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Books in or out?

Tellyontellyon

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There seems to have been quite some debate over the years about what books and letters should be in the Bible and which ones should be left out. The issue still is not completely settled, with some denominations having different Bibles...

✝️
Are there any books or letters that you feel should be included in the Bible but aren't?
Are there any that you think should be taken out?
✝️
Who exactly decided what went in and what went out?
✝️
And by what claim to authority?

Thank you.
 

Tellyontellyon

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Nothing should be added or removed. It says so in the Bible.
That's referring to the book of Revelation...
At the time John's Revelation was written the NT didn't yet exist as we have it today.

2... But some denominations do have different books .. even today
 
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dzheremi

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Questions 3 and 4 are definitely related, from a historical perspective.

The formation of a distinctly Christian canon likely began as a reaction to the spread of Marcionism, as Marcion was an early heretic of note who did not believe that the God of the OT was the Father of Jesus Christ, and hence separated the OT from the NT writings, and discarded the OT. He also produced an edited collection of NT writings (including some that his followers attributed to St. Paul, but are not found among St. Paul's accepted writings), which were made to conform with his theological views. He was thrown out of the Church c. 140s AD, so this was quite early on if we consider that the last of the gospel writers to die, St. John, did not do so until around the turn of the first century.

For some time after this the individual writings circulated, but were not 'canonized' like we would think of them today, with instead some 'regional canons' of sorts evolving in different places (see below). There was a large variety of both OT and NT apocrypha, and some of the books that we do not think of as being part of the 'standard' OT or NT today (like the Book of Enoch, or the Shepherd of Hermas) actually had considerable supporters in earlier. We recently had a thread here on CF (though I can't remember exactly where or what it was called, or else I'd link it here) asking if Jesus Himself quoted from the Book of Enoch, and some very respected and orthodox sources like HH St. Athanasius of Alexandria are known to have referenced the Shepherd of Hermas.

It is in this climate that several peoples who have been Christian since before even the acceptance of Christianity by the Roman Empire (380 AD) or the earliest extant 27-book NT list (367 AD; in the 39th festal letter of HH St. Athanasius), like the Ethiopians and the Syrians, first received the scriptures. Hence these peoples have some differences from the canon because they received the books themselves in this 'pre-canonized' state: the books were all around, they were available to be read, but nobody had come out and said "we should have only these, and not these others". Such language is in HH St. Athanasius' letter (where he says, for instance, that there is no room for 'secret' readings -- thereby eliminating any gnostic gospels, of which there were many in his native Egypt), but the Syrians and Ethiopians were already reading the scriptures by then. And some of the books that the Ethiopians retained, presumably from Greek or Hebrew (or sometimes Syriac or Coptic) originals, later became unavailable in any but their Ge'ez/Classical Ethiopic recensions, and are therefore now known as distinctly 'Ethiopian' books, as they are distinctly found in the Ethiopian/Eritrean biblical canons (this is the case with the Book of Enoch, for instance; the only reason we even know of it in English in our own day is because of relatively recent translations made from medieval Ethiopian manuscripts).

In the case of the Syrians/Syriac-speaking people, their Pešitto version (Syriac Bible) was translated from Hebrew for the OT text by the 2nd century AD, and from Greek for the NT text by the 5th century AD (there were earlier Syriac versions of the NT before this, but the Pešitto is the standard; see this article on the Old Syriac Version, which is somewhat misleadingly titled, as there was more than just one). Relevant to this discussion is the fact that the Book of Revelation, 2 Peter, 2-3 John, and Jude were not added to the Syriac churches' canon until the so-called 'Heraklian Version' of HG Thomas of Herqel in 616 AD.

By these two examples, I hope you can see that there wasn't any one person who gave the stamp of authenticity to this or that Biblical canon. Churches have always had some differences in Biblical canon, depending on the circumstances under which they first received the scriptures.

Though it should be said that in at least one ancient case, we can more or less thank one man for the existence of the scriptures, at least in a very specific sense: The Armenians had converted as a kingdom a century before they even had a written language, so they originally worshipped in Syriac until the invention of the Armenian alphabet by St. Mesrop Mashtots c. 405 AD. So we can assume that their earliest versions of the Bible may have been 'missing' several books relative to the canon as we know it today, since this was well before the Syriac Bible itself would've had the books described above as part of their regular canon. (St. Mesrop was a very smart man, however: in collecting materials to produce his version of the Bible in written Armenian, he did not just rely on the preexisting Syriac scriptures that were already known in Armenia, but also sent his students around the Roman empire to collect the best manuscripts they could from the preexisting centers of Christianity like Constantinople, Antioch, Alexandria, and Edessa. His life is fascinating, and if you are interested in knowing more about him and the establishment of Christianity in Armenia, I highly recommend 'The Life of Mashtots' by his disciple Koriun.)

