOMB, End of weekly Sabbath, women come just before dawn to find Him gone.

 

[AbbaLove]

On the first day of the Festival of Unleavened Bread is a Sabbath, the "high day"

Where is the scripture in Matthew, Mark, Luke or John that supports this view? It's more likely that a High Shabbat was observed when 14 Nissan occurred on the 7th day of the week. However, that timeline does allow for "on the third day" and "after three days"

 

[AbbaLove]

Tuesday night – Passover Seder (meal), prayer in Gethsemane, arrested, brought before the Jews
Wednesday morning – before Pilate, on the cross by 9 a.m., dead by 3 p.m??
Wednesday night – Yeshua in the tomb – first night, High Sabbath begins
Thursday – Yeshua in the tomb – first day, High Sabbath, First day of Feast of Unleavened Bread
Thursday night – Yeshua in the tomb, second night, end of High Sabbath
Friday – Yeshua in the tomb, second day, preparation day, women bought & prepared spices
Friday night – Yeshua in the tomb, third night, weekly Sabbath begins
Saturday – Yeshua in the tomb third day, weekly Sabbath
Saturday Night – Yeshua NOT IN THE TOMB, End of weekly Sabbath, women come just before dawn to find Him gone.

I can't help but smile at your timeline reckoning. In the past year(s) that we've gone round and round with plausible scenarios it becomes apparent how each of us is so set on our day/way of reckoning events (e.g. First Fruits). Just wish you wouldn't use only Roman day names.

If the opportunity ever avails itself i would give you a big hug. I bet you and your hubby have some delightful times ribbing each other

Enjoy The Best Hanukkah Ever
​

 

[gadar perets]

The lamb(s) were killed and roasted on the Day of Preparation, 13 Nissan and more likely eaten sometime before the end of 13 Nisan and into the beginning of 14 Nisan.

I'm still awaiting your Scriptural proof for this belief.

So, you believe the people worked/labored on 14 Nissan killing and roasting the lambs with fire. What do you think the Day of Preparation meant if not to prepare for the Lord's Last Supper that begin toward the end of 13 Nissan and continued into the beginning of 14 Nissan.

Of course they worked/labored on the 14th. The 14th is NOT a Sabbath/holy day. The 15th is the holy day (Leviticus 23:6-7; Numbers 28:17-18).

 

[gadar perets]

Thanks for your advice. I didn't realize this forum has such restrictions until I just read the rules. I sadly will leave and not come back. The reason I am sad is because of your opening paragraph. I leave you with 2Cor 3:7-18. May G-d bless you in every way.

Please know that there are some on this forum, such as I, that do believe the NC is in effect for those in Messiah Yeshua. Also, if you desire to continue our Sabbath discussion in private, feel free to PM me.

 

[visionary]

[QUOTE="AbbaLove]

Enjoy The Best Hanukkah Ever
​

[/QUOTE]

 

[CherubRam]

The 15th is Sunday, and no regular work was to be done that day ALSO. The Women did not attend Christ,s grave that Sunday, because it was against the law.
The Passover and the Festival of Unleavened Bread
4 “‘These are the Lord’s appointed festivals, the sacred assemblies you are to proclaim at their appointed times: 5 The Lord’s Passover begins at twilight on the fourteenth day of the first month. 6 On the fifteenth day of that month the Lord’s Festival of Unleavened Bread begins; for seven days you must eat bread made without yeast. 7 On the first day hold a sacred assembly and do no regular work.

The first day of the week is Sunday. Biblical Calendar, not Civil Hebrew Calendar.

 

[Mockingbird0]

I was hoping we could discuss the calendar...How accurate is the calendar of Hillel?

One way of evaluating the calendar's accuracy is by checking the day of the month on which the full moon falls. In an average synodic lunar month of 29.530589 days, if the first day of the month begins exactly 24 hours after the average conjunction, then the average full moon will fall on the 14th day of the month, closer to the end of the day than to the beginning. If the 1st day of the lunar month begins a few hours earlier than exactly 24 hours after the average conjunction, the average full moon will fall later in the 14th day, or early on the 15th. If the 1st day of the lunar month begins some hours later than 24 hours after the average conjunction, then the average full moon will fall so much earlier on the 14th day as the 1st day began later than 24 hours after the average conjunction. A very late beginning of the 1st day of the lunar month might bring the average full moon to fall late on the 13th day of the lunar month. One can check how closely the Rabbinic calendar's months come to this idealized average situatiion. By way of comparison, the same is done for the Gregorian lunar calendar.

Year        Full moon       Day in Rabbinic Nisan        Day in Gregorian
           (UT)             on which astronomical        Nisan or Iyar
                            full moon fell               on which astronomical
                                                         full moon fell

2000        4/18                13                        14
2001        4/8                 15                        14
2002        3/28                15                        14
2003        4/16                14                        14
2004        4/5                 14                        14
2005        4/24                15                        15 (Iyar)
2006        4/13                15                        14
2007        4/2                 14                        14
2008        4/20                15                        14 (Iyar)
2009        4/9                 15                        13
2010        3/30                15                        14
2011        4/18                14                        15
2012        4/6                 14                        13
2013        3/27                16                        14
2014        4/15                15                        15
2015        4/4                 15                        15
2016        4/22                15                        15 (Iyar)

It can be seen that the Rabbinic calendar manages to have its full moon on the 14th or 15th day most of the time, as expected, with the 15th occurring more than any other date. This suggests that the Rabbinic calendar's Paschal lunar month runs slightly ahead of an average lunar month that begins 24 hours after the average conjunction.

 

[Steve Petersen]

The ruling of the elders is binding on the Jewish community.

If they are slightly off on their calendar, THEY bear the sin, not the people.

At least the Jewish community is together (barring the heretical Karaites) and celebrating TOGETHER. A far cry from the Christian world, each denomination with it's own holidays.

 

[gadar perets]

It can be seen that the Rabbinic calendar manages to have its full moon on the 14th or 15th day most of the time, as expected, with the 15th occurring more than any other date. This suggests that the Rabbinic calendar's Paschal lunar month runs slightly ahead of an average lunar month that begins 24 hours after the average conjunction.

There are also times when the Rabbinic Paschal month is a full month later than the sighted moon calendar. There have been years when the barley was harvest ready, but an Adar II was added.
Also, the Rabbinic calendar will not allow Yom Kippur to fall on a Friday or Sunday. The Almighty never decreed such a thing. The sighted moon calendar allows all holy days to fall wherever Yahweh wants them to fall.

 

[gadar perets]

The ruling of the elders is binding on the Jewish community.

But it is not binding on the Messianic community. Yeshua taught us it is more important to keep the Almighty's commandments than the traditions of men.

 

[visionary]

The first day of the week is Sunday. Biblical Calendar, not Civil Hebrew Calendar.

So what is the first day of the week for the civil Hebrew Calendar?

 

[Steve Petersen]

There are also times when the Rabbinic Paschal month is a full month later than the sighted moon calendar. There have been years when the barley was harvest ready, but an Adar II was added.
Also, the Rabbinic calendar will not allow Yom Kippur to fall on a Friday or Sunday. The Almighty never decreed such a thing. The sighted moon calendar allows all holy days to fall wherever Yahweh wants them to fall.

Read this:

The Biblical Basis for Rabbinic Authority