Atkins

[zibbler]

Good one man, you never answered a single question with sources, all you did was get defensive and make more assertions. This thread might actually become productive now

Word!

 

[catalyst]

Well that settles it....we're WAY off in beliefs anyway....so have a nice parasite......I mean thread! oink !

Perhaps this will help you.

http://www.wannalearn.com/Online_Course/Critical_Thinking.html

 

[Key Of David]

Good one man, you never answered a single question with sources, all you did was get defensive and make more assertions. This thread might actually become productive now

I never claimed to have them.....I'm not getting into a debate...I don't have the time for it....but I do know what I'm talking about....I don't know maybe I just use my head a little more than some? Who knows. That was regarding the general diet. About the pork....don't go there... I have the Torah....and I'll go 20-something rounds with you over that one. OINK!

 

[Key Of David]

Perhaps this will help you.

http://www.wannalearn.com/Online_Course/Critical_Thinking.html

And may the Yahoveh of Jacob Bless you with whatever good you do have.

 

[catalyst]

And may the Yahoveh of Jacob Bless you with whatever good you do have.

Can you support your assertions?

 

[catalyst]

I never claimed to have them.....I'm not getting into a debate...I don't have the time for it....but I do know what I'm talking about...

'

This is open to dispute. You do not seem to understand the basic principles of logic, the scientific method, or research and corroborative evidence. Oddly enough, sound dietary practice is based on all of those.

 

[Mandi N.]

the way i understand it, you will lose weight on the atkins diet.

but substituting protiens for carbs will knock YEARS off your life!

 

[Key Of David]

Can you support your assertions?

Support my assertions? Um....ok....hey if you don't want the blessings of Father there's plenty to give to someone else and there are plenty who want them....have a great day!

 

[Key Of David]

'

This is open to dispute. You do not seem to understand the basic principles of logic, the scientific method, or research and corroborative evidence. Oddly enough, sound dietary practice is based on all of those.

What that I know what I'm talking about? You don't know me or my educational background...and simply because I haven't spilled it out for you doesn't mean I'm stupid. Maybe you should tell that to some little college freshman willing to put up with all that....who is obviously going to be open to thinking he's going to learn something from someone with such a pompous attitude torwards diet.

 

[catalyst]

It has nothing to do with your educational background. It has to do with your lack of understanding of the basic principles which I mentioned. If you understand them, you are clearly failing to use them, and this is even worse, IMO, as well as inherently dishonest.

Why can you not support your assertions? This is one of the basic principles of deductive logic as well as the scientific method.

It is really very simple.

 

[feral]

The Inuit Indians (Northen Canada & Alaska) have survived for thousands of years eating virtually nothing but meat and fat.

Good news, especially since I am part Aleut. I'm starting on the Atkins program Monday. Had to get the go ahead from my doctor since I'm on meds. He doesn't think I need to lose but that's just him

 

[catalyst]

One thing you may wish to do, if you have not already, is get a bodyfat analysis done by a competent professional. Do not focus so much on weight but rather on bodyfat. In the long run, it is far more beneficial.

 

[pelham]

I tried Atkins for three months the end or 2003 and I lost six pounds and got stuck. I soon became frustrated and started eating whatever I wanted and when I did I dropped another four pounds. I am attempting to start again. I saw a Dateline special report that had a person there that went through my situation. This time I will decrease my caloric intake slowly. I was eating close to nothing and excercising and frustraited because nothing else would happen. I am starting over now. I hope it is better this time. I don't care at all for salads. My bag

 

[Beastt]

I think its a healthy diet if you follow the directions from the book. Many people still think that it's all about eating nothing but meat, but that's just the early stages of it. Later on, you add in vegetables as you like.

