Avoiding the Mark of the beast

Steve_K · Mar 25, 2020

It's definitely physical. This iteration will be used to force vaccinate but future versions + 5G, Smart Cities, and IoT will use it for payments.

Bill Gates - ID2020 | Digital Identity
http://news.rice.edu/2019/12/18/quantum-dot-tattoos-hold-vaccination-record/

iamlamad · Mar 28, 2020

DeerGlow said:
This me super paranoid. Is it physical? Is it not? If the devil tricks me, even if it's only for a second to think evilly, am I doomed? How can I be sure I don't have the mark?

You should rather concern yourself with knowing Jesus and the Father, so at the pretrib rapture you will be caught up and not even BE HERE when the mark is created. If you are a bible student at all you should know that the mark will not be created until after the midpoint of the future 70th week of Daniel.

iamlamad · Mar 28, 2020

BukiRob said:
Major1 said: ↑
2 Thess. 2:3 clearly says that the A/C will be revealed AFTER the Rapture removes all believers.

No, it does not! For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God.

Paul goes on to suggest that it is the Ruach Ha Kodesh that is restraining this from occurring but absolutely NOWHERE does it indicate that the body is or is not present when this happens.

In fact NOWHERE in this chapter is the removal of believers even suggested let alone directly stated.

Major, all you are showing us is that you really don't understand this passage.
Did you notice, for example, that verses 6 - 8 show us absolutely that the man of sin cannot be revealed until this restraining force is removed or "taken out of the way?" Get it straight: he CANNOT be revealed until the restrainer is gone - no longer restraining or holding back.

Then, did you notice that in verse 3b the man of sin IS REVEALED? WHAT? Yes, IS REVEALED.

Did you notice that Paul wrote, "and now you know what is restraining..." How Paul? HOW can we know? Paul's intent is that we back up and read more carefully. Because it is very plain: in 3b the man of sin IS revealed, meaning that in 3a the restrainer has been "taken out of the way."

I challenge you to search 3a to find something that has been taken out of the way. There is only ONE possibility: it is hidden in that word, "apostasia." Early translations into English translated that word as "the departing." Go and look: the "THE" is there in every Greek text. It is a very significant "departing."

You choose: since the THEME of the entire passage is the rapture of the church, or Paul's "gathering," the departing could be the church being taken out of the way, so the Holy Spirit would a moment after have NO ONE on earth to work through to restrain.

OR, it is a great falling away (from what that word does not tell us)that causes the man of sin to be revealed. Again, you choose.

Question: if you choose the falling away, how in the world would anyone in that situation: thinking that The Day of the Lord had started and they were no in it - how would they know that ENOUGH have fallen away to know: "ah, this is what Paul was saying..." The truth is, when one "falls away" two more come. The church has been steadily growing.

Since Paul's theme is the rapture, I think Paul is telling us that it is the Holy Spirit - through the church - that is the restraining force. But when the church has departed - been "taken out of the way" - THEN the man of sin can be revealed.

Paul's argument then for those who thought the day had started: NO, it has not started. When you see the departing of the church, THEN the man of sin revealed, THEN you can know for sure that "The Day of the Lord" has started and you are now IN IT. Everyone in the world will know for certainty that a HUGE group of people have departed earth: just disappeared. Those that read Paul can know for certain that this is a very significant departure. (This is supposing that someone knows the scriptures but are not a true believer so are left behind. Hmmm. Jews know the scriptures will - even the New Testament.)

FredVB · Jul 4, 2020

Steve_K said:
It's definitely physical. This iteration will be used to force vaccinate but future versions + 5G, Smart Cities, and IoT will use it for payments.

Bill Gates - ID2020 | Digital Identity
http://news.rice.edu/2019/12/18/quantum-dot-tattoos-hold-vaccination-record/

The mark of the beast could be physical, and it could be expected to be, reasonably, but denouncing God, and Christ reconciling any among us to God, is the primary component of having the mark of the beast. Getting a vaccination in itself would not be including this, and God is not going to condemn people for getting a vaccination. There is possibly some physical marking yet to come that will be administered to people with their willing denouncement of God, and Christ reconciling any among us to God.

BABerean2 · Jul 4, 2020

FredVB said:
The mark of the beast could be physical, and it could be expected to be, reasonably, but denouncing God, and Christ reconciling any among us to God, is the primary component of having the mark of the beast. Getting a vaccination in itself would not be including this, and God is not going to condemn people for getting a vaccination. There is possibly some physical marking yet to come that will be administered to people with their willing denouncement of God, and Christ reconciling any among us to God.

The flag of those who reject Christ is found on the stage of many churches in the United States.

Pastors are also allowing those who reject Christ to speak from the pulpits of their churches.

These preachers are ignoring 1 John 2:22-23, and 2 John 1:7-11.
These two passages actually use the word "antichrist".