Such differences are not necessarily considered a problem for the churches and peoples concerned. The Ethiopians and Eritreans have a much larger canon than any other church in Christianity, but they are by their history rightly considered daughters of the Coptic Orthodox (Egyptian) Church, since it was from Alexandria that they received their first bishops after the death of the founder of their Church, St. Frumentius (d. 383), who was a Syro-Phonecian Greek from Tyre (Lebanon) who converted the Axumite king 'Ezana to Christianity c. 330 AD.

I hope these points give you a little bit more to think about, OP. :)
 
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ViaCrucis

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There seems to have been quite some debate over the years about what books and letters should be in the Bible and which ones should be left out. The issue still is not completely settled, with some denominations having different Bibles...

✝️
Are there any books or letters that you feel should be included in the Bible but aren't?
Are there any that you think should be taken out?

The only possible way to settle the question on the Biblical Canon would require a truly ecumenical council, something which, as a Lutheran, I don't believe has happened since the 8th century. Since there hasn't been an ecumenical council of the Church in 1200 years, I don't expect one to happen anytime soon. The Bible is the Church's "book", it is the common possession of all Christian Faithful.

✝️
Who exactly decided what went in and what went out?

The answer is complicated in that both nobody and everybody "decided" it. No person, or even group of people, ever made the decision. The Canon of the Bible developed over time by the general consensus of the Church. When bishops did meet together in local synods to discuss these questions, all they did was agree that those books already being read in their churches should continue to be read. That's what we see for example in the local synods held at Rome, Hippo, Carthage, and Laodicea.

The Bible is the result of two thousand years of Christians reading, receiving, and confessing certain books. And when I say read, I mean, literally read as part of public Christian worship.

✝️
And by what claim to authority?

Thank you.

The historic consensus of the entire Christian Church, of all Christian Faithful everywhere, throughout history. The Biblical Canon developed organically, bottom-up, in the actual worship and daily life of Christians; not top-down by some committee of some kind.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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dzheremi

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But didn't Luther start throwing books out? That wasn't a cuddly consensus of the faithful. He took it on himself to decide.

If I recall correctly, Luther's methodology was to privilege the books of the Hebrew Bible that were written in Hebrew, to the exclusion of those found in the Greek LXX and Latin Vulgate but not in the Hebrew Bible. I don't know why he apparently assumed that all the texts of the OT should be in Hebrew (that's not even the case if one excludes the Greek writings, as there are still Aramaic writings; Aramaic is not Hebrew), but that would explain in broad strokes how Protestants and non-Protestants ended up with different canons (though from what I understand the original edition of Luther's Bible did include those books, but placed into their own section separate from what he considered to be the OT).
 
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ViaCrucis

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But didn't Luther start throwing books out? That wasn't a cuddly consensus of the faithful. He took it on himself to decide.

Luther took a position similar to that of St. Jerome, basically that the Hebrew books (effectively what is in the Jewish Tanakh) are proper Scripture, but that those books found only in the Septuagint aren't canonical. Luther's position wasn't all that new, as we can see similar lines of thought from earlier periods (with Jerome for example).

However, Luther never actually removed anything from his Bible translation. He set the Deuterocanonical books in their own appendix between the Old and New Testaments. This, too, wasn't new. Even the Vulgate had for centuries been copied with appendices containing "apocryphal" books. So publishing a Bible with such appendices wasn't new or innovative, but rather in keeping with a long tradition of how Bibles were copied and published.

The Deuterocanonical books weren't actually removed from English Protestant Bibles (or at least the KJV) until the late 1800s. If you go on the internet and look up vintage American Bibles from the 19th century, you'll see that virtually all of them, up until around the 1870s or 80s had those Deuterocanonical books (aka "The Apocrypha") printed in them.