I eat a large salad with grilled chicken for lunch most often. When I'm out with others, they usually say something like, "hey, I thought you were doing the Atkins. You taking a cheat day or something?" Many people don't realize that it's mainly during the induction phase that meat is the primary calorie source. In the different phases more and more natural carbs are added in to the diet as you wish. For instance, I'll even have a banana or some dates for breakfast -- although I don't each much fruit because the majority of them commercially bought are genetically engineered to be sweeter and with less fiber than nature intended. If you don't believe me, go find an apple tree or blackberry vine and start eating. They're usually pretty bitter and so loaded with fiber that eating several can cause a bit of upset stomach and irregularity if you aren't careful. So to the people who say a diet in mainly fruits is healthy, I disagree because most fruits that are bought are not considered to be what nature intended.

More and more doctors are paying attention to the research and reports from nutritionists and other scientists. Basically, the maintenance phase of Atkins is a diet that is devoid of processed carbohydrates. I don't know how anyone can say that this is unhealthy. But everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

The people who say these diets are unhealthy because of cholesterol are ignoring basic biochemistry (and the recent research findings). Those who say the diet is hard on kidneys, the research is clear that an Atkins diet might not be a good idea if you have pre-existing kidney problems. Other than that, if the book directions are followed and someone gets a medical check-up before starting then there appears to be little, if any evidence that it's an unhealthy diet.


Anyone who does the Atkins short term is a fad dieter and will probably be unhappy in the long run.

Anyone receive those e'mails that promise $1,500 per day, working from your home? Anyone believe that there isn't a catch? If you don't jump into such ads, it's because they sound too good to be true. From the research I've done, this is a pretty fair comparison to the Atkins diet. It promises weight loss while eating all you like, as long as you eat certain foods and avoid others but the foods you're allowed to eat are very popular with most people anyway. All of this and no risk!

The initial stage of Atkins has one thing in mind, to put the body into a state of ketosis. It may help here to check a few definitions for those who may not be completely familiar with the terminology;

According to the Mosby Medical Encyclopedia;

ketosis an abnormal accumulation of ketones in the body tissues and fluid. This condition occurs in starvation, occasionally in pregnancy, and most frequently, in diabetes mellitus. ...untreated, ketosis may progress to ketoacidosis, coma and death.

ketone bodies a group name for ketones, substances produced in the body through a normal change fats undergo in the liver. They are used as fuel in muscles. Excessive production of these bodies leads to their excretion in urine, as in diabetes mellitus. Also called acetone bodies.

ketogenic diet a diet that is high in fats and low in carbohydrates.

Ketones, in themselves are perfectly natural. Anytime the body breaks down fats to produce energy, ketones are produced. The problem is that when pushed to a state of ketosis, the body has been forced to burn large quantities of fat because insufficient carbohydrates are present. The level of ketones in the body rises sharply. Carbohydrates are the body's preferred fuel and burning fat at such a rate presents some hazards. As we've all heard at some point in our life, moderation is key. Atkins and other, similar diets forego moderation in exchange for rapid results despite the potential for harm. As one web-based source put it;

"When the body metabolizes fats and proteins in the absence of essential carbohydrates, toxic byproducts are produced. These by-products are known as ketones or ketone bodies. When these build up to a high enough level in the body, an abnormal state known as ketosis is created. Those on high-protein diets desire ketosis, although it is abnormal and unsafe. They can tell by the way they feel, in fact, that they are going into ketosis because they feel a "high," and when they feel this "high," they know their high-protein diets are effective. In actual fact, this feeling heralds the beginning of a state of starvation."

I can't vouch for all of the claims made but I think the basics are there and reasonably accurate. Also consider that by pretty much anyone's standards, people in developed countries, such as the U.S., consume many times the necessary level of protein. This excess protein has been linked to some faily common diseases such as osteoporosis and some forms of kidney disease. People will often argue that the kidneys continue to function at a "normal level". This is because the kidneys contain far more of the active tissues (nephrons in the lumen), than are required for normal functioning. Kidneys with only 1/4 to 1/3 of their original tissues processing blood in a normal manner will still show normal function. The point is that despite this apparent normalcy, kidney tissue has been destroyed in large quantities. Anyone with a predisposition toward kidney problems or anyone who has already lost kidney tissue, such as a kidney donor or one who has suffered an injury to the kidneys either from trauma, infection or disease may find themselves with insufficient kidney function. How much of your kidney tissue are you willing to sacrafice? The odds are already 1 in 10 in the U.S. that you will suffer some significant loss of kidney function. Adding to the already significant over-consumption of protein isn't going to do anyone any good.

