Baptism is a work.

[Xeno.of.athens]

We have engaged many times before.

You forgotten that I take Paul as our apostle and the gospel that the ascended Christ revealed to him, is the only gospel that saves today?

nope. Jesus' gospel saves; saint Paul repeated it.

 

[Guojing]

nope. Jesus' gospel saves; saint Paul repeated it.

Naturally, Catholics will reject that perspective

 

[Strong in Him]

We have engaged many times before.

You forgotten that I take Paul as our apostle and the gospel that the ascended Christ revealed to him, is the only gospel that saves today?

I never understand what people mean when they talk about the only Gospel - there is only one.
Jesus himself says that a person can only enter the Kingdom of God is he is born again - are you favouring Paul over the One who is THE Word?

 

[Oneofhope]

I never understand what people mean when they talk about the only Gospel - there is only one.

For example, virtually the entire "church" does not include Circumcision of Heart when individuals claim to "share" their form of "gospel."

When the terms and conditions are left out of the "Gospel" that is being horribly presented, it becomes "another" gospel, or, false gospel.

There are many forms of "gospels" today, for how many actually agree that they know what "it" is?

 

[Strong in Him]

For example, virtually the entire "church" does not include Circumcision of Heart when individuals claim to "share" their form of "gospel."

That's because we don't have circumcision, so the concept is unfamiliar to us.
All we have are the promises that if anyone is in Christ they are a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come, 2 Corinthians 5:17.
That if we confess our sins God is faithful, will forgive us and make us clean, 1 John 1:9; and that we are reconciled to God in Christ, Romans 5:11, 2 Corinthians 5:18.

There are many forms of "gospels" today, for how many actually agree that they know what "it" is?

The Gospel - Good News - is that mankind sinned against God, deserved punishment and eternal separation from God, and could no nothing to reconcile ourselves to him - so God came to earth, in Jesus, and took our punishment for us. He lived, taught, died, was raised again, ascended back to his Father and sent his Spirit to live in us. God no longer lives in a building or a tabernacle but in the hearts of his children.
For the purposes of these forums, a person may only call themselves a Christian if they agree with, and believe, the Nicene Creed.

 

[Oneofhope]

That's because we don't have circumcision, so the concept is unfamiliar to us.
All we have are the promises that if anyone is in Christ they are a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come, 2 Corinthians 5:17.
That if we confess our sins God is faithful, will forgive us and make us clean, 1 John 1:9; and that we are reconciled to God in Christ, Romans 5:11, 2 Corinthians 5:18.

The Gospel - Good News - is that mankind sinned against God, deserved punishment and eternal separation from God, and could no nothing to reconcile ourselves to him - so God came to earth, in Jesus, and took our punishment for us. He lived, taught, died, was raised again, ascended back to his Father and sent his Spirit to live in us. God no longer lives in a building or a tabernacle but in the hearts of his children.
For the purposes of these forums, a person may only call themselves a Christian if they agree with, and believe, the Nicene Creed.

That's your version of the "Gospel"?

 

[Strong in Him]

That's your version of the "Gospel"?

Basically.
Jesus was both God and man, was born as one of us, lived, taught, showed us what God is like, went to the cross so that we could be reconciled to him, was raised again, ascended, sent his Spirit and will return one day in glory.
It's all laid out in the Nicene Creed.

 

[Oneofhope]

Basically.
Jesus was both God and man, was born as one of us, lived, taught, showed us what God is like, went to the cross so that we could be reconciled to him, was raised again, ascended, sent his Spirit and will return one day in glory.
It's all laid out in the Nicene Creed.

I'm sorry, but that isn't the Saving Plan of Jesus Christ. There are terms and conditions that a person must agree with and submit to. Do we understand the ideas and principles we are submitting to? We need to understand the Faith of Abraham, for it is his exact Faith that we must have? Because the Plan of God has been "hidden" as Paul explains, it is our duty to figure out that Plan and begin to share it.

Ephesians 3:9 KJV - "And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:"

Ephesians 3:9 NLT - "I was chosen to explain to everyone this mysterious plan that God, the Creator of all things, had kept secret from the beginning."

