Benny Hinn bashers only please...

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

Yes I have, note that in his own town the people had little faith and he was only able to heal a few of them.

 

[TasManOfGod]

I think that he is sincerely misguided in his understanding of the Gospel and Christianity...

I don't agree

some people just say stuff on this forum without knowing what they are talking about

.

I agree

 

[ischus]

what about these stories:

Centurion’s servant
demon-possessed man
dead girl
man in synagogue with a demon


boy with a demon
other boy with an evil spirit
deaf and mute man
blind man at Bethsaida

 

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

Centurion's servant

"Lord I believe, help my unbelief"
---

demon-possessed man

Not a healing of the same sort, and the demons spoke to Christ directly. Different than the other cases listed/
---

dead girl

parents had faith, they went to get Jesus
(also note in the same passage in Mark, the woman that touched his robe "Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace and be healed of your affliction." )
In Luke's telling of the story when they came and said she was dead and not to bother Jesus anymore He said "Do not be afraid any longer; only believe, and she will be made well."
---

man in synagogue with a demon

Again demon possesion is different than sickness, they merely head His voice and obeyed him
---

boy with demon

Again different, but this one even moreso

Note that this kind is different from all the rest and will only come out by prayer and fasting
---

deaf mute man

Mark 7: 32 They brought to Him one who was deaf and spoke with difficulty, and they implored Him to lay His hand on him.

They believed He could heal the man or they would not have asked, they were not testing Him, the crowd believed
---

blind man at Bethsaida

Mark 8: 22 And they came to Bethsaida. And they brought a blind man to Jesus and implored Him to touch him.

Again the crowd believed.
---

This all made even more evident by this:

Mark 6:3 "Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon? Are not His sisters here with us?" And they took offense at Him.
4 Jesus said to them, "A prophet is not without honor except in his hometown and among his own relatives and in his own household."
5 And He could do no miracle there except that He laid His hands on a few sick people and healed them.
6 And He wondered at their unbelief. And He was going around the villages teaching.

I trust I don't need to highlight the verses for you, you seem pretty intelligent. That was a good list though, you made me grab the Bible and I always appreciate that

 

[ischus]

ok, flesh, but your statement was that no one in the bible was healed without having faith. Clearly, these people (and I forgot about the paralytic) were healed because of the faith of OTHERS, not their own.

Assuming that you will come back with a comment something like, "they were still healed because of faith...how could a dead person have faith....?" let me just give you two irrefutable references that should solve this discussion (and hopefully I won't get kicked off CF ):

Lk. 17:11-19
Jn. 5:1-15

 

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

ok, flesh, but your statement was that no one in the bible was healed without having faith. Clearly, these people (and I forgot about the paralytic) were healed because of the faith of OTHERS, not their own.

You are right, I did not make myself clear. It was still by faith though. Christ did not heal of His own power while he was hear. It was only through faith.

Assuming that you will come back with a comment something like, "they were still healed because of faith...how could a dead person have faith....?" let me just give you two irrefutable references that should solve this discussion (and hopefully I won't get kicked off CF ):

Why in the world would you kicked off of CF?

Lk. 17:11-19

The implication here is that only one of them remained healed, and note the words of the last verse. Of course this is not clear in the text, but what did Jesus tell the amn made him whole? His faith of course, this only strengthens my point.

Jn. 5:1-15

Faith in action, the man had faith that he would be healed by God, as others we being healed in the water. Jesus just manifested the healing without the man having to get into the water.

 

[devoted daughter]

Forgive the slightly misleading title...

I don't really want to slam Hinn, that's been done to death. I have a legitimate (I think) question concerning his followers. Do you think his "congregation" is saved or are they in big trouble?

The reason I ask is because I think, as do a lot of others, that HE is a fruitcake. But if his followers believe in Jesus and the resurrection and proclaim Him as their Lord and Savior and follow His Word would they not be saved? Even if they are so naive and gullible as to believe Hinn's "wonders?"

