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Please, tell me, exactly whose work is baptism?Also, to complicate matters even more. Some Christian groups who claim to believe in faith + works believe in infant baptism. How can a baby have faith? They can’t. So it’s not faith + works if one believes “water baptism”is faith and not a work.
Why are you trying to convince me of a point I am not in disagreement with you over? I believe we are to follow Christ’s example in holy conduct as a man. We are not in disagreement on this point. What we are in disagreement over is Jesus having divine power as the second person of the Trinity or Godhead.
Okay. This statement makes no sense. Nowhere did I express any concern or problem in this happening. My point was to show to you that Jesus was not solely a man but He is God. This means we do not imitate Christ when He was being worshiped. Jesus was worshiped as God. Do you agree with that? Do you agree that Jesus should have been worshiped as God? Yes, or no?
I know. And now that you've explained it like that, I agree with you.
But, as I said, I wrote the words "people will always disagree", you replied by saying that quarrelsome people did not have the Spirit - and I felt that you were saying "if any Christian argues, or disagrees, with another, they are not filled with the Spirit." That was why I gave you the examples that I did and said "what about them?"
If someone said that they were born again, a new creation but spent their time arguing/picking fault/complaining etc I would probably question what they had understood by 'giving their life to Christ'.
That said, growth is gradual. Someone might well be filled with the Spirit but the fruit of love, or patience, isn't yet fully grown.
I believe 1 John 2:6 and other such verses just fine. We are to follow a Christ in his human example. But are you not aware that Jesus was worshiped as God? This is something we cannot receive or follow seeing we are only created.
Actually, if you understand what Paul was teaching us in the Body of Christ here in 2 Corinthians 5:16
16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.
You will understand that we are not to follow Christ in the flesh, in his earthly ministry to the nation of Israel (Matthew 15:24, Romans 15:8).
We are to follow Paul, as he follow Christ (1 Corinthians 11:1), which is after the ascended Christ. (Galatians 1:11-12)
I actually like this post.
One correction, if I may, Paul mentioned: "Imitate me as I imitate Christ." So Jesus is still the standard by which a person's works can be seen to be from GOD.
Well I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that.As long as you recognize that Paul is imitating Christ differently from what went down in Matthew-John, we are in agreement. =)
Well I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that.
Jesus specifically said that one believing in Him would do His works and greater. I'm sure He didn't mean for any of us to go to the cross, but all the works associated with the gifts that He did we should be doing also.
Jesus said that in his first coming to Israel, so that, to me counts as following Christ after the flesh.
Unless you can show that Paul also told us in the Body of Christ, that we will do greater miracles than what Jesus did, then yeah, I would agree with you.
Meh,.....
Is this some sort of oddball Messianic teaching? I don't know where you get your ideas from, but the examples that Jesus gave is to anyone born again. He is our standard.
We are not his audience in his first coming (Matthew 15:24).
We are not his audience in his first coming (Matthew 15:24).
That is why Paul tells us, as our apostle, to follow him, as he follows Christ. He did not ask us to follow Christ after the flesh.
You know what,.......back in '92 when I got born again, I had a major visitation from the Lord Jesus that same afternoon. The amount of love and power from Him was just amazing to me at that point. It always is really. But He told me to believe in His word. He didn't say believe what the apostles said and did, He specifically said "believe in My word."
I'm going to tell you something here,..... I'm going to believe Jesus,.... not you. I don't mean to offend you, but that's just the way that it is with me. My Christianity is not based around simply what I read from my bible or something that someone tells me, it is based around a daily personal relationship with The Lord Jesus. He is the one I trust, and He has never let me down yet, not once. So if I need to know something particular about His word, I can simply just ask Him.
Being that I have been with The Lord just over 30 years, I've never once had The Holy Spirit lead me into believing anything like you are promoting on here.
You know what,.......back in '92 when I got born again, I had a major visitation from the Lord Jesus that same afternoon. The amount of love and power from Him was just amazing to me at that point. It always is really. But He told me to believe in His word. He didn't say believe what the apostles said and did, He specifically said "believe in My word."
I'm going to tell you something here,..... I'm going to believe Jesus,.... not you. I don't mean to offend you, but that's just the way that it is with me. My Christianity is not based around simply what I read from my bible or something that someone tells me, it is based around a daily personal relationship with The Lord Jesus. He is the one I trust, and He has never let me down yet, not once. So if I need to know something particular about His word, I can simply just ask Him.
Being that I have been with The Lord just over 30 years, I've never once had The Holy Spirit lead me into believing anything like you are promoting on here.
Actually, if you understand what Paul was teaching us in the Body of Christ here in 2 Corinthians 5:16
16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.
You will understand that we are not to follow Christ in the flesh (John 1:14, 1 John 4:2–3), in his earthly ministry to the nation of Israel (Matthew 15:24, Romans 15:8).
We are to follow Paul, as he follow Christ (1 Corinthians 11:1), which is after the ascended Christ. (Galatians 1:11-12)
Acts 2:23 NLT - "But God knew what would happen, and his prearranged plan was carried out when Jesus was betrayed. With the help of lawless Gentiles, you nailed him to a cross and killed him."
The whole world is the audience.
Ephesians 3:6 NLT - "And this is God's plan: Both Gentiles and Jews who believe the Good News share equally in the riches inherited by God's children. Both are part of the same body, and both enjoy the promise of blessings because they belong to Christ Jesus."
Yes.For me, I am already impatient with folks that argue. I would rather just walk away, but it seems as though most are addicted to communicating, even if it means communicating in a way that demonstrates that we're not saved. It is this need to simply continue, post after post, of how right we are and how wrong "you" are, etc. To me, that is so boring and unproductive.
Me too.Don't get me wrong, I used to do the same thing; I couldn't let things go.
Not sure about that.I also figure that if a person doesn't want to listen, it shows that they are not my true Brother or Sister.
Now, if you prefer not to do that, but rely on your experience in 1992, I understand as well, I am certainly not offended in any way, you are free to choose. =)
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