We need to have confidence that we know this "hidden" Plan of God.

Colossians 2:2 NLT - "I want them to be encouraged and knit together by strong ties of love. I want them to have complete confidence that they understand God's mysterious plan, which is Christ himself."

I wonder . . . do our pastors and preachers want us to have that same sense of "confidence" about the Gospel Saving Plan of Christ?

No, they don't. In fact, that's the last thing they want us to know, for if we did (understand) and if the Plan was enforced, "Churches" would be far and few between.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Naturally, Catholics will reject that perspective

I do not know what your post means.

 

[Oneofhope]

I do not know what your post means.

It means that God has allowed the Catholic Collective to think in a specific way.

 

[Guojing]

I never understand what people mean when they talk about the only Gospel - there is only one.
Jesus himself says that a person can only enter the Kingdom of God is he is born again - are you favouring Paul over the One who is THE Word?

Jesus was not talking to you in his first coming (Matthew 15:24), he came to fulfill the promises to the forefathers of Israel (Romans 15:8).

The kingdom of God that was promised to them was the promise given to King David, one of their ancestors in 2 Samuel 7:12-16, and was repeated by the angel Gabriel to Mary in Luke 1

31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus.

32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

The scripture verses are all there but naturally, there will be people finding it hard to understand them literally, and prefer to spiritualize them.

For example, they view the kingdom of God in John 3 as a spiritual kingdom in heaven.

 

[Guojing]

It means that God has allowed the Catholic Collective to think in a specific way.

You notice how, by recognizing your own view as a "perspective", it allows one to disagree with another cordially, without implying anything about whether the other person has the Spirit of God or not?

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

It means that God has allowed the Catholic Collective to think in a specific way.

Yes, God teaches the Catholic Church "all truth" and this is one of the truths he teaches.

 

[Guojing]

Basically.
Jesus was both God and man, was born as one of us, lived, taught, showed us what God is like, went to the cross so that we could be reconciled to him, was raised again, ascended, sent his Spirit and will return one day in glory.
It's all laid out in the Nicene Creed.

That was not the gospel of the kingdom that Jesus and the 12 were preaching at his first coming.

 

[Oneofhope]

Jesus was not talking to you in his first coming (Matthew 15:24), he came to fulfill the promises to the forefathers of Israel (Romans 15:8).

The kingdom of God that was promised to them was the promise given to King David, one of their ancestors in 2 Samuel 7:12-16, and was repeated by the angel Gabriel to Mary in Luke 1

31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus.

32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

The scripture verses are all there but naturally, there will be people finding it hard to understand them literally, and prefer to spiritualize them.

For example, they view the kingdom of God in John 3 as a spiritual kingdom in heaven.

Nice. I like how you tied in the Davidic Covenant.

 

[Guojing]

Nice. I like how you tied in the Davidic Covenant.

Once you understand how liberating it is to interpret scripture literally as far as one can, taking context into account, its impossible to ever go back to spiritualizing them.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Jesus was not talking to you in his first coming

So, the great commission is not for you either, right?

 

[Guojing]

So, the great commission is not for you either, right?

Well, for one thing, we no longer preach obedience to the Law of Moses, as Jesus did in Matthew, so no one today is obeying the Matthew's version completely to teach "them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you".

So no, it was an instruction to the 12 only.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Well, for one thing, we no longer preach obedience to the Law of Moses, as Jesus did in Matthew, so no one today is obeying the Matthew's version completely to teach "them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you".

So no, it was an instruction to the 12 only.

Excellent, that saves a lot of time.

Do you just ignore the four gospels now? after all, you say that they are for the lost sheep of the house of Israel only, right?

 

[Guojing]

Excellent, that saves a lot of time.

Do you just ignore the four gospels now? after all, you say that they are for the lost sheep of the house of Israel only, right?

All scripture is written FOR you, but not all scripture is written TO you, nor ABOUT you.

Why don't you build an ark now when God instructed Noah to build one in Genesis 6:14?

Even though you don't build one, you don't ignore the book of Genesis because you learn FROM it, would you agree?

That is the same attitude for all scripture.