I don't know, really. But I had a fellow missionary tell me something once that made sense. I asked,"what if someone is giving you a blessing, say a preist, or minister, and they are empty of His Spirit, a sinner beyond what we know of... will we not receive the blessing?"
My friend told me that God would not withhold His blessing just because the "vessel" through which it came was "broken". Does that make sense,...? It did to me. If he's a "fruitcake", then he's accountable, not those who seek help, unless they're looking just to him, and not to God.

They will be in my prayers,
(As will his hairdresser )
I shouldn't "judge", we all have bad hair days!

 

[ischus]

(For those of you who are staying on topic here, I apologize for this post.)

Flesh,

in reference to Lk 17, you write:

The implication here is that only one of them remained healed, and note the words of the last verse. Of course this is not clear in the text, but what did Jesus tell the amn made him whole? His faith of course, this only strengthens my point.

I disagree with the implication. What is actually being shown here is the contrast between the one guy and the other nine. Look at what the 10 guys were asking for when they yelled to Jesus; they wanted to be healed. They didn't care one bit about who he was- they just knew he was a healer and wanted to try it out. Why did 9 not come back after they were healed? Because they still didn't care. They got what they wanted, and that was it. Except for one. HE realized who Jesus was, and because of this he had faith...but Jesus never says that his faith or the others' faith healed them. What he does say-only to the one who returned- was that his faith saved him.

But, where I would like to spend the time with you is in John 5. However, let's work on Lk 17 first and tell me what you think... and then we can hopefully move on to John.

 

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

It is my bedtime right now But I will get back to you on this.

However Jesus did not say his faith had saved him, he said his faith healed him. The word in the Greek is: sozo

SOZO
1) to save, keep safe and sound, to rescue from danger or destruction
a) one (from injury or peril)
1) to save a suffering one (from perishing), i.e. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health
1) to preserve one who is in danger of destruction, to save or rescue

It is translated both saved and healed. In context to physical healings it is always translated healed or whole. This does not imply that his faith saved him, but that his faith was why he was healed.

 

[ischus]

Flesh- I see your point here, but you would have to imply that the others were 'healed' by faith where there is in fact no evidence of it. I guess we just see it differently.

But, you should get some sleep, and we can talk about John 5 tomorrow.

see ya

 

[Under_His_Shadow]

Forgive the slightly misleading title...

I don't really want to slam Hinn, that's been done to death. I have a legitimate (I think) question concerning his followers. Do you think his "congregation" is saved or are they in big trouble?

The reason I ask is because I think, as do a lot of others, that HE is a fruitcake. But if his followers believe in Jesus and the resurrection and proclaim Him as their Lord and Savior and follow His Word would they not be saved? Even if they are so naive and gullible as to believe Hinn's "wonders?"
/QUOTE]

I may be wrong, but I don't think Benny Hinn actually pastor's a "congregation" any longer. Even if he still does, salvation is an individual matter, of people receiving Christ one at a time. Entire congregations are not saved in one fell swoop, en-masse. Even in most evangelical congregations, no doubt there are some unsaved people attending fairly regularly.

I have seen his (television) ministry from time to time over a period of many years now, and have no doubt that he is a brother in Christ who loves Jesus wholeheartedly, and is being used by God as a channel through which many are healed physically and also led to salvation in Christ, despite his having a hair style, clothes, or mannerisms which some of us would not ourselves prefer! I have never heard him claim that he was doing any "wonders" or healings by his own power or righteousness, but to the contrary, have always observed him being diligent to give God the praise and glory for any healings.

I don't personally agree with some of his teachings that I have heard, but he does lift up Jesus Christ as the Way to salvation, the Truth regarding that Way, and the Life/power of the Holy Spirit who heals us and gives us that new Life!

I certainly would not base my opinion of any high-profile Christian on what I heard and saw on "20-20" or any other secular media's "documentary" or "expose".

