Brain Disappoints Evolutionary Thoughts

[lithium.]

A good tip is to always back up your claims.

Yes always a good tip.

 

[ikester7579]

Originally posted by Arikay
I would say that I dont know, Since Im here to learn, why dont you tell me.

A good tip is to always back up your claims.

 

O, but I thought yall knew it all. And don't kid me about learning. That's not what your here for. In fact, tell me what you learned here. I bet it's short and very demeaning of everyone that's christain here. Including the one's who run this website. So common lets here it.

 

 

[lithium.]

Originally posted by ikester7579
 

O, but I thought yall knew it all. And don't kid me about learning. That's not what your here for. In fact, tell me what you learned here. I bet it's short and very demeaning of everyone that's christain here. Including the one's who run this website. So common lets here it.

 

What is your problem?

 

[Arikay]

Nope, I dont know everything. Ill be the first one to say that. Guess what, I also dont think my religion is the One, Single, correct religion, however, thats a thing for another thread.

Yep im here to learn. Both about christianity, and creationism. Ive been reading my bible, and guess what, I didnt burst into flames when i touched it. and nope, its not going to convert me, im rather happy where im at. However, it is rather nice talking with people of a different belief than me.

Well what I have learned here, in the short time ive visited, would be too much to go into. However I have learned (both from this site and other experiences) that just like anything else, there are some really great christians and some over zelous christians and some extremist christians. Generally, no matter what side they are on, the people here are nice. I have learned that there are close minded people and open minded people here, guess what, just like everywhere else. (recognizing a theme here )

So, I ask you why are you here?
Why the hostile tone?

Originally posted by ikester7579
 

O, but I thought yall knew it all. And don't kid me about learning. That's not what your here for. In fact, tell me what you learned here. I bet it's short and very demeaning of everyone that's christain here. Including the one's who run this website. So common lets here it.

 

 

[ikester7579]

Yep, It's like I thought. Can't, won't answer the question. But is quick to demean someone and expects not to get it back?

O my, don't like it when the table is turned. Well lets see, you come to this web site which is a Christian web site. You have no respect for what we believe. You post demeaning posts and the list goes on. Would you like me to post your demeaning posts so you can read them. It would take a whole thread to do it. There's a lot to choose from. And sense I have not been here for to long, I'm sure there's a lot I have not seen. That's my problem. What's yours? And why won't you answer questions we have?

 

[webboffin]

So much bitterness in this thread.

The major problem I have with evolution and makes me want to dispell it entirely is because evolutionist insist on claiming that man came from monkey. That itself mocks the Bible's creation of humans to me. I don't have a problem with others believing man/monkey thing because it isn't my problem. And if others think I am wrong then so be it. My views cannot be swayed on this. But I am rather up for the argueing of the "evidence" of general evolution of species

 

[ikester7579]

Originally posted by Arikay
Nope, I dont know everything. Ill be the first one to say that. Guess what, I also dont think my religion is the One, Single, correct religion, however, thats a thing for another thread.

Yep im here to learn. Both about christianity, and creationism. Ive been reading my bible, and guess what, I didnt burst into flames when i touched it. and nope, its not going to convert me, im rather happy where im at. However, it is rather nice talking with people of a different belief than me.

Well what I have learned here, in the short time ive visited, would be too much to go into. However I have learned (both from this site and other experiences) that just like anything else, there are some really great christians and some over zelous christians and some extremist christians. Generally, no matter what side they are on, the people here are nice. I have learned that there are close minded people and open minded people here, guess what, just like everywhere else. (recognizing a theme here )

So, I ask you why are you here?
Why the hostile tone?

 

Did we get nice all of a sudden? What you say here is nothing like you post.

 

[lithium.]

O my, don't like it when the table is turned. Well lets see, you come to this web site which is a Christian web site. You have no respect for what we believe.

How do you know that? Wait I forgot you know everything right? It doesn't matter because you are completely wrong. I have respect for everyone here (well almost everyone).

You post demeaning posts and the list goes on. Would you like me to post your demeaning posts so you can read them.

Oh... Come on me nor Arikay has posted anything demeaning.

That's my problem. What's yours? And why won't you answer questions we have?

Well I still don't see your problem. To me you seem to be ****ed off at all evolutionist. I do answer questions and I do it all the time.

 

[lithium.]

So much bitterness in this thread.

yeah I know.

The major problem I have with evolution and makes me want to dispell it entirely is because evolutionist insist on claiming that man came from monkey.

Wrong. Not really monkey, and not you this was a long time ago.

That itself mocks the Bible's creation of humans to me.

It doesn't mock the bible at all. Does the bible tell every detail on how humans beings were made? God could have used evolution.

That itself mocks the Bible's creation of humans to me. I don't have a problem with others believing man/monkey thing because it isn't my problem. And if others think I am wrong then so be it.

That is ok.

My views cannot be swayed on this.

No one is trying.

But I am rather up for the argueing of the "evidence" of general evolution of species

Me, and others that argued with you about this.

 

[Arikay]

Have I posted anything that attacked you? Have I ever been hostile towards you?

Or did I post something different than what you expected?

