At Crossroads -- Cf's Vision - Poll Vote only here

Lindon Tinuviel · Jul 28, 2007

StarJewel said:
It's kind of scary that the second option is winning so much. I hope we don't get back to CF which judges some Christians as better and deserving more rights than other Christians...

If we do switch back, I suppose we could always simply defy them and raise as big a ruckus as certain others have.

Maynard Keenan · Jul 28, 2007

I agree with many others - there is no need to vote on two extremes. The problem with being too open and changing our name is that we cease to be what we are and become something totally different. The problem with being too restrictive is that it gets hard to define what "Christian" is because, obviously, any of the hundreds of different kinds of Christians will say that they are the ones who are correct, and in the end many Christians feel shut out.

I think some of the recent reforms were good and some are just not feasible. I don't think something this large or with this many anonymous members can be a direct democracy. I like the idea of voting for mods, and having mod forums be open. I like the idea of polling members for their thoughts and having different rules for different forums based on their membership. But I'd have the forum leadership make the final decisions, not a wiki of all the members where ANYONE can jump in and mess things up. I think Christians only forums should go somewhere in between where they used to be and the limbo they're in now. All non-Christians should be barred from debating in all CO forums. Congregational forums should be open to fellowship posts from non-Christians. If a Muslim or an atheist had genuine questions about Catholicism, I'd want that they could come directly to us in OBOB. Mods should have the power to forum-ban those who abuse the privilege. We should definitely keep our name, CF.

Since my vision falls somewhat in between option one and two, I won't be voting.

.Sabre. · Jul 28, 2007

StarJewel said:
It's kind of scary that the second option is winning so much. I hope we don't get back to CF which judges some Christians as better and deserving more rights than other Christians...

I agree with ya there, tiger. Voted Option 1.

Windmill · Jul 28, 2007

For me, the "democracy" rules outweigh the benefits of say, less restrictions on who is christian and who isn't for example. I think the current rule system will just crumble, and thats not good.

Victory of the Cross · Jul 28, 2007

Brimshack said:
Speaking of unfair comparisons?

Are those in charge of CF your "masters" now? And if so, how on earth does your own vision of control amount to anything less? A kind master is still a master. I'm sorry, but it looks very much as though total an complete control is the only thing you can envision at this moment.

Brim you know me, you know what i want, I want Members treated fairly, all members, including staff.

The current system is driving members away from cf by the droves, the wiki is full of lobbyists whom bully others to get what they want

Myself want control of CF? not interested at all, i despise CF, a complete and utter waste of a year of my life moderating this place

Yet due to some maybe misplaced loyalty some little part of Cf, i want a fair system installed

Steffi can tell you of my "Ideal" Forum management system,sadly it never got to be tested anywhere

yet it called for equal rights to all religion (or lack of) members (staff,policy,etc) , without removing Christian Safe havens

Victory of the Cross · Jul 28, 2007

Agnosticteen said:
Well if that's the case, hopefully Saleucami's lowered his, because it's just as cheap, getting inactive voters to vote is just as meaningless as making sock accounts and having them vote multiple times.

Inactive votes? who said Inactive myfriend
I said Former Staffers, many whom have paid hundreds of hours into keeping Cf working for these past years

As for my Rep on CF, I don't frankly give a darn.

CF is nothing more than an corrupt excuse for a forum, that is more focused on one-man-up-ship than creating a real community

And i suggest you do a little more research into people before you attack them

I have put more into cf than you will ever manage to do, hundreds of hours, near thousands in moderating this place

once you match that then we can talk

Axver · Jul 28, 2007

Saleucami said:
The current system is driving members away from cf by the droves

People keep saying that, and yet whenever I'm here, there are 2,000+ people online. I remember when I first began posting here, hitting 800 was notable.

And the current system drew me back. You could probably count on one hand the amount of times I posted here this year prior to 07/07. I've now posted some 230 times in the last 3 weeks. And I know I'm not the only person who has returned to regular posting or branched out to new areas. The new system may have driven some away, but it's pulling plenty in as well.

Victory of the Cross · Jul 28, 2007

Axver said:
People keep saying that, and yet whenever I'm here, there are 2,000+ people online. I remember when I first began posting here, hitting 800 was notable.

And the current system drew me back. You could probably count on one hand the amount of times I posted here this year prior to 07/07. I've now posted some 230 times in the last 3 weeks. And I know I'm not the only person who has returned to regular posting or branched out to new areas. The new system may have driven some away, but it's pulling plenty in as well.

Yet the quality of those lost is what counts. we lost alot of good people, people whom Erwin owes alot to, for keeping this monster-sized forum alive and running

P_G
D'Ann
Newman99 just those 3 alone outweigh any and all of the current returns combined

add to those the hundreds of others and you have a large loss my friend

joyshirley · Jul 28, 2007

This may sound silly, but since so many folk are not happy with either option, including me, could we perhaps start another poll which allows one to vote yes or no as to whether we feel these two options should be the only two options given, linking that poll to this thread. If more folk were to vote no in that poll than have voted either way in this poll, then Erwin would surely go with that and allow further discussion and suggestions where some sort of middle ground could be reached, because he said in his opening post.....