Further, at least coming from the Lutheran tradition, we don't have an official position on the canonical status of the Deuterocanonical books. Luther's opinions on the subject are just that, his own opinions; but they aren't in anyway binding in Lutheranism, since Luther isn't the authority on Lutheranism (something I find often surprises a lot of people). Our theological standards, the Lutheran Confessions contained in the Book of Concord, simply don't talk about the subject, and as such Lutheranism never has an official position on whether or not the Deuterocanonical books are properly canonical or not. For Lutherans the Canon is technically open, which is why I've argued that the only way to fully settle the question is with an ecumenical council, something that simply isn't going to happen anytime in the near future.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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aiki

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There seems to have been quite some debate over the years about what books and letters should be in the Bible and which ones should be left out. The issue still is not completely settled, with some denominations having different Bibles...

✝️
Are there any books or letters that you feel should be included in the Bible but aren't?
Are there any that you think should be taken out?
✝️
Who exactly decided what went in and what went out?
✝️
And by what claim to authority?

Thank you.

What is meant by the phrase “canon of Scripture”?

- The books which constitute the Bible and are considered the authoritative Word of God.

Old Testament
:

What is known by Christians as the Old Testament of the Bible is known by the Jews as the Tanakh. Tanakh is an acronym based on the three distinct parts of the Hebrew Scriptures: the Torah (Law), the Nevi’im (Prophets), and the Kethuvim (Writings).

Who wrote the books of the Old Testament?

Books of The Bible: Complete List With Authors

The canon of the Old Testament, which was closed by about BC 200, did not pass through any kind of formal process of analysis and selection. Only a single council, the Hebrew Council of Jamnia in AD 90, was required to formally acknowledge what the Jews had already well-established as the canon of the Old Testament, or Tanakh. Some of the Tanakh was immediately accepted as from God (the Torah, and the Nevi'im) while other books (Daniel, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon, etc) though not initially regarded this way, through prolonged and common use became part of the canon of the Old Testament.

The Apocrypha:

The Roman Catholic version of the Bible includes several books in the Old Testament canon that were not part of the canon acknowledged by the Council of Jamnia. These books are known as the Apocrypha:

Tobit

Judith

Additions to Esther

1 & 2 Maccabees

The Wisdom of Solomon

Sirach (also known as Ecclesiasticus)

Baruch (including the Letter of Jeremiah)

Additions to Daniel (including the Prayer of Azariah, Bel and the Dragon, Susannah, and the Song of Three Holy Children)

Although there are 250 quotations from the Old Testament in the New Testament, not one of them is from any apocryphal book. All the books of the Tanakh except for Ecclesiastes, the Song of Solomon, and Esther are quoted in the New Testament. Among the Dead Sea Scrolls are a number of commentaries on the Old Testament, which, although they refer to virtually all of the Old Testament books, mention none of the apocryphal texts. As well, except for 1 and 2 Maccabees, none of the apocryphal books are historically-verifiable and none of them originated in Israel. Except for the books of the Maccabees, all of the apocryphal books were originally written in Greek and are, essentially, fiction. These books would not have found their way into any scriptural canon if the Jews of Alexandria, with whom the apocryphal books were popular, had not included them in a Greek version of the Old Testament – the Septuagint – which they had been commissioned by Ptolemy Philadephus to make for his library.

The New Testament:

Who wrote the books of the New Testament?

See the link above.

The canon of the New Testament, much like the Old Testament canon, was not selected and determined, but merely formally recognized. For the first hundred years of the existence of the Early Church, the Gospels and letters of the apostles were copied and distributed among Christian believers. Around 140 AD a man named Marcion produced a clearly-defined list of books he considered holy Scripture. Except for a highly edited version of the Gospel of Luke and only 10 of Paul's letters, he excluded all the other books of the New and Old Testament that we regard today as canonical. Marcion's effort to produce a canon of Scripture provoked the leadership of the Early Church to establish a clearly-defined canon of their own, which they derived from a well-established common consensus within the Early Church and use of the 27 books of the New Testament as holy Scripture.

In AD 367 Athanasius produced a list of the 27 books of the New Testament and was quickly followed by Jerome and Augustine. At the councils of Hippo Regius in 393, and Carthage in 397, the church in the west as a body approved the 27 documents alone as Scripture. It took a bit longer for eastern churches to follow suit, but by around AD 508 the 27 books of the New Testament were universally accepted as canon.

The Canon is closed:

Even if new letters of Paul or the other apostles were found, they would not be included in the canon of the New Testament. Undoubtedly, the apostles wrote many letters besides the ones we find in the Bible, but none of them were regarded by the Early Church as inspired and authoritative in the way the Gospels and epistles were. And if the Early Church did not see fit to include them in the canon, then we are not free to include them now.
 
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