I agree with you jayem...there were never any "good old days", everything is more out in the open now than it was years and years ago, but I would highly doubt the statistics are that greater now than then.
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jayem said:Why do so many people just accept this notion that there is so much more "immorality" now than in times past? I don't believe it for a minute. There is certainly more openess about sexuality. But in the long, historical perspective, people did virtually everything they do now, and to my knowledge, in nearly the same numbers. The author of that article needs to read "The Way We Never Were," by Professor Stephanie Koontz, of Evergreen State University (Basic Books, 1993.) She extensively researched records on birth patterns, family organization, etc going back to colonial days. The current out of wedlock birthrate hovers around 40% (and is dropping, as was pointed out.) In Puritan New England (no secularism, there) the illegitemacy rate was 33%. She has good data showing that the illegitemacy rate has fluctuated between 30 and 40 per cent for our entire history. Yes, STDs are a problem. But syphilis was estimated to affect fully 10% of the US population in 1900, and countless more had gonorrhea. A far higher incidence in the population that HIV/AIDS or chlamidia. (Syphilis was so common, that's why they used to require premarital blood tests in many states.) Pornography may have been kept under the counter, but prostitution was ubiquitous in most cities. It was reported that during the late 1800's, there was a brothel on virtually every street corner in Washington, DC. People have this nostalgic attitude about the past, but if you really look at the long perspective, I don't think there is a shred of credible evidence that we were so much more "moral" years ago. Mainly, it's more out in the open now. And I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.
Yeah, what could be better than the 50s, when TV couples slept in twin beds, and Lucy caused a minor scandal by saying the word "pregnant?" And it was just as unreal then as it seems now.flicka said:"The good old days" are what people think life was like when they watch reruns of Leave it to Beaver on Nick at Night.
jayem said:Yeah, what could be better than the 50s, when TV couples slept in twin beds, and Lucy caused a minor scandal by saying the word "pregnant?" And it was just as unreal then as it seems now.
msjones21 said:I was reading an article on the Focus on the Family website about how there should be zero tolerance for anything other than programs that teach abstinence until marriage as the ONLY sex option. This article blames birth control, the media, organizations that spread awareness of AIDS/HIV prevention, and Pagans for the decline in sexual morals. It also says that pregnancy out of wedlock statistics have increased because pregnancy out of wedlock doesn't carry the "disgrace" it used to. Shame on Focus on the Family for publishing such garbage! The article is in a PDF format so I couldn't C&P the contents so if you're interested in reading this baloney it can be found at:
http://family.org/cforum/pdfs/fosi/abstinence/otv.pdf
Blissman said:In an Iraqi prison, Americans who were Christians forced Muslim males to have oral sex with other Muslim males. That, and other horrible acts were done because it amused the Americans. Prisoners were tortured, including having wires attched to their genitals. A boy was sodomized, prisoners were forced to eat pork and drink alcohol, forced to denounce their own faith, and were told that these deeds were in the name of Christ. Where were the Wiccans, where were the Pagans? Of course, it is all THEIR fault. By all means hang the Pagans, shoot the Wiccans, and the world will be pure.
Don't worry, for 'they' will enjoy it! Sure they will! You can't kill everyone of them, so the others will have to get busy making 'replacements'. They do like their sex orgee's, so replace they will. What Christian thoughtfullness, we could make it a crusade!
Actually (a bit of TV trivia for those interested) - when Lucille Ball was pregnant and they put it into the show I Love Lucy (with her character, Lucy, becoming pregnant), the US network censors debated long and hard over what words they could use on air to describe the character's condition. They ended up deciding that she could be said, during the show, to be "expecting" or to be "enciente" (French for pregnant, I believe) - but they couldn't actually say "pregnant". One of the more amusing bits of US censorship.jayem said:Yeah, what could be better than the 50s, when TV couples slept in twin beds, and Lucy caused a minor scandal by saying the word "pregnant?" And it was just as unreal then as it seems now.
Thanks for the reply. That's interesting, and I stand corrected. The tone of that FotF article suggests they want to go back to those days. As I see it, this whole thing is about Puritanism. Some people still have the attitude that any openess about sexuality is unwholesome. They blame Kinsey, and open discussion of sex for the sexual revolution of the 60s. I think it's much more likely that any loosening of sexual mores was really just a natural reaction to former years of repression. If the 50s were so great, then where did the 60s come from?The Bellman said:Actually (a bit of TV trivia for those interested) - when Lucille Ball was pregnant and they put it into the show I Love Lucy (with her character, Lucy, becoming pregnant), the US network censors debated long and hard over what words they could use on air to describe the character's condition. They ended up deciding that she could be said, during the show, to be "expecting" or to be "enciente" (French for pregnant, I believe) - but they couldn't actually say "pregnant". One of the more amusing bits of US censorship.
jayem said:If the 50s were so great, then where did the 60s come from?
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