The increased consumption of the foods popular for those on the Atkins diet causes a sharp increase in the intake of fat, cholesterol, hormones, antibiotics, steroids, organo-halogens and chlorinated hydrocarbon pesticides to name but a few. The idea that people are being convinced that this is healthy is awful.

Though there are disputes concerning the death of Dr. Atkins, himself, what is known and not debated is that he weighed 258 pounds when he died. The defense for this is that the extra weight, which qualified him as obese was the result of fluid retention caused by nearly complete systemic shut down. I'm no doctor but I would think that if I had a patient who had gained 60 pounds in 8-days due to fluid retention, I would have taken some steps, be it dialysis or some other method, to decrease the fluid build-up in the tissues. I'm not sure how long doctors would think such fluid retention could continue without resulting in severe CHF and eventual cardiac failure. Speaking of cardiac failure, Dr. Atkin's medical reports made note of significant events due to heart disease. He was already suffering from CHF (congestive heart failure). Again, in defense, it was stated that he suffered from cardiomyopathy rather than atherosclerosis, though since his family would not allow an autopsy, this may never be confirmed.

If such a diet were safe, it's unlikely that it would be so strongly recommended that the term of the diet be adhered to so strictly. People report no significant rise in cholesterol levels while on the diet but some people exceed the recommended term of the diet and begin to see sharp rises in cholesterol levels. If you ingest more cholesterol, you'll exhibit a higher serum cholesterol level. Some early studies on cholesterol determined that cholesterol intake was not linked to serum cholesterol levels. These studies were done with injections of crystalline cholesterol devoid of fats. It was later learned that when cholesterol is ingest along with fats, as occurs in eating foods high in cholesterol, the serum cholesterol levels do rise. Industries which profit from promoting such foods are quick to point out the earlier, invalidated tests as proof that their products are healthy. It has also been learned that once cholesterol ingestion exceeds 400 to 800 milligrams per day, additional cholesterol has only a minor effect on cholesterol levels.

Since the term of the diet must be strictly adhered to, then those following the diet will find themselves quickly returning to their former diet which caused them to need to lose weight in the first place. It's an unending cycle and signficant evidence suggests that it is not a healthy one.

 

[Beastt]

Hmmm, editing seems to have a few tricks involved and deleting doesn't seem to be an option in case of a double-post.

Sorry for the wasted space.

 

[Beastt]

The Inuit Indians (Northen Canada & Alaska) have survived for thousands of years eating virtually nothing but meat and fat.

I wish to applaud you for realizing that there is much to be learned from the way diet has affected isolated groups of people around the world. This is perhaps a very key bit of information which shouldn't be quickly dismissed. Looking into how diet appears to have affected different peoples from different regions gives us an indication of how diet might well affect us. The affect of certain genetic factors as well as lifestyle hardship factors may be difficult to include and quantify but overall, this type of information may be very telling. So lets look a bit more deeply into the subject. The information is important enough that research has already been done to let us look more broadly into the diets of specific peoples and the longevity that they enjoy:

The Russian Caucasians, Yucatan Indians, East Indian Todas and Pakistan Hunzakuts have life expectancies of 90 to 100 years. They subsist on diets including little or no animal flesh.

The Eskimos, the Laplanders, the Greenlanders and the Russian Kurgi tribes stand out as populations with the highest animal consumption in the world and also as the populations with the lowest life expectancies, often only about 30 years.