I know it grieves my spirit, and so am sure it must grieve the Holy Spirit even more, to hear those of us who call ourselves Christians belittling, name-calling, and mocking another brother in the Lord! Satan is "the accuser of our brethren" (Rev. 12:10), and when we slander another believer, we actually are siding with the devil.

I suggest that when we see things in another brother that we are concerned about, we confront him about it in person, or that being impractical, through telephone, letter, or e-mail, and above all take it to God in prayer regarding his needed (according to our opinion) correction and restoration, in the spirit of meekness, considering our own imperfection and vulnerability to sin (Gal. 6:1).

Benny Hinn doesn't need me or anyone else to validate his ministry; "Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own Master [Christ] he stands or falls" (Rom. 14:4), so I think we need to adopt Gamaliel's wisdom and realize that "if this...work is of men, it will come to nothing; but if it is of God you cannot overthrow it" (Acts 5:38-39), lest like James and John, we desire to "command fire to come down from heaven and consume" Benny, only to have Jesus say to us, "You do not know what manner of spirit you are of" (Lk. 9: 54:55).

As Jesus said. "there is no one who will perform a miracle in My name, and be able soon afterward to speak evil of Me. For he who is not against us is for us" (Mk. 9:39).

U.H.S.

†

 

[SavedByGrace3]

I do not watch Hinn... I barely know what he looks like.

But I have to say that such hyper examination and fruitless pre-occupation with the ins and outs and the ups and downs of this unfortunate fellow seems to tell me more about those who waste endless hours trying to ditz him. This reads more like an article from the National Enquirer than a Christian discussion.
My understanding is that he has led thousands to Christ. How many have you led? I understand thousands have testified that he in fact effected healing in their bodies. Are they all deluded and deceived? Others sware that they have received answered prayer, blessings, and more under his ministry. Are you saying they are all liars?
As far as all these secular reports... you have to be kidding me! These same secular fellows would have covered the ministry of Jesus and interviewed the false witnesses that lied against Him in His trial. Why not just ask the devil what He thinks of God?

I like to remember this when people ditz me:

1 Corinthians 4:10-13 KJV
10 We are fools for Christ's sake, but ye are wise in Christ; we are weak, but ye are strong; ye are honourable, but we are despised.
11 Even unto this present hour we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwellingplace;
12 And labour, working with our own hands: being reviled, we bless; being persecuted, we suffer it:
13 Being defamed, we intreat: we are made as the filth of the world, and are the offscouring of all things unto this day.

Take great care that you are not on the wrong side of all of this. Hinn may have problems, I do not know. But if he has done 1/10th for God what people say he has... then he has likely done 100 times more than everyone on this forum. You do not want to find yourself on the wrong side of a judgment where you participated in the persecution of a man of God. Take care you are not like those in the mob that crucfied Jesus.

Go read your Sunday school lesson!

 

[HoT-MetaL]

I used to have a real problem with Benny Hinn, he used to come accross as so proud. But now I look at him I see a true humility there. A lot of people dont like him because he is not 'religious' or legalistic. Lets not go into that.

When I watch him now he honestly has humility. There is almost definetly huge movements of the Holy Spirit, if you do not believe so, why do so many people go and get healed? Look at the fruits of his ministry!

Someone once prophecied and told him that his hair was an idol - So he listened to it, and just left his hair as it is.

Im not a huge fan of him, since ive never met the guy, nor been to one of his crusades - but from what I've seen the guy is really on fire for GODS Glory and not his own.


God Bless, metal.

 

[Benedicta00]

Forgive the slightly misleading title...

I don't really want to slam Hinn, that's been done to death. I have a legitimate (I think) question concerning his followers. Do you think his "congregation" is saved or are they in big trouble?

The reason I ask is because I think, as do a lot of others, that HE is a fruitcake. But if his followers believe in Jesus and the resurrection and proclaim Him as their Lord and Savior and follow His Word would they not be saved? Even if they are so naive and gullible as to believe Hinn's "wonders?"