Originally posted by ikester7579
 

Did we get nice all of a sudden? What you say here is nothing like you post.

 

[webboffin]

Seesaw stop cutting up my post with quotes. lmao

 

[ikester7579]

God forgive me for not treating those at this forum as Jesus would have. I let my flesh get the best of me and said some things I should not have said. I also ask that they forgive me also as I forgive them. Forgive me of all my sins, wash me in your blood, make me white as snow. I pray for those here today. I pray for their protection and of their families protection. Bless me in all that I do and give me wisdom and not anger Amen.

 

[lithium.]

Originally posted by webboffin
Seesaw stop cutting up my post with quotes. lmao

I can't help it.

 

[ikester7579]

Thanks guys! This has been revealing. For my walk with the lord has become closer. You see even through our mistakes we learn and try to do better. Being a christain is a never ending battle and it's hard to stay on the straight and narrow path. Temptation is at all sides. Pride and attitude also gets in the way and can seperate someone from God. We cannot have pride in the presense of God. We are supposed to be humble. And we have those who go about being a Christain the wrong way. As a Christain we are not supposed to stuff religion it down someone's throat(so to speak). Though they have good intensions this is not the way. God does not force himself on any man. Then there's the super saints. The one's that when someone gets saved they tell them everything that has to change and it is so overwhelming most new Christains become discouraged. We as christains cannot change anyone. God does that. He cleans you up from the inside out and makes you a new person. It takes time. And God gives you the choice and this is the life we choose. People always ask why you become a Christain when being a sinner is much funner. I used to think that also. But the only answer I have to that question is to go here and listen online: www.unshackled.org This is the best answer I can give to why I choose to become a christian. Just click listen online.

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Originally posted by webboffin
So much bitterness in this thread.

The major problem I have with evolution and makes me want to dispell it entirely is because evolutionist insist on claiming that man came from monkey. That itself mocks the Bible's creation of humans to me. I don't have a problem with others believing man/monkey thing because it isn't my problem. And if others think I am wrong then so be it. My views cannot be swayed on this. But I am rather up for the argueing of the "evidence" of general evolution of species

It would only mock God if you believe that the image that is talked about in Genesis is an actual physical image...

In other words that God is a hairy bipedal ape like creature with impacted wisdom teeth and has a problem with balding as he gets older...

Since I happen to think that it is rather silly to believe that God is this way I have no problem with man and monkeys having a common ancestor.

 

[webboffin]

Good for you

 

[lucaspa]

Originally posted by ikester7579 Hmmm. Lets see, if the meaning of a word does not suite the arguement so change it's meaning? That's a good one.

It's one creationists use all the time. I'm glad you disapprove of the tactic, but you used it anyway. Please look at how creationists define "evolution" and "macroevolution". 

Primitive: Ancient, Antiquated, crude, early, old, primary, primevil, primordial, pristine, raw, rough, simple, undeveloped, etc...

Words are used differently by specialists than are listed in the dictionary.  This happens all the time in science. For instance, "progenitor cell" could simply mean "a cell that went before", but in stem cell biology it means a stem cell limited to differentiating into only one phenotype.

Besides, what was quoted came from a science journal, not a christain journal.

Then why wasn't the article cited?  What's the reference?  If you are going to claim later that it is a scientific journal, then please cite it so we can look it up for ourselves. We have found from bitter experience that creationists quote out of context and end up having quotes that are exactly opposite to what the author actually said.

About the recent book. The views of science are constantly changing, because to stay ahead of a lie you have to keep changing the lie so everyone stays confused. No one can figure it out because by the time they do it's changed again.

LOL!!  Boy, you have swallowed the creationist propaganda, haven't you?  THINK!

1. "Science" is not a monolith but made up of individual scientists who are stubborn people, most of whom in this country are Christians, and who get fame by showing the other guy's theories to be wrong.  Now, how is such a group of people going to perpetrate a long-standing lie? What is the motivation for doing so?

2.  Science does change ideas when the data shows an idea to be wrong.  That's the whole point of science.  To do science you have to be able to take an idea to the physical universe and test it to try to show it wrong.  So new data is going to show old ideas to be wrong.

3. BUT, some ideas stand the test of time. Evolution -- descent with modification -- is one of those. What is being "changed" are the particular lineages and mechanisms of evolution.  It has been determined that intelligence evolved.  But, how specifically did it evolve?  You are saying it could not have evolved at all.  The book The Origin and Evolution of Intelligence shows some of the mechanisms by which our intelligence evolved.

So when someone says what was said in the past, you can answer it the way you did and say it's out dated.

Sometimes it is.  You have to check later data to see if new data has shown the old idea to be wrong.  For instance, if you quote a 1985 book that the basal ganglia is simple, you have to check to see what has been found since to see if that claim is still correct.

Maybe the scientist from that era were to primitve. And if that's the case, what about Darwin? Was he to primitive to?

In terms of how he thought inheritance worked, yes, he was!  He thought inheritance worked by blending characteristics of the parents.  Everyone did at that time.  He was wrong. 

