Baptism by immersion in my pool!

[yeshuaslavejeff]

What did I say that is different than what Lutherans teach ?

I was in the Lutheran church over 30 years, and no pastor nor teacher, Lutheran or other for that matter, ever said let alone showed that 'sprinkle' was ever used in Scripture for Baptism in Jesus Name. Many are surprised by this, but no one's changed Scripture that I'm aware of, except for some recent versions trying to do whatever it is they do.
And as the p.p. recently demonstrated, the rcc has very very different ideas than any protestants that I know of. And the p.p. has repeatedly bragged for hundreds of years about that. (It doesn't mean he's right, as he never is, but he still brags).

Do Lutherans today teach something different about Scripture or the p.p. ?

 

[DaRev]

What did I say that is different than what Lutherans teach ?

I was in the Lutheran church over 30 years, and no pastor nor teacher, Lutheran or other for that matter, ever said let alone showed that 'sprinkle' was ever used in Scripture for Baptism in Jesus Name.

Nor is any other mode of Baptism mentioned in Scripture. The important aspect of Baptism is water applied in the Name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. How that water is applied is in effect adiaphora. The effects of Baptism are in no way dependent on the method of applying the water. The traditional methods used in the Lutheran Church reflect a level of reverence for what God is actually doing in the Sacrament.

 

[KEPLER]

What did I say that is different than what Lutherans teach ?

I was in the Lutheran church over 30 years, and no pastor nor teacher, Lutheran or other for that matter, ever said let alone showed that 'sprinkle' was ever used in Scripture for Baptism in Jesus Name. Many are surprised by this, but no one's changed Scripture that I'm aware of, except for some recent versions trying to do whatever it is they do.
And as the p.p. recently demonstrated, the rcc has very very different ideas than any protestants that I know of. And the p.p. has repeatedly bragged for hundreds of years about that. (It doesn't mean he's right, as he never is, but he still brags).

Do Lutherans today teach something different about Scripture or the p.p. ?

Stop bringing up the Pope; he is irrelevant to the discussion. If you bring him up again, I will have to assume that you are attempting to hijack the thread.

As for sprinkling, I suggest you take a look at F. F. Bruce's Commentary on Hebrews in the NICNT series. Specifically, look at his work on Chapter 10, verse 22 (on pgs. 254-5). There is little doubt that this verse refers to baptism.

Secondly, take a look at Mark 7:4. where "baptizing" is used synonymously with "washing" in Mark 7:3, and there is little doubt that the washing described in 7:3 was achieved by pouring.

(And for the record, Lutherans generally pour, not sprinkle).

Cheers,

Kepler

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Sprinkling makes the babies cry more for some reason.

I wailed like a banshee when I got baptized.

;-)

 

[LilLamb219]

When people focus on the amount of water in baptism, it shows that they don't really know what baptism does for us. Tables were "baptized" in the NT, but they weren't picked up and plunged into a huge pool of water. They were washed clean, just like in our baptisms we are washed clean.

Baptism isn't so much about the water, but more about God's promises that He attached to the water.

 

[Confess]

What did I say that is different than what Lutherans teach ?

I was in the Lutheran church over 30 years, and no pastor nor teacher, Lutheran or other for that matter, ever said let alone showed that 'sprinkle' was ever used in Scripture for Baptism in Jesus Name. Many are surprised by this, but no one's changed Scripture that I'm aware of, except for some recent versions trying to do whatever it is they do.
And as the p.p. recently demonstrated, the rcc has very very different ideas than any protestants that I know of. And the p.p. has repeatedly bragged for hundreds of years about that. (It doesn't mean he's right, as he never is, but he still brags).

Do Lutherans today teach something different about Scripture or the p.p. ?

I would have to say that you must not have been apart of any Lutheran church that confesses Lutheran teaching. There are many out there, it is the sad reality of the church.

 

[BigNorsk]

What did I say that is different than what Lutherans teach ?

I was in the Lutheran church over 30 years, and no pastor nor teacher, Lutheran or other for that matter, ever said let alone showed that 'sprinkle' was ever used in Scripture for Baptism in Jesus Name. Many are surprised by this, but no one's changed Scripture that I'm aware of, except for some recent versions trying to do whatever it is they do.
And as the p.p. recently demonstrated, the rcc has very very different ideas than any protestants that I know of. And the p.p. has repeatedly bragged for hundreds of years about that. (It doesn't mean he's right, as he never is, but he still brags).

Do Lutherans today teach something different about Scripture or the p.p. ?