.

Major1 · Jul 4, 2020

iamlamad said:
Major, all you are showing us is that you really don't understand this passage.
Did you notice, for example, that verses 6 - 8 show us absolutely that the man of sin cannot be revealed until this restraining force is removed or "taken out of the way?" Get it straight: he CANNOT be revealed until the restrainer is gone - no longer restraining or holding back.

Then, did you notice that in verse 3b the man of sin IS REVEALED? WHAT? Yes, IS REVEALED.

Did you notice that Paul wrote, "and now you know what is restraining..." How Paul? HOW can we know? Paul's intent is that we back up and read more carefully. Because it is very plain: in 3b the man of sin IS revealed, meaning that in 3a the restrainer has been "taken out of the way."

I challenge you to search 3a to find something that has been taken out of the way. There is only ONE possibility: it is hidden in that word, "apostasia." Early translations into English translated that word as "the departing." Go and look: the "THE" is there in every Greek text. It is a very significant "departing."

You choose: since the THEME of the entire passage is the rapture of the church, or Paul's "gathering," the departing could be the church being taken out of the way, so the Holy Spirit would a moment after have NO ONE on earth to work through to restrain.

OR, it is a great falling away (from what that word does not tell us)that causes the man of sin to be revealed. Again, you choose.

Question: if you choose the falling away, how in the world would anyone in that situation: thinking that The Day of the Lord had started and they were no in it - how would they know that ENOUGH have fallen away to know: "ah, this is what Paul was saying..." The truth is, when one "falls away" two more come. The church has been steadily growing.

Since Paul's theme is the rapture, I think Paul is telling us that it is the Holy Spirit - through the church - that is the restraining force. But when the church has departed - been "taken out of the way" - THEN the man of sin can be revealed.

Paul's argument then for those who thought the day had started: NO, it has not started. When you see the departing of the church, THEN the man of sin revealed, THEN you can know for sure that "The Day of the Lord" has started and you are now IN IT. Everyone in the world will know for certainty that a HUGE group of people have departed earth: just disappeared. Those that read Paul can know for certain that this is a very significant departure. (This is supposing that someone knows the scriptures but are not a true believer so are left behind. Hmmm. Jews know the scriptures will - even the New Testament.)

I am perplexed that you do not think I understand what I posted. I am even more perplexed because it seems to me we are saying the same thing so then why the comment of "I do not understand".

But then again we are all able to have opinions whether they be right or wrong.....you are entitled to yurs.

Then as for verses 6 & 7 …...YES.

The restrainer of evil is the Holy Spirit. He is the only one I know of who can do such a thing. Lawlessness was a problem in Pauls day and it has grow worse and worse. It will continue to get worse and olny the Holy Spirit will not allow Satan to go all the way in this age we are now in.

When the Holy Spirit is removed it will be like taking the stopper out of a bottle---what is inside will pour out all over the world.

Now it MUST be remembered that the Holy SPirit LIVES in the hearts of believers. That means for the Holy Spirit to be removed...….born again Christians MUST BE REMOVED.
That then is the purpose of the Rapture, the removal of the Holy Spirit by taking up the church.

Now as for verse 3b, YES, ...…….Lets read that Scripture shall we...…
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition."

You SEE, there is nothing there that says as you stated......

"Because it is very plain: in 3b the man of sin IS revealed, meaning that in 3a the restrainer has been "taken out of the way."
I challenge you to search 3a to find something that has been taken out of the way."

So then the "Falling away or Apostasy" comes first, then the Rapture next and then the A/C is revealed.

The real question then must be......Are we in the Apostasy today???? YES IMO we are.

Major1 · Jul 4, 2020

BABerean2 said:
The flag of those who reject Christ is found on the stage of many churches in the United States.

Pastors are also allowing those who reject Christ to speak from the pulpits of their churches.

These preachers are ignoring 1 John 2:22-23, and 2 John 1:7-11.
These two passages actually use the word "antichrist".

.

Agreed. All over this land we see WOMEN pastors and Homosexuals as ordained deacons and Pastors.

Major1 · Jul 4, 2020

FredVB said:
"and it could be expected to be, reasonably, but denouncing God, and Christ reconciling any among us to God, is the primary component of having the mark of the beast. Getting a vaccination in itself would not be including this, and God is not going to condemn people for getting a vaccination. There is possibly some physical marking yet to come that will be administered to people with their willing denouncement of God, and Christ reconciling any among us to God.

Fred..... lets read Revelation 13:16..
"And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads".

According to those words, I am not sure how we can say that "The mark of the beast could be physical, "

To me, it is velar that the mark will be a visiable, physical mark of some kind.

To me, the mark could very well be the UPC Bar Code as it allows people to be tracked AND would allow people who accept the A/C to buy and sell goods.