Darwin also thought that human females weren't as smart as males.  He reached that conclusion by looking at the distribution of males and females in prominent positions as authors, mathematicians, businesspeople, and politicians.  He thought the disparity represented innate differences in intelligence. We know today that it represented sociological factors.  But Darwin's fame is justified because time has shown him correct on the vast majority of his claims and ideas.

Because science is now pushing a new theory. We came from Mars. O well, gotta keep em confused.

It's obvious that you are confused.  For starters, no one is proposing that humans or life came from Mars.  There is a religious sect -- called Raelians -- that says humans are the product of genetic engineering by a sentient alien species on a planet orbiting Sirius.  Is that what you mean?  The scientific data disproves that as much as it disproves special creation.

I'll stick with My God.

Good.  No one's asking you to give up the Christian God.  Darwin didn't, why should you?  Of course, I suspect that your "God" is not the same as God, but that's another story.

He 's stays the same and is not into confusing his people by changing the meaning of his word or words to suit his purpose.

Sure he did.  God changed the meaning of the word "Messiah" and confused all the Jews.  They couldn't recognize Jesus as messiah because he didn't fit what a messiah was supposed to be.  He also changed the meaning of the dietary laws when He sent Peter that dream.  And look at the arguments and fights that went on about Arianism someday.  Lots of confusion about the identity of Jesus. Sorry, but Judeo-Christianity has changed a lot over its history, and the vengeful deity depicted in the OT is very different from the loving, forgiving deity depicted in the NT.

One very good example of science changing things to suit their views is the Carbon Dating Machine. The person who invented it said that it would not be accurate past 10,000 years. But now sense science wants to say the earth is billions of years old they say he's out dated.

Where did you pick up this bit of false witness?  Carbon dating was always said to be good only for 40,000-50,000 years. No one uses it for longer than that.  If you want to date a rock that is billions of years old, you use K-Ar or U-Pb or Rb-Sr method, not C14.

 

[lucaspa]

Originally posted by Hector Medina
Also,according to a good creationist(s) if evolution were true we could only eat each other because of the similar genetic makeups(or something,its been a while since I've seen it).

In fact they oversimiplfy everything we are too complicated to have evolved.

Last point first:  natural selection is an algorithm to get design.  Even complicated design.  Yes, you are designed.  The designer is natural selection.

Now, as to not being able to eat anything, you have the argument backwards.  Remember, digestion breaks food down to very simple components -- amino acids and nucleotides.  So it doesn't matter what genetic code we have.  For instance, the nucleotides GGG codes for glycine and TTT for phenylalanine.  Now, if creationism is true, there is no reason that humans couldn't have this code and corn have it reversed:  TTT for glycine and GGG for phenylalanine.  Since when we eat corn we break all the corn proteins down to the amino acids (of which glycine and phenylalanine are two) and then build are own proteins, our code can be different from corn's.

But they aren't.  All life on earth has the same basic code.  That argues that we all came from a common ancestor with that code.

 

[lucaspa]

Originally posted by ikester7579
God gives each animal what he or she needs. Some needs are different so the animal is different. This also helps keep balance in Nature and between all created things.

This is what led creationism into trouble in the 1840s and 1850s and why so many Christians looked upon evolution as a rescue, not an enemy.

For instance, take rabbits.  Rabbits eat their own feces.  Yecchh!! The reason they do this is that they lack an enzyme for breaking down cellulose, so all the cellulose in the plants they eat isn't food for them. And, of course, cellulose is a major component of plants. 

However, the bacteria that live in the large intestines of rabbits do have such an enzyme. So they break down cellulose, use some of the sugar that they get that way, and then the rest of the sugars and the bacteria are excreted in the rabbit's feces.  In order to get the food and bacteria back (to keep breaking down the cellulose), the rabbits have to eat their feces.

Now, since you say God made rabbits with what they need, why didn't God make rabbits with the enzyme to break down cellulose?  He did for other animals.  Why did He skip rabbits?  Does He like having rabbits eat their own feces? Is God cruel and sadistic?

THAT is what special creation did to Christianity.  As you look at the details of nature, Ikester, and not just the pretty designs, you find that special creation makes God out to be stupid, sadistic, and suffering from Alzheimer's.  Now, science can stand a deity like that.  But Christianity can't.  It's the theological problems of the idea you just propounded that got Christians to accept evolution.  By having these structures designed by natural selection and not made directly by God, evolution got God off the hook.

 

[lucaspa]

Originally posted by ikester7579
Do you know the history of how Evolution got into our schools? And did you know that the evidence used was later proved false? I'm not gonna tell you what it was so I can see how much you really know on this and the lie that started it.

You can read about it in Ronald Number's The Creationists.

Many states had laws against teaching evolution, Ikester.  In some states, since evolution was the accepted scientific theory, of course it was taught.

After the Scopes trial, Tennessee and the other states didn't change their laws. Evolution was still not taught in most American high schools. 

But in 1957 the Russians launched Sputnik.  Suddenly Americans felt inferior in science and demanded better science education and so the BCSE (Biological Committee Science Education) was formed to get Americans up to speed in biology. When the textbooks came out in 1963, they were filled with evolution.  Well, it took about 15 years for the creationists to catch on, but by 1974 the creationist movement was getting started.