BCP revision?

[seeking.IAM]

To the unlearned, whatever goes up on the big screen.

Please, God, deliver me from the big screen. 'Tis anathema!

 

[Paidiske]

I find the screen very useful, particularly for folks with poor vision or whose disabilities mean handling a book is difficult.

That said, as long as the words on the screen are those of the prayer book, used according to the rubrics, it's a prayer book service. The medium isn't the point, the content is.

 

[seeking.IAM]

I find the screen very useful...

You disappoint me Rev. Paidiske. You've always seemed quite reasonable until now.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

What's wrong with screens?

 

[Paidiske]

Many people find screens detract from their experience of prayerfulness.

I acknowledge that, but think that on balance, the benefits outweigh the drawbacks.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

Many people find screens detract from their experience of prayerfulness.

That's life in general, though.

 

[seeking.IAM]

What's wrong with screens?

Many people find screens detract from their experience of prayerfulness...

I am one of those that find screens a distraction, not only a distraction but an annoyance. I liken it to the difference between reading a book and watching a movie. Your mind fills in its own images when reading a book, completing the story. You have an imagery of the scenery and the characters. When you see a movie, you see someone else's interpretation of what their mind visualized in the book. They are different. I might (barely) tolerate words of liturgy on a screen, but then after being Episcopalian for less than 10 years, I have most of the prayers and liturgy memorized and rarely resort to the prayer book or printed liturgy program. I don't like projected song lyrics, which don't allow those of us musically trained to read the notes. But, most of all I don't want to see clergy's fancy multi-media presentation running behind their sermon showing me a nice visual illustration. Let my mind think about your sermon and fill in the rest without the visual aid, please.

Screens can also distract from the beauty of worship space. Back when I was a Methodist I attended a church that had a large cross suspended above its altar. They decided to hang their screen right in front of it so one could only see the top and bottom of the cross because of the screen. So when they weren't projecting words, lyrics, or their multi-media show, they projected the middle of the cross. How totally silly is that?!

One of the attractions for me of the parish I joined is that it has no screen. It would be a distraction from our beautiful worship space that is on the national register of historical places.

It's an anathema, I tell ya!

 

[Naomi4Christ]

I am one of those that find screens a distraction, not only a distraction but an annoyance. I liken it to the difference between reading a book and watching a movie. Your mind fills in its own images when reading a book, completing the story. You have an imagery of the scenery and the characters. When you see a movie, you see someone else's interpretation of what their mind visualized in the book. They are different. I might (barely) tolerate words of liturgy on a screen, but then after being Episcopalian for less than 10 years, I have most of the prayers and liturgy memorized and rarely resort to the prayer book or printed liturgy program. I don't like projected song lyrics, which don't allow those of us musically trained to read the notes. But, most of all I don't want to see clergy's fancy multi-media presentation running behind their sermon showing me a nice visual illustration. Let my mind think about your sermon and fill in the rest without the visual aid, please.

Screens can also distract from the beauty of worship space. Back when I was a Methodist I attended a church that had a large cross suspended above its altar. They decided to hang their screen right in front of it so one could only see the top and bottom of the cross because arof the screen. So when they weren't projecting words, lyrics, or their multi-media show, they projected the middle of the cross. How totally silly is that?!

One of the attractions for me of the parish I joined is that it has no screen. It would be a distraction from our beautiful worship space that is on the national register of historical places.

It's an anathema, I tell ya!

I believe a key value of Anglicanism is to minister to our whole community.

That means we address the those with visual, auditory and kineasthetic learning needs.

We also have to support the 99% of people who do not have Grade 6 in music theory and can't sight read.

We do it for others, not ourselves. We are already saved.

 

[everbecoming2007]

I find the screen very useful, particularly for folks with poor vision or whose disabilities mean handling a book is difficult.

That said, as long as the words on the screen are those of the prayer book, used according to the rubrics, it's a prayer book service. The medium isn't the point, the content is.

My initial reaction is against them, but used in this manner you described, perhaps there is a "via media" here.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

My initial reaction is against them, but used in this manner you described, perhaps there is a "via media" here.

I have certainly benefited from screens when I had small children to breastfeed or imprison. But those days are long gone for me.

What I appreciate now is that I can sing with full gusto (keeping the lungs open). Others may differ on this benefit . Depending on our preacher or intercessor, we have audio-visual aids to sermons and prayers, which is fantastic.

Our notices are also noticed.

In terms of liturgy and bible readings, we project exactly what is relevent to the service in question, even down to the real name of the baptismal candidate.

I struggle to identify with a downside, or the fear.

 

[seeking.IAM]

The church worshipped without projection for 2,000 years and did quite nicely. I'm just sayin'.

 

[Paidiske]

But, most of all I don't want to see clergy's fancy multi-media presentation running behind their sermon showing me a nice visual illustration. Let my mind think about your sermon and fill in the rest without the visual aid, please.

I admit, I don't tend to do this - I tend to have one picture or illustration up for the entirety of my sermon - but that has more to do with being time-poor and not tech-savvy, and therefore not prioritising creating a fancy multi-media presentation.

