Discussion Cakes,lawsuits,and a Holy Spirit filled life.

[StephanieSomer]

If they don't bake a cake for gays, neither should they for an adulterous remarriage. They'd first ask the people if they had a Biblical reason and what about people marrying an unbeliever? Unbiblical, no cake for you!

By Scripture, the only remarriage that is NOT adulterous is one in which the former spouse is dead. Divorce is allowed for certain circumstances, but remarriage if the former spouse is alive is, and always has been, adultery. The Church is full of such adulterers.

 

[StephanieSomer]

Oh, I didn't miss it at all. You took what someone said and twisted their words to make it sound like they said something they really didn't say. I guess that's easier than coming up with a valid argument, but that doesn't justify twisting someone's words.

Yes. you did. What you are accusing me of doing is exactly what I was addressing. I did so by blatantly repeating the exact same logic to which I was responding. It went right over your head. Go back and read the full context of what I said, and what I was responding to.

 

[StephanieSomer]

The salvation of those in the flock is never for us to judge. Behavior yes, but judgment of salvation belongs to God alone. Be careful when making judgment on other's salvation, even inside the flock.

I didn't.

 

[briquest]

By Scripture, the only remarriage that is NOT adulterous is one in which the former spouse is dead. Divorce is allowed for certain circumstances, but remarriage if the former spouse is alive is, and always has been, adultery. The Church is full of such adulterers.

Matthew 19:9 King James Version (KJV)
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

1 Corinthians 7:15 King James Version (KJV)
15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

 

[All4Christ]

I didn't.

I meant to caution against it - not to say you did or didn't do that. The word of caution is for all of us, myself included.

Apologies for any misunderstanding on my part as well.

 

[StephanieSomer]

Matthew 19:9 King James Version (KJV)
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

1 Corinthians 7:15 King James Version (KJV)
15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

And what does the last phrase of the first quote say? "whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery."

Also, please note Rom 7:2,3

"For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the law of her husband. So then if, while her husband lives, she marries another man, she will be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she has married another man."

Like I said, divorce may be allowed in some circumstances. But Scripture nowhere allows remarriage while the former spouse is alive. You now have two explicit commands prohibiting it. Both from the NT. One from Christ, and one from Paul. And the Church is full of people who ignore these commands and justify their adultery.

 

[Alithis]

By Scripture, the only remarriage that is NOT adulterous is one in which the former spouse is dead. Divorce is allowed for certain circumstances, but remarriage if the former spouse is alive is, and always has been, adultery. The Church is full of such adulterers.

you should start a thread on that topic ..
here is why ... For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. - interesting is it not ?
for on another topic, like say, .. observing the Sabbath ,many will cry out ., "But we are not under the law ... "

well worth a new thread topic

 

[Messy]

By Scripture, the only remarriage that is NOT adulterous is one in which the former spouse is dead. Divorce is allowed for certain circumstances, but remarriage if the former spouse is alive is, and always has been, adultery. The Church is full of such adulterers.

Lol no cake for anybody then!

 

[Alithis]

Lol no cake for anybody then!

 

[StephanieSomer]

you should start a thread on that topic ..
here is why ... For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. - interesting is it not ?
for on another topic, like say, .. observing the Sabbath ,many will cry out ., "But we are not under the law ... "

well worth a new thread topic

Perhaps. But, "the law" which is referred to in the verse from Romans isn't the Law of Moses, which is true we are not under. "The law" referenced in the Romans verse is the law of her husband. In other words, the law of marriage. The taking of vows institutes a law that is in effect until the death of the spouse. That law has never been repealed, rescinded, or otherwise rendered inactive for anyone. The Sabbath law IS from the Law of Moses, which has been satisfied in Christ.

 

[Farm Truck]

IMO- the correct response from this shop would have been to treat them as any other lost individuals in this world

Some of us have a conscience that agrees with God's Word which teaches we should not walk in agreement with the world, so they have every right to walk according to their conscience.

I probably would have agreed to do the cake and then misplace the order and forget all about it on purpose.

You cannot sue someone for forgetting something no more than you can convict a politician who forgets.

Or, you could bake a cake and accidentally spill laxative in the mix
C'mon now, that was funny!

 

[StephanieSomer]

Some of us have a conscience that agrees with God's Word which teaches we should not walk in agreement with the world, so they have every right to walk according to their conscience.

I probably would have agreed to do the cake and then misplace the order and forget all about it on purpose.

You cannot sue someone for forgetting something no more than you can convict a politician who forgets.

Or, you could bake a cake and accidentally spill laxative in the mix
C'mon now, that was funny!

Which would be dishonest. That's called being double-minded. And it is the one sin that is mentioned more than any other in the Scripture. In the list of the 7 things that the Lord hates, given in Proverbs, deception is listed in various ways 3 times. At it's core, it is a lie. So, that is NOT a conscience that agrees with God's Word. That is a conscience that operates EXACTLY as the world does.