The one mode that cannot be demonstrated is submersion. Note I didn't say immersion. Many say immersion is submersion, but really the word goes beyond just submersion. You can be immersed in a rain, or fog. You can be immersed by having something poured over you.

We know that the meaning of baptizo includes pouring because we see in Luk 11:38 NET.
(38) The Pharisee was astonished when he saw that Jesus did not first wash his hands before the meal.

The word translated "wash" is baptizo. He was astonished that Jesus did not ceremonially wash before eating. We know exactly what that means thanks to recorded Jewish traditions. And you can actually see it yet today among Orthodox Jews and Muslims. The water is poured over the hands and down the arms and the hands and knuckled together to wash. The hands are not submerged in a basin.

We also see the mode of the baptism unto Moses in Psalms.

We also from the Septuagint know that baptizo clearly includes sprinkling.

Sir 34:25 KJVA
(25) He that washeth himself after the touching of a dead body, if he touch it again, what availeth his washing?

The Septuagint uses baptizo for washeth in the KJV. Here is the Greek. βαπτιζόμενος ἀπὸ νεκροῦ καὶ πάλιν ἁπτόμενος αὐτοῦ, τί ὠφέλησεν ἐν τῷ λουτρῷ αὐτοῦ;

The thing is, we know how that person was to be baptized.
Num 19:13 NET.
(13) Anyone who touches the corpse of any dead person and does not purify himself defiles the tabernacle of the LORD. And that person must be cut off from Israel, because the water of purification was not sprinkled on him. He will be unclean; his uncleanness remains on him.

So there the word for baptize clearly means and meant at the time pouring and sprinkling. We know submersion was included sometime after the bible, but we really can't show it at the time. Still, I would accept submersion the way the water is applied is not that important.

Marv

 

[TCat]

Today is the day! Pastor Jim is preaching the Saturday evening sermon at the church at 5:00, then plans to come over afterward for the baptism.
I'll let you know more about it tomorrow.

 

[dinkime]

how wonderful to have another soul being baptised!!

 

[DaRev]

Any pictures to share?

 

[Radiata]

When people focus on the amount of water in baptism, it shows that they don't really know what baptism does for us. Tables were "baptized" in the NT, but they weren't picked up and plunged into a huge pool of water. They were washed clean, just like in our baptisms we are washed clean.

You know how people baptise boats by breaking the bottle of wine on it? Imagine baptising a boat by submersion.

 

[TCat]

Sorry I have not responded to this thread sooner. I just returned to town after being gone all week.

The baptism was wonderful. Pastor gave a beautiful message about what it means and how God works in baptism, then 30+ people gathered at the pools edge and Lisa, Pastor and my husband went into the pool. Pastor asked if she desired baptism and if we as members of her Christian family promised to support and pray for her etc. Then after blessing her in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit my DH and Pastor submersed her.
She stood up in tears, hugged them both and we all cheered and wiped our own eyes. It was terrific. We then ate a good meal, gathered in my living room and sang songs of praise together.
Couldn't have been better.

 

[dinkime]

sounds like a wonderful time! your pastor seems very openminded to doing things a little differently than tradition (but still Biblically acceptable) and treat the baptism with the respect it deserves!




and having a good meal -- so totally Lutheran! any jello? lol

 

[DaRev]

so totally Lutheran! any jello? lol

What color was it?

 

[dinkime]

hopefully it was green since that is the color we are in right now

 

[TCat]

Sorry to disappoint, there was no jello. We did have some awesome potato cassorole side dishes though.

 

[Lupinus]

No jello?

Im disapointed

How about lefse was there lefse?

 

[TCat]

Nope, just burgers, dogs, potato and other side dishes, chips and salsa and of course beer.

 

[dinkime]

well, i guess the potato dishes and beer made it pretty lutheran as well, lol

 

[gratefulgrace]

Sorry I have not responded to this thread sooner. I just returned to town after being gone all week.

The baptism was wonderful. Pastor gave a beautiful message about what it means and how God works in baptism, then 30+ people gathered at the pools edge and Lisa, Pastor and my husband went into the pool. Pastor asked if she desired baptism and if we as members of her Christian family promised to support and pray for her etc. Then after blessing her in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit my DH and Pastor submersed her.
She stood up in tears, hugged them both and we all cheered and wiped our own eyes. It was terrific. We then ate a good meal, gathered in my living room and sang songs of praise together.
Couldn't have been better.

So happy to hear it was a blessed and inspiring time for all involved. gg