You really think being saved works like that? God judges the individuals heart and only He knows who is truly worthy and who is not, only He can judge, we can not. I am always little surprised when I see some Christians feel they can pass judgement on another’s salvation even if it is Benny Hinn.

 

[joevberry3]

I don't think he sends his followers to hell, but here are a couple places to start if you want to know his doctrine/theology.

http://christiansaware.faithweb.com/Hinn_book_review1.htm

http://www.cultlink.com/sentinel/hinnqs.htm

Both these sites you quote, misquotes people they dont like time and again...

To Blessed--Benny Hinn has been investigated by Dateline--But The reporter from Dateline was busted when she said "He is innocent but lets give it to him anyhow." They are actually in court over that. She accidentally left the camera recording when she said that, and somehow it got back to Hinn and his people.

Joe

 

[joevberry3]

I do not watch Hinn... I barely know what he looks like.

But I have to say that such hyper examination and fruitless pre-occupation with the ins and outs and the ups and downs of this unfortunate fellow seems to tell me more about those who waste endless hours trying to ditz him. This reads more like an article from the National Enquirer than a Christian discussion.
My understanding is that he has led thousands to Christ. How many have you led? I understand thousands have testified that he in fact effected healing in their bodies. Are they all deluded and deceived? Others sware that they have received answered prayer, blessings, and more under his ministry. Are you saying they are all liars?
As far as all these secular reports... you have to be kidding me! These same secular fellows would have covered the ministry of Jesus and interviewed the false witnesses that lied against Him in His trial. Why not just ask the devil what He thinks of God?

I like to remember this when people ditz me:

1 Corinthians 4:10-13 KJV
10 We are fools for Christ's sake, but ye are wise in Christ; we are weak, but ye are strong; ye are honourable, but we are despised.
11 Even unto this present hour we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwellingplace;
12 And labour, working with our own hands: being reviled, we bless; being persecuted, we suffer it:
13 Being defamed, we intreat: we are made as the filth of the world, and are the offscouring of all things unto this day.

Take great care that you are not on the wrong side of all of this. Hinn may have problems, I do not know. But if he has done 1/10th for God what people say he has... then he has likely done 100 times more than everyone on this forum. You do not want to find yourself on the wrong side of a judgment where you participated in the persecution of a man of God. Take care you are not like those in the mob that crucfied Jesus.

Go read your Sunday school lesson!

Great Post Brother Dids! Nice to see someone besides me on here taking up for the man!

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Great Post Brother Dids! Nice to see someone besides me on here taking up for the man!

mmmm
Having been the victim of more than a few heresy hunters... I have gotten used to their tactics.
I know you have felt their bite also my friend in Jesus.

 

[Under_His_Shadow]

Great Post Brother Dids! Nice to see someone besides me on here taking up for the man!

Psst!....Joe!
There are many of us here that are grieved with any Christian-bashing, but especially that which is done by other Christians! Apparently you skipped over my previous post (the one just before "dids"), as well as hotmetal's, Shelb5's, etc.?

 

[TasManOfGod]

I too stand with brothers who support eachother

 

[brettnolan]

Sorry, I haven't been able to get back til now.

I think many of you misunderstood me, and that's my fault. But I did clearly state that I didn't want to bash Hinn. I thought more folks would have also picked up that you can put nearly ANY Christian leader/teacher's name in place of Hinn's. I chose Hinn, because he is someone that many people are familiar with AND many people discredit.

The reason I requested Hinn bashers only is so that we could start with the assumption that his "healings" and, in some cases, his doctrine are suspect (I'm not going to point out specific examples because, as I already stated, you could use anyone's name). IF this is the case, that would make him a false teacher, correct? Now the question, if you follow a guy such as this, what is your fate? If

I am not in a position to judge anyone's salvation, including Hinn's, I was just curious as to other opinion's on the matter. In fact, I implied...

But if his followers believe in Jesus and the resurrection and proclaim Him as their Lord and Savior and follow His Word would they not be saved? Even if they are so naive and gullible as to believe Hinn's "wonders?"

that they WOULD be saved.