I'm going to leave this up to the community. I've extended the above poll to 3rd of August.

I will listen to the members here, and will defer to the final decision.

So the final decision of the community need not necessarily be for the options here in this poll, but for further discussion and suggestions.

I suggested another poll cos of one or two posts here where folk wondered if Erwin would read this entire thread, or just go straight to the poll results.

Just an idea.....

Athene · Jul 28, 2007

I voted for option 1 because 2 sounds too much like going back to the bad old days. Both options are far too polarised - I think we should look for a middle ground, and no I don't think we're in the middle here - we're in some kind of limbo neither here nor there really.

Axver · Jul 28, 2007

Saleucami said:
Yet the quality of those lost is what counts. we lost alot of good people, people whom Erwin owes alot to, for keeping this monster-sized forum alive and running

P_G
D'Ann
Newman99 just those 3 alone outweigh any and all of the current returns combined

add to those the hundreds of others and you have a large loss my friend

Wow, aren't you a nice person? I'm not going to make any comment on the quality of the people who have left/returned, because I think it's rather tactless to post that Poster X is somehow a better person than Poster Y (especially when I have had less experience with Poster Y).

I also love how you keep emphasising and bragging that you have put time into this forum. Just because you were once a moderator doesn't mean your opinion has any more worth than that of "inferior" types such as myself who have felt marginalised and been made to feel unwelcome in the past.

Why don't we just give the new system time to prove itself? It seems to be working. Everywhere I post/lurk, I haven't seen any significant problems.

rocklife · Jul 28, 2007

BelindaP said:
Please don't paint us all that way. Only those who think they are losing something would resort to cheating. It will be interesting when the IP checks are done and the socks and their owners are outed in the report threads.

for the record, there are 3 different people who use this computer at my house, so our IP would have 3 votes, but we are 3 different people. So far only one of us has voted. I just want to share, and I am a Christian and will be honest to vote once only. (just to explain for Belinda's post, thanks for listening)

rocklife · Jul 28, 2007

Axver said:
People keep saying that, and yet whenever I'm here, there are 2,000+ people online. I remember when I first began posting here, hitting 800 was notable.

And the current system drew me back. You could probably count on one hand the amount of times I posted here this year prior to 07/07. I've now posted some 230 times in the last 3 weeks. And I know I'm not the only person who has returned to regular posting or branched out to new areas. The new system may have driven some away, but it's pulling plenty in as well.

I help out on another forum, and our experience is there are lot of spying spambots that may be influencing that 2000+ user number. It's mostly spambots on our other site, I wouldn't be surprised if that is a large number of supposed users (just from my experience and some posts I've read from other staff)

Lindon Tinuviel · Jul 28, 2007

Most of them are spiders, actually.

http://www.christianforums.com/t5757514-maybe-we-should-ban-socks-while-we-are-at-it.html

But, unless the number of spiders has increased proportionally to the number of people who've left, the amount of actual visitors is about the same as it was pre-reform.

Followers4christ · Jul 28, 2007

I voted for Option 2. Because this is and should always be a CHRISTIAN SITE.God Bless

2 Corinthians 6:14-18 Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? What harmony is there between Christ and Belial ? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever? What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people."

"Therefore come out from them
and be separate, says the Lord.
Touch no unclean thing,
and I will receive you."
"I will be a Father to you,
and you will be my sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty."

IBLuke226 · Jul 28, 2007

no vote for me.

Both areas are wrong IMO

The Good News needs to be proclaimed to the world.

Scripture gives warning to the altering and changing of The Word. Just as the jewish leaders altered the OT after the Lords earthy manifestation, to remove the mesianic promises that where forfilled, others have altered the books of the NT to make for denominations created by man.

He will judge all that is true and all that is false in His Time. I will not be the judge of any of these issues. No pole will solve these issues.

The webmaster is responceable for his site, we each are held accountable for our deeds and actions.

I see not how an athiest can have that view of an upcoming final judgement, if they are a true athiest (no God), so they can voice oppinions without reguards to our belief in it.

I see athiests that act more in loving kindness than some that claim Christ. I see why some of us are called pharises, trying to instill the "law" on others instead of the intent of the "law", that we are fallen mankind in need of our Redeamer.

Erwin, it is your site, Pray and ask guidence, and then make the choice where your site goes.

Thank you for the time,
Carl

cygnusx1 · Jul 28, 2007

got as far as page 12 , man how difficult can it be to sail a boat !

by the time this boat sails the fish will all be gone .

No wonder I think many here are feeling like the hermit Anthony --- wicki and a zillion rules will do that!

Dust and Ashes · Jul 28, 2007

I didn't see a place to vote for option 1.5.

JimfromOhio · Jul 28, 2007

I have voted

JimfromOhio · Jul 28, 2007

Christian Forum is an "Online Ministry" that is different, special and unique. If we are going back to the way we were, then I would know my own decision.

At Crossroads -- Cf's Vision - Poll Vote only here

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