Calculating Information Entropy

[Deamiter]

But if it didn't apply to DNA then it would never break down and we wouldn't have to worry about wrinkle cream...

Again, that's a bit of a non-sequitor. In that case, cells are damaged due to radiation from the sun. In the other case, you're talking about mutations between parent and child organisms.

Either way, since you have not yet defined information, you haven't shown how a mutation (any mutation) affects a genome's information content. Are the onset of wrinkles an indication of less information? Is this defined as number of genes, length of genome or what?

 

[shernren]

Unless of course we only die because of a genetically programmed instruction... But aren't there alternatives to that theory like radiation, etc.?

Actually, cellular apoptosis is genetically programmed, AFAIK.

 

[Silent Bob]

Call me an ignoramus but I think that the coherency of information is dependant on information entropy. As you already stated, coherency is not the same as entropy. Take the following strings:

aaaaa -> low information entropy, no meaning

palpe -> higher information entropy, no meaning

apple -> nearly the same level of information entropy, but it now has meaning.

My point? If 2LoT can cause change in information entropy, it can also change coherency.

If you wish to apply the 2nd LoT on information system then one can say that a message cannot gain information content during transit it can only lose.

However this cannot be applied in biology. The problem with biological systems is that errors that delete or disable genes can offer an advantage (gain but not in information as defined by info theory) and correct transmission (errorless copying) is actually destructive to a species (if all copies of a virus are clones then a single vaccine can make it extinct).

Also your analysis of the messages aaaaa, apple etc is doomed. The only message containing information in English is apple (the other two are errors which are to be discarded). If however all messages could be meaningful and you used the English language then aaaaa has obviously the highest information content since in all the English language there is no occurrence (except in the imaginary word aaaaa) of three consecutive a's. There is a lot more to message entropy and information than the number of bits; probabilities and correlation of symbols play a HUGE role as well. In fact the redundancy of the English language due to non-equiprobable occurrence of symbols and correlation is 47%.

 

[Assyrian]

Isn't there a circular argument here?

ID identifies genetics as Information where only the original information counts and any changes to the message become non-information. It then looks at various mathematical studies of this kind of information, which look at the way information in a message is either transferred or lost. It then concludes that genetic information is either transferred fully or lost through mutation, so you cannot get new information or an increase in genetic information.

But this was the assumption made at the beginning when they defined genetics as 'Information'.

 

[gluadys]

Isn't there a circular argument here?

ID identifies genetics as Information where only the original information counts and any changes to the message become non-information. It then looks at various mathematical studies of this kind of information, which look at the way information in a message is either transferred or lost. It then concludes that genetic information is either transferred fully or lost through mutation, so you cannot get new information or an increase in genetic information.

But this was the assumption made at the beginning when they defined genetics as 'Information'.

Not only that. The original information is considered to be ideal and with DNA there is no reason to assume that. It could be that the change improves the message, and it can certainly add to it.