Bar owner on stage every sunday?

[12volt_man]

Can someone be driving impaired by eating too much food?

Actually, yes.

How many people have been killed by drivers with a very full belly?

How many people have been killed by drivers who had a heart attack or a diabetic episode behind the wheel because of their poor eating habits?

How many families have been ruined because mom or dad was overweight?

I would wager that more families have been left without a parent due to health problems resulting from poor eating habits than from alcohol.

Heart disease, diabetes, stroke, etc..

Why pretend as if alcohol and food consumption are one and the same in their potential consequences?

Because logically, they are.

You're assuming that the bar owner shouldn't own a bar because a very small minority will abuse the alcohol he serves, even though he acts in good faith on the assumption that they are drinking responsibly.

On the other hand, you believe it's perfectly OK for a restaurantuer to own a restaurant, even though many more people in today's society have eating disorders and poor eating habits, which lead to disease and death.

I'm just trying to find some consistency in your comparison of the two.

 

[jangnim]

I understand that Scripture doesn't outright ban alcohol consumption, but Proverbs is sprinkled with wisdom about not even getting involved with it. We see this in the sad stories about the destructive effects of alcohol abuse. It's not only the drinker who's adversely affected. True, not everyone is an alcoholic, however, those who end up abusing it didn't start out with the intention of being a drunkard. Chances are, he figured it'd be ok to have a drink with the boys once in a while, but found over time that he desired more of it more often. Because it's addictive and destructive, we need to be extremely wise in how we deal with it and not simply equate recreational drinking with any other ordinary activity. The two are just not the same.

I would agree with this to some extent but would add that the guy himself is not drinking, he is working to earn money to pay his bills. Yes he is doing so in a questionable job, but honestly Jesus didn't save me and change everything about my life right away. He is slowly, by His Spirit altering me into the image of Christ, just as He is with you, with all of us.

I note that Zacheus, when he met God, didn't say he was going to quit collecting taxes, but rather that he would do the task more honorably.

I guess the question is, can God save exotic dancers and bar tenders, and people who sell liquor over the counter? It seems a foolish question when I read it, knowing that an all powerful God can do anything.

Now should we be drinkers? No, that is obvious from Proverbs. Can we serve strong drink? The Bible is generally unclear on the subject. It seems to allow for it on certain occasions. Is drinking a sin? It can be. Is drinking a crime? More often when it is out of control.

The point I am making is that Jesus saves us wherever we are. He doesn't demand a change in profession. We simply don't know all of the circumstances in this case. Has this fellow sunk all that he has into the bar, and thus simply can't get his investment out? Has he been saved for a very long time? What is his heart on the subject? If we don't know these answers, how then can we reply wisely? Let's not forget that God is Love.

 

[Serving4Christ]

I think you are reaching here.

Actually, I don't think I am. Jesus meets us where we are and he uses us ANYWHERE we may be. Only He knows our heart. Some are making judgements they're not qualified to make.

Jesus used a woman at the well, a blind man, a lame man, fishermen, a tax collector. Some of the stated could be construed as worse than a bar tender back in those days.

I say perhpas Jesus could have been a bartender. We know different because of what we read from scripture and our personal relationship with Him. We know Jesus on a personal level, none of which anyone here has encountered with the bar owner besides the OP.

I haven't heard the OP say anything negative about the bar owner. Yet some are consistent in judging him without getting to know him. He might be richer in heaven than any of us here for all we know, and I accept that. Until proven otherwise, keep bar tending. People in bars need Christian support and love too. Until I hear otherwise about how he practices in his bar, he has my support.

Just my 1.5 cents

 

[jangnim]

Actually, I don't think I am. Jesus meets us where we are and he uses us ANYWHERE we may be. Only He knows our heart. Some are making judgements they're not qualified to make.

Jesus used a woman at the well, a blind man, a lame man, fishermen, a tax collector. Some of the stated could be construed as worse than a bar tender back in those days.

I say perhpas Jesus could have been a bartender. We know different because of what we read from scripture and our personal relationship with Him. We know Jesus on a personal level, none of which anyone here has encountered with the bar owner besides the OP.

I haven't heard the OP say anything negative about the bar owner. Yet some are consistent in judging him without getting to know him. He might be richer in heaven than any of us here for all we know, and I accept that. Until proven otherwise, keep bar tending. People in bars need Christian support and love too. Until I hear otherwise about how he practices in his bar, he has my support.

Just my 1.5 cents

Okay I Understand your point I was simply saying Jesus was never a bartender. I do however agree with you, that many are judging without really knowing the facts of this mans life.

Isn't it odd how people are so quick to judge the other guy, no matter how little they acrually know.

 

[Shane Roach]

I think we are all closer to being on the same page than not. I too share concerns with alchohol that far exceed my concernd with overeating. I just am leary of getting too far ahead of myself when dealing with someone who just happens to own a bar. If a soldier can remain a soldier as long as he doesn't abuse his power, I think a bartender is likely a pretty safe profession, if not perhaps one that will tend to draw a lot of respect. I know of a very prominant pastor in the Methodist church who ministers in the black community in Houston TX who, for some time, owned a motelthat rented rooms by the hour. He was not a pimp, but it is no mystery what happens in rooms like that. When he was first converted he maintained that work for some time, and really as merely the owner of the place he was not in direct violation of anything, but the Spirit eventually moved him to seek his gainfull employment in other ways because of how it looked, and I suspect perhaps if this fellow feels a call to ever do more than just perform in the band that he will likewise be struck by an urge to perhaps find something more fit for appearances sake.

It was not for nothing that God, for example, felt that Solomon should build His temple rather than David, to separate His worship from David's lifetime of warfare. It was not a statement against David, but against war. Still, ultimately that is how it worked out, even though one has to know David dearly would have loved to build the Temple, and God called David a man after His own heart.

Appearances are important. But also it's important to be able to give space for differing levels of faith and understanding.

 

[Child of JC]

So you have a sinner at your church? Or does the bar have a regular christian?

 

[Ceccia]

I doubt most "responsible drinkers" hang out at bars.

You might be surprised. I worked in a bar last year, and it was very low-key. I never had to ask the bouncer to throw anyone out, there was no one dancing on tables or anything questionable...in my year of working there I had to cut someone off on a mere two occasions. Most people had one or two drinks and either sat at the tables and talked or played pool.

 

[reformedfan]

I know a mega church that has invited an active member of a cult to be in their "worship & praise" band. Apparently church bands have no standards for who they let in. I bet if the neighborhood crack dealer played a mean bass, they'd recruit him, too.

Too bad the bar owner's in yours, I'd complain to management.