Timtofly · Jul 4, 2020

Major1 said:
I am perplexed that you do not think I understand what I posted. I am even more perplexed because it seems to me we are saying the same thing so then why the comment of "I do not understand".

But then again we are all able to have opinions whether they be right or wrong.....you are entitled to yurs.

Then as for verses 6 & 7 …...YES.

The restrainer of evil is the Holy Spirit. He is the only one I know of who can do such a thing. Lawlessness was a problem in Pauls day and it has grow worse and worse. It will continue to get worse and olny the Holy Spirit will not allow Satan to go all the way in this age we are now in.

When the Holy Spirit is removed it will be like taking the stopper out of a bottle---what is inside will pour out all over the world.

Now it MUST be remembered that the Holy SPirit LIVES in the hearts of believers. That means for the Holy Spirit to be removed...….born again Christians MUST BE REMOVED.
That then is the purpose of the Rapture, the removal of the Holy Spirit by taking up the church.

Now as for verse 3b, YES, ...…….Lets read that Scripture shall we...…
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition."

You SEE, there is nothing there that says as you stated......

"Because it is very plain: in 3b the man of sin IS revealed, meaning that in 3a the restrainer has been "taken out of the way."
I challenge you to search 3a to find something that has been taken out of the way."

So then the "Falling away or Apostasy" comes first, then the Rapture next and then the A/C is revealed.

The real question then must be......Are we in the Apostasy today???? YES IMO we are.

We have been apostate for some time, and all who attempt to expose Satan become martyrs. Satan is the man of sin. Those who deny that, deny they are the apostate church. You cannot have antichrist, and no more man will call himself Christ. There is a false prophet who will declare who this Satan, beast, man of perdition is. No, I am not a prophet. Satan just is this antichrist, and we need to look for the Lamb of God. The Lord Jesus Christ, who is our Atonement. Not just an Atonement. The Atonement for the whole world. The Holy Spirit and the church would have been feminine in the Bible. It is God or the Lamb who is holding back Satan. The church and the Holy Spirit are neutral. What will be gone at the rapture is the witness of the church and the power of the Holy Spirit. But Satan will still not be loosed as in control, he will just be revealed, along with the false prophet.

Timtofly · Jul 4, 2020

Major1 said:
Fred..... lets read Revelation 13:16..
"And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads".

According to those words, I am not sure how we can say that "The mark of the beast could be physical, "

To me, it is velar that the mark will be a visiable, physical mark of some kind.

To me, the mark could very well be the UPC Bar Code as it allows people to be tracked AND would allow people who accept the A/C to buy and sell goods.

Or it could just be 666.

Major1 · Jul 4, 2020

Timtofly said:
We have been apostate for some time, and all who attempt to expose Satan become martyrs. Satan is the man of sin. Those who deny that, deny they are the apostate church. You cannot have antichrist, and no more man will call himself Christ. There is a false prophet who will declare who this Satan, beast, man of perdition is. No, I am not a prophet. Satan just is this antichrist, and we need to look for the Lamb of God. The Lord Jesus Christ, who is our Atonement. Not just an Atonement. The Atonement for the whole world. The Holy Spirit and the church would have been feminine in the Bible. It is God or the Lamb who is holding back Satan. The church and the Holy Spirit are neutral. What will be gone at the rapture is the witness of the church and the power of the Holy Spirit. But Satan will still not be loosed as in control, he will just be revealed, along with the false prophet.

Maybe? However, since the Holy Spirit is in fact God, He only indwells the hearts of men, it would then be proper and prudent to say that the Holy Spirit is the restrainer in 2 Thessolians 2.

What will be missing after the Rapture IMHO is the born again believers AND the Holy Spirit as when we leave---He leaves with us.

The Church will still be here and will be full of people looking for answers as to where their loved one went. THAT is what will allow the A/C to come to power as the Holy Spirit in the believers will be absent.

Consider Daniel 12:4...…….
"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

That has the idea that those left behind will be searching the Scriptures to find out what can be known.

Major1 · Jul 4, 2020

Timtofly said:
We have been apostate for some time, and all who attempt to expose Satan become martyrs. Satan is the man of sin. Those who deny that, deny they are the apostate church. You cannot have antichrist, and no more man will call himself Christ. There is a false prophet who will declare who this Satan, beast, man of perdition is. No, I am not a prophet. Satan just is this antichrist, and we need to look for the Lamb of God. The Lord Jesus Christ, who is our Atonement. Not just an Atonement. The Atonement for the whole world. The Holy Spirit and the church would have been feminine in the Bible. It is God or the Lamb who is holding back Satan. The church and the Holy Spirit are neutral. What will be gone at the rapture is the witness of the church and the power of the Holy Spirit. But Satan will still not be loosed as in control, he will just be revealed, along with the false prophet.