 

[Farm Truck]

When I find out they are gay, I could always tell them "I'm sorry, I have a family emergency and we have to close down temporarily" so they'll go someplace else.

That's not lying because it is a family emergency to close the shop so we don't have to cater a gay wedding... lest we lose the shop and become homeless.

There! That's a great work around the problem cause you know David would never serve those uncircumcised Philistines now would he? I tro not!

 

[StephanieSomer]

When I find out they are gay, I could always tell them "I'm sorry, I have a family emergency and we have to close down temporarily" so they'll go someplace else.

That's not lying because it is a family emergency to close the shop so we don't have to cater a gay wedding... lest we lose the shop and become homeless.

There! That's a great work around the problem cause you know David would never serve those uncircumcised Philistines now would he? I tro not!

It's still a lie. No doubt you'll continue to deny that.

 

[Alithis]

When I find out they are gay, I could always tell them "I'm sorry, I have a family emergency and we have to close down temporarily" so they'll go someplace else.

That's not lying because it is a family emergency to close the shop so we don't have to cater a gay wedding... lest we lose the shop and become homeless.

There! That's a great work around the problem cause you know David would never serve those uncircumcised Philistines now would he? I tro not!

ummm ..never mind steph said it lol .methinks you need some fine tuning on the 'ole moral compass there

 

[Farm Truck]

No, actually if I'm running a business and I detect danger to that business I have the right to decide what constitutes an "family emergency" and what does not since I'm leading my business.

I'm not required by God to share all of my thoughts with others, meaning I do not have to explain to the gay peoples WHY there is a family emergency and we have to close temporarily.

Your moral compass is broken if you choose to be in agreement with gay peoples getting married because serving them in that capacity is a measure of agreement and God said those that are friendly with the world are enemies of God (James 4:4) and God is not going to allow His enemies in to Heaven.

So, before you walk in agreement with gay peoples and embrace their lifestyle as being A-OK, you might want to consider that God rejects this lifestyle as being an obamanation as there will be no gay peoples in Heaven.

 

[All4Christ]

No, actually if I'm running a business and I detect danger to that business I have the right to decide what constitutes an "family emergency" and what does not since I'm leading my business.

I'm not required by God to share all of my thoughts with others, meaning I do not have to explain to the gay peoples WHY there is a family emergency and we have to close temporarily.

Your moral compass is broken if you choose to be in agreement with gay peoples getting married because serving them in that capacity is a measure of agreement and God said those that are friendly with the world are enemies of God (James 4:4) and God is not going to allow His enemies in to Heaven.

So, before you walk in agreement with gay peoples and embrace their lifestyle as being A-OK, you might want to consider that God rejects this lifestyle as being an obamanation as there will be no gay peoples in Heaven.

I believe homosexuality is wrong, but to say there is no hope for someone who identified themself as homosexual is the same as saying there is no hope for someone who is an alcoholic. The temptation is not a sin. The acting upon it is. Secondly, Christ never gave the permission to others to live a sinful life, but he didn't shy away from reaching out to the meanest, lowest, and sinful people in earth. You can reach out to others without being ' of this world'. And I seriously doubt that everyone who makes a cake for someone who is gay necessarily believes that it is A-OK, nor do they necessarily avoid saying that. Third, Christ is merciful and just - and will forgive those that repent of their sins, up until the 11th hour. Those of us who have been Christians for years are no better than those who are Christians for an hour before the judgment day.

I don't think it should be wrong for people to not serve a wedding cake for events they disagree with, as I said above. It is extremely difficult to be consistent with all sins however. That doesn't mean that I condone those sins - far from it!

I will say the same thing to you as I would to some others on the opposite side. Love will get you much further than separating yourself from the world. Live in the world, but not of it, yes. However, remember that God wants us all to be in union with Him, and avoiding people because they are sinners will not help that cause.

Love others, don't condone sin No matter how small or big (it really is the same damage done spiritually), and understand that Christ did exactly that - bend down to pick up the fallen and instruct them to sin no more. Those of us with no sin are the only ones who Christ said to condemn the people of their salvation or lack thereof (throwing the first stone). Otherwise, judge sins but not people. The cliche phrase has a point to it...love the sinner, hate the sin. Just make sure that the loving comes along with it.

 

[Messy]

Oh no not that discussion again. You're absolutely r

Or, you could bake a cake and accidentally spill laxative in the mix
C'mon now, that was funny!

That is not funny.

 

[Aldebaran]

It's still a lie. No doubt you'll continue to deny that.

So what's the best solution as a Christian? Go against his own conscience and cater to a homosexual wedding even if his own conscience says to him, "This is wrong, and I shouldn't have anything to do with it"? Is that how Christians are expected to live according to other Christians? It may be what the world wants from us, but I don't think Christ told us to live according to the world's standards.

 

[Aldebaran]

Oh no not that discussion again. You're absolutely r

That is not funny.

LOL! Oh yes it is!