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Atheists, What's the point?

pgp_protector

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If you're an atheist, that is, of course, your right.

It stands to reason that I'm right.

Whether you just don't like the Abrahamic God, or you think the idea of a creator is bunk, that's all well and good.

I make no distinction between any of the gods, but since this is a Christian site it is usually the Abrahamic God that is in question here, you see Christians do not tend to question the validity of all the other gods, they are atheistic and indifferent toward them in the same way as us atheists.


I'm convinced that God is real. Moreover, I'm convinced that Jesus was a zombie and that he was God Incarnate. I've given my beliefs a great deal of examination and went through a period where I was an atheist. Most atheists I know have no problem with that.

I dont have a problem with that either.

I do know some atheists, though, and I know a lot of atheists on this forum, who have a problem with blind faith in God. I have to ask, why?

Because poor judgement is a by-product of blind faith.

Why would you try to 'convert' someone to atheism?

I wouldn't.

I'm not trying to shut you up, I'm genuinely curious. From a theistic standpoint, conversion makes sense, because there is a benefit to those who know and believe the truth, and therefore a moral imperative on the part of believers to spread it. But most atheists (that I know)do not advocate or preach atheism.

From an A-theistic standpoint, conversion makes sense, because there is a benefit to those who know and believe the truth, and therefore a moral imperative on the part of non-believers to spread it.

What does an atheist get out of spreading atheism?

The satisfaction of "saving" someone from delusion I guess. I don't know because I don't advocate atheism.

Religion helps many people get through their daily struggles. It helps those who would otherwise give in to existentialism or despair find purpose. It comforts the grieving in a way that pure science tends not to.

That is one reason why I support religion, another reason is because some Christians have admitted to me that they would very likely commit immoral acts if it wasn't for their religion preventing them from doing so.

What possible purpose is there for convincing someone God isn't real?
Even if you were correct (which I don't believe, but let's pretend), at best you would be like a playground bully who tells another kid that his imaginary friend isn't real.

Its not bullying behavior to bring people back to reality.

Being correct doesn't make that a good thing to do, and it certainly doesn't make it a nice thing to do.

Uncomfortable truths are not nice, but they are better than consoling lies.

Moreover, convincing someone God isn't real doesn't have any of the benefits of dissuading someone from believing in an imaginary friend. You can't function in society while talking about your imaginary friend; you can while talking about God.

That is because when a few people suffer from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion. Extraordinary claims are more acceptable when a cult becomes of a religion.

Eventually, at some early point in life, a schoolboy will learn that his friend is not real, and you could make the argument that the earlier, the better. That is not true of religion. It is not inevitable, or even particularly likely, that a given man will "grow out of" his religion.

After 30 years as a Christian, I am proof a man can "grow out of" his religion.

And why should he? As I said before, it gives one solace and comfort. Why try to take that away from him?

I dont know any atheists who want to take away a theists comfort blanket.
 
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madaz

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Just wondering, what's an atheist group do? 0_o

I belong to three groups.

The main group trains and provides humanist chaplain's to public schools, and also fund raises for legal challenges.

The second group provides food to homeless people (we feed 120 a day)

The third group is small (14 members mostly from the other two groups) and we just socialize once a month family bbq at beach or whatever.
 
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I Eat Pie

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I belong to three groups.

The main group trains and provides humanist chaplain's to public schools, and also fund raises for legal challenges.

The second group provides food to homeless people (we feed 120 a day)

The third group is small (14 members mostly from the other two groups) and we just socialize once a month family bbq at beach or whatever.

Sounds like a blast :D. It's just that since it had the word atheist in it, I thought it was just an anti-religious group.
 
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madaz

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Sounds like a blast :D. It's just that since it had the word atheist in it, I thought it was just an anti-religious group.

Atheism isnt anti-religion, but I know some who are, yea Im living the dream and loving it!
 