Maybe? However, since the Holy Spirit is in fact God, He only indwells the hearts of men, it would then be proper and prudent to say that the Holy Spirit is the restrainer in 2 Thessolians 2.

What will be missing after the Rapture IMHO is the born again believers AND the Holy Spirit as when we leave---He leaves with us.

The Church will still be here and will be full of people looking for answers as to where their loved one went. THAT is what will allow the A/C to come to power as the Holy Spirit in the believers will be absent.

Consider Daniel 12:4...…….
"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

That has the idea that those left behind will be searching the Scriptures to find out what can be known.

Timtofly said:
Or it could just be 666.

5thKingdom · Jul 4, 2020

yeshuaslavejeff said:
This might or might not help.
(1) Are you ready and willing to do whatever the government tells you you have to do if you want to be able to buy food ?

The "mark" of the Beast comes from the "Little Horn" or "False Prophet"....
not from any government.

.

5thKingdom · Jul 4, 2020

Major1 said:
Maybe? However, since the Holy Spirit is in fact God, He only indwells the hearts of men, it would then be proper and prudent to say that the Holy Spirit is the restrainer in 2 Thessolians 2.

What will be missing after the Rapture IMHO is the born again believers AND the Holy Spirit as when we leave---He leaves with us.

The Church will still be here and will be full of people looking for answers as to where their loved one went. THAT is what will allow the A/C to come to power as the Holy Spirit in the believers will be absent.

Consider Daniel 12:4...…….
"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

That has the idea that those left behind will be searching the Scriptures to find out what can be known.

When the Last Saints are "changed" in the "twinkling of an eye" at the last Trump
and the resurrection occurs and Satan and DEATH are destroyed [1Co 15]
what makes you think the world continues?

.

Douggg · Jul 4, 2020

iamlamad said:
You should rather concern yourself with knowing Jesus and the Father, so at the pretrib rapture you will be caught up and not even BE HERE when the mark is created. If you are a bible student at all you should know that the mark will not be created until after the midpoint of the future 70th week of Daniel.

Or the anytime rapture view, should the rapture come after the 70th week begins... but before the mark is created.

Douggg · Jul 4, 2020

Timtofly said:
Or it could just be 666.

666 the number of the beast's name Revelation 13:17
The name of the beast
The mark of his name Revelation 14:11

Everything is tied to the beast's name.

5thKingdom · Jul 4, 2020

Major1 said:
.
Consider Daniel 12:4...…….
"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

That has the idea that those left behind will be searching the Scriptures to find out what can be known.

No, that is the "time-of-the-end" also called the "Season and Time" on earth
AFTER the Fourth Beast or Revelation Beast is destroyed [Dan 7:11-12 and Rev 19:20]
The "knowledge that is increased" is the fact that GOD PROMISED the Truth about Daniel's
prophecies remain "closed-up" and "sealed" to all Saints until the Last Saints "shall understand"
during that "Season and Time" and JESUS PROMISED the Last Saints "shall see ALL these things"
(meaning the fulfillment of Great Tribulation prophecies) in Matthew 24:15 and 24:33...
and the BIBLE PROMISED these same Last Saints shall "prophesy again" about
these "mysteries" as the Seventh Trumpet "begins to sound" [Rev 10:7-11]

.

5thKingdom · Jul 4, 2020

Douggg said:
Or the anytime rapture view, should the rapture come after the 70th week begins... but before the mark is created.

And what exactly is the "mark of the Beast".
We should be able to DEFINE the words we use, don't you think?

Are you aware there were OTHER "Beasts/Kingdoms" before the Revelation Beast?

And they had an "image" and a "mark" just like the LAST Beast.
Is this "news" to you?

.

Timtofly · Jul 4, 2020

Douggg said:
666 the number of the beast's name Revelation 13:17
The name of the beast
The mark of his name Revelation 14:11

Everything is tied to the beast's name.

Revelation 13:18 "This is where wisdom is needed; those who understand should count the number of the beast, for it is the number of a person, and its number is 666."

Gregory Thompson · Jul 4, 2020

DeerGlow said:
This me super paranoid. Is it physical? Is it not? If the devil tricks me, even if it's only for a second to think evilly, am I doomed? How can I be sure I don't have the mark?

I'd imagine it is like the mark of cain.

in terms of fearing getting the mark by getting your nails done you know, just by accident - or getting a tattoo on your forehead by accident when getting a haircut - it's not like that.

It's a mark made where someone becomes allegiant to a nation (or a world government) just so they can buy and sell. So you may be approached, you need this in order to buy houses, food or anything - it is a crystalization of mammon. It answers the question of Jesus, at what price would a man sell his soul?

Avoiding the Mark of the beast

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