There are people who really struggle to cope with and learn from a spoken presentation that goes for the length of a sermon. Not just people with receptive language problems, but it's not everybody's preferred way of learning. I think being open to diversity in the congregation - including diversity of ability levels and cognitive preferences - is actually part of how we love one another.

Screens can also distract from the beauty of worship space. Back when I was a Methodist I attended a church that had a large cross suspended above its altar. They decided to hang their screen right in front of it so one could only see the top and bottom of the cross because of the screen. So when they weren't projecting words, lyrics, or their multi-media show, they projected the middle of the cross. How totally silly is that?!

Now that's just liturgically insensitive. Any screen has to be incorporated into the building in a way which doesn't detract from it. Fortunately for me where I am now, we have a very conveniently located piece of blank white wall, and don't actually use a screen at all.

As for the idea that the church didn't use screens for millennia, that's true. For millennia, the vast majority of the congregation were also functionally illiterate. The needs of the people and the tools at our disposal change, and that's okay.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

The church worshipped without projection for 2,000 years and did quite nicely. I'm just sayin'.

Well, 2000 years ago, there were no church buildings, as such.

And it is our duty to preach the gospel anew in each generation.

One of the great things about our system here is that the projection software feeds seemlessly into YouTube live, so we have all our liturgy and songs appearing in our living rooms as if we were in church. I hope we continue to do this after we get back to normal.

 

[Shane R]

I am one of those that find screens a distraction, not only a distraction but an annoyance. I liken it to the difference between reading a book and watching a movie. Your mind fills in its own images when reading a book, completing the story. You have an imagery of the scenery and the characters. When you see a movie, you see someone else's interpretation of what their mind visualized in the book. They are different. I might (barely) tolerate words of liturgy on a screen, but then after being Episcopalian for less than 10 years, I have most of the prayers and liturgy memorized and rarely resort to the prayer book or printed liturgy program. I don't like projected song lyrics, which don't allow those of us musically trained to read the notes. But, most of all I don't want to see clergy's fancy multi-media presentation running behind their sermon showing me a nice visual illustration. Let my mind think about your sermon and fill in the rest without the visual aid, please.

Screens can also distract from the beauty of worship space. Back when I was a Methodist I attended a church that had a large cross suspended above its altar. They decided to hang their screen right in front of it so one could only see the top and bottom of the cross because of the screen. So when they weren't projecting words, lyrics, or their multi-media show, they projected the middle of the cross. How totally silly is that?!

One of the attractions for me of the parish I joined is that it has no screen. It would be a distraction from our beautiful worship space that is on the national register of historical places.

It's an anathema, I tell ya!

The continuing churches are calling you. . .

I think that in the US, screens carry a certain amount of baggage. For the most part, a larger screen equals less liturgy. When it gets to the point that the whole back of the stage is lit, it's hard to find anything Anglican left.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

The continuing churches are calling you. . .

I think that in the US, screens carry a certain amount of baggage. For the most part, a larger screen equals less liturgy. When it gets to the point that the whole back of the stage is lit, it's hard to find anything Anglican left.

If Anglicans do it legally, it's Anglican. We are not preserved in aspic.

 

[seeking.IAM]

Do you think our varying feelings about projection screens has to do with how far up the candle we go with churchmanship?

 

[Naomi4Christ]

Do you think our varying feelings about projection screens has to do with how far up the candle we go with churchmanship?

What do you think and what would lead you to that assessment?

 

[Albion]

Do you think our varying feelings about projection screens has to do with how far up the candle we go with churchmanship?

I doubt it. There is plenty of dignity and beauty in low church worship, even as there is in high church worship. Each of them can be pushed too far, of course, but I'm not speaking of that.

 

[seeking.IAM]

Do you think our varying feelings about projection screens has to do with how far up the candle we go with churchmanship?

What do you think and what would lead you to that assessment?

It is not so much an assessment as a question. I wonder if high church folks are less inclined to like screens than low or broad church?

For example, my church is high church, Anglo-Catholic worshipping in a beautiful historic building. I think my sentiment about projection screens is shared by most in my church. We would no sooner have a projection screen than we would a praise band. It just doesn't fit for us.

 

[Paidiske]

I think that in the US, screens carry a certain amount of baggage. For the most part, a larger screen equals less liturgy. When it gets to the point that the whole back of the stage is lit, it's hard to find anything Anglican left.

Certainly, if people are calling the sanctuary a "stage," they've got to the point where I'm cringing.

And yes, I think there is some degree of correlation here too; in my experience, the churches which are open to innovations such as screens are more likely to also be open to - ah - sitting lightly to authorised forms of liturgy.

Do you think our varying feelings about projection screens has to do with how far up the candle we go with churchmanship?

That would match my experience here. On the whole - but not without exception - projection screens are more often embraced in low churches. To find what I think of as an "old school" low church with the dignity and beauty Albion speaks of (say, a prayer book, cassock and surplice style service) is becoming increasingly difficult (which is a shame, because that would actually probably be where I would naturally find myself at home. But there are almost no such parishes left in my diocese now).