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Gadarene

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If you're an atheist, that is, of course, your right. Whether you just don't like the Abrahamic God, or you think the idea of a creator is bunk, that's all well and good. I'm convinced that God is real. Moreover, I'm convinced that Jesus was a zombie and that he was God Incarnate. I've given my beliefs a great deal of examination and went through a period where I was an atheist. Most atheists I know have no problem with that.

I do know some atheists, though, and I know a lot of atheists on this forum, who have a problem with blind faith in God. I have to ask, why?

Because it's utterly baseless.

Why would you try to 'convert' someone to atheism?

Because it's the stance best supported by the evidence (or rather, the lack of evidence).

I'm not trying to shut you up, I'm genuinely curious. From a theistic standpoint, conversion makes sense, because there is a benefit to those who know and believe the truth, and therefore a moral imperative on the part of believers to spread it. What does an atheist get out of spreading atheism?

I've confronted plenty of other wrong ideas in my time. Yours are hardly so special they warrant exclusive kid-glove treatment.

Religion helps many people get through their daily struggles. It helps those who would otherwise give in to existentialism or despair find purpose. It comforts the grieving in a way that pure science tends not to.

So do drugs. What of it?

What possible purpose is there for convincing someone God isn't real?
Even if you were correct (which I don't believe, but let's pretend), at best you would be like a playground bully who tells another kid that his imaginary friend isn't real.

More like a parent telling their kid that Santa Claus isn't real.

Anyone can poison the well with a given choice of analogy. Come on.

Being correct doesn't make that a good thing to do, and it certainly doesn't make it a nice thing to do.

Erm....yes, it arguably is. Correcting someone of their error is not cruelty.

I point out that theism is wrong, because to me, going "oh well, they clearly need this silly false belief" is a worse option - it's the far more patronising, paternalistic option.

Moreover, convincing someone God isn't real doesn't have any of the benefits of dissuading someone from believing in an imaginary friend. You can't function in society while talking about your imaginary friend; you can while talking about God.

Which likely shows that some imaginary friends are simply more normative a set of beliefs than others.

Eventually, at some early point in life, a schoolboy will learn that his friend is not real, and you could make the argument that the earlier, the better. That is not true of religion. It is not inevitable, or even particularly likely, that a given man will "grow out of" his religion.

And why should he? As I said before, it gives one solace and comfort. Why try to take that away from him?

Because it's baseless.

You can either fool yourself with unrealistic standards about a chap in the sky who will forgive you every wrong and give you a super numero uno happy fun times prize at the end of your life if you talk to him nicely, or you can actually adjust your standards to be in line with what we know about reality.
 
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Gadarene

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And I agree with that. But, as I've said before, and will say until the day I die, stupid will always find a way. Rational isn't incompatible with Christianity. Would you cut off a toe to cure a hangnail?

No, sorry, you don't get to do this.

You don't get to put the stuff you find personally reprehensible done by other Christians in some other category.

Take the good with the bad. This is like how Christians use "religion" as code for negative Christianity and then deny furiously that Christianity is a religion at all.
 
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madaz

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Sounds like a blast :D. It's just that since it had the word atheist in it, I thought it was just an anti-religious group.

The leader of my great nation has pledged hundreds of millions of dollars towards religious education as well as a chaplaincy programs in public schools across all states, she is an atheist. Is that anti-religious?
 
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Paradoxum

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And why should he? As I said before, it gives one solace and comfort. Why try to take that away from him?

I don't tend to argue against Christianity that much. On here I am mostly arguing against what I consider immoral beliefs. But I think that my morals are compatible with Christianity.

The reason I would be in favour of the increase of atheism, would be that falsity leads to immorality. It would be ok if someone just believed in an imaginary friend, but it becomes a problem when the imaginary friend tells the person to attack other children... and they do it.

Christians seem more likely to try to oppose just changes in the law. eg: being against stem cell research (which could save people), abortion (taking away bodily integrity), the 'right to die' (forcing the old and sick to suffer unnecessarily and against their will), drugs (taking away minor liberties), same-sex marriage (anti-equality under the law).

Then there is the concern for truth. The importance of science, for example.
 
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