Ask a physicist anything. (2)

[Chesterton]

Causality has been put through the wringer in light of modern scientific advances, so I don't put much truck in what my intuition tells me.

Do you mean that there's no such thing as causality, or do you mean that when we can't detect causality we make an assumption that it's not there?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

I believe "Big Expansion" would be a better term.

It would indeed.

According to the Bible, the universe will end with a "big bang".

I thought it would be replaced by a New Heaven and Earth?

A sin of commission is an act we commit that we shouldn't; a sin of omission is an act we don't commit that we should.

Just Adam.

Why not Eve? She ate the fruit first, tempted Adam with it, etc.

Yes, but there's a technicality with babies; see below.

No --- a baby is born a sinner, but in a state of innocence.

When a baby (or mentally-challenged) person dies, they will be accepted into Heaven on a technicality.

We call this technicality "the age of accountability" --- that time in a person's life when they know and understand right from wrong.

When does one reach the 'age of accountability'? Or does it vary from person to person (like, say, puberty)?
If someone's committed no sins by the time they've died, even after reaching the age of accountability, do they automatically enter Heaven? Or do they have to be Christian (unlike babies)?
Does this 'age of accountability' have any Biblical basis?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Do you mean that there's no such thing as causality, or do you mean that when we can't detect causality we make an assumption that it's not there?

There's such a thing as causality, but it's not universally binding. Some events are caused by causes, but not all events.

At least, according to the standard interpretation of quantum mechanics.

 

[Chesterton]

There's such a thing as causality, but it's not universally binding. Some events are caused by causes, but not all events.

At least, according to the standard interpretation of quantum mechanics.

But has this been proven or is it an assumption?

 

[AV1611VET]

I thought it would be replaced by a New Heaven and Earth?

Just before God started creating, the amount of mass/energy in existence was zero.

Over a six-day period, the amount of mass/energy was raised to its current level.

At this point, God instituted the Law of Conservation (1st Law of Thermodynamics?) and rested (ceased from His work).

This means that God locked in the amount of mass/energy that was to exist forever and ever.

Because of the Fall, the universe is now "winding down" toward thermal equilibrium.

God is going to intervene before it reaches maximum entropy, separate all the atoms (with a great noise), then rearrange them into a New Heaven and a New Earth.

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Someone might ask, "Why doesn't God just annihilate everything and start over?"

I believe that's because when He created the universe, He created it to last forever, and no amount of sin or science is going to intervene.

Why not Eve? She ate the fruit first, tempted Adam with it, etc.

By making Adam the federal head of the human race, God made Jesus Christ ("Second Adam") the Head of the Church.

Had He not done that, then Jesus Christ would have to come back and be crucified for each and every person that reaches the age of accountability.

Eve was tricked --- Adam wasn't.

When does one reach the 'age of accountability'? Or does it vary from person to person (like, say, puberty)?

It varies based on mentality and upbringing.

If someone's committed no sins by the time they've died, even after reaching the age of accountability, do they automatically enter Heaven?

No, they need cleansed of their Sin Nature.

As I said --- hypothetically --- if a person were never to have committed a sin, they would still go to Hell when they die.

Or do they have to be Christian (unlike babies)?

Let's put it this way --- they would have to be 'born again' (converted).

Does this 'age of accountability' have any Biblical basis?

Yes.

And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

But has this been proven or is it an assumption?

Neither. It's been verified through about 100 years of evidence (namely, anything that verifies quantum mechanics), so it's extremely well-evidenced, so it's more than an assumption, but not quite proven.

 

[chilehed]

...Humans are inherently evil. Therefore sin.

That statement is inconsistent with Catholic teaching. It's actually a product of Reformation theology.

But this isn't a theology thread.

 

[Chesterton]

Neither. It's been verified through about 100 years of evidence...

What has been verified?

 

[chilehed]

Neither. It's been verified through about 100 years of evidence (namely, anything that verifies quantum mechanics), so it's extremely well-evidenced, so it's more than an assumption, but not quite proven.

It seems to me that, in order to definitively prove that "a lack of evidence for a cause means that there is no cause", one must first prove that "all causes are observable".

 

[AV1611VET]

That statement is inconsistent with Catholic teaching.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the Catholics believe that a person is born pure, and then becomes a sinner when he commits his first sin?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

It seems to me that, in order to definitively prove that "a lack of evidence for a cause means that there is no cause", one must first prove that "all causes are observable".

Among other things, yes. Of course, no scientist worth his salt would say that a lack of evidence for X proves that X doesn't exist.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

What has been verified?

Quantum mechanic's stubborn disregard for our intuitive understanding of causality.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Just before God started creating, the amount of mass/energy in existence was zero.

Over a six-day period, the amount of mass/energy was raised to its current level.

At this point, God instituted the Law of Conservation (1st Law of Thermodynamics?) and rested (ceased from His work).

This means that God locked in the amount of mass/energy that was to exist forever and ever.

Because of the Fall, the universe is now "winding down" toward thermal equilibrium.

God is going to intervene before it reaches maximum entropy, separate all the atoms (with a great noise), then rearrange them into a New Heaven and a New Earth.

Someone might ask, "Why doesn't God just annihilate everything and start over?"

I believe that's because when He created the universe, He created it to last forever, and no amount of sin or science is going to intervene.By making Adam the federal head of the human race, God made Jesus Christ ("Second Adam") the Head of the Church.

Had He not done that, then Jesus Christ would have to come back and be crucified for each and every person that reaches the age of accountability.

Or God could have snapped his fingers, forgiven us all, and that'd be that.

Eve was tricked --- Adam wasn't.

Good point.

No, they need cleansed of their Sin Nature.

As I said --- hypothetically --- if a person were never to have committed a sin, they would still go to Hell when they die. Let's put it this way --- they would have to be 'born again' (converted).

What about someone who has no way to become born again?

 

[chilehed]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the Catholics believe that a person is born pure, and then becomes a sinner when he commits his first sin?

Not exactly, but there is indeed a distinction drawn between original sin and personal sin.

We believe that humanity was created in a state of original holiness which was lost in the fall. From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

By yielding to the tempter, Adam and Eve committed a personal sin, but this sin affected the human nature that they would then transmit in a fallen state. It is a sin which will be transmitted by propagation to all mankind, that is, by the transmission of a human nature deprived of original holiness and justice. And that is why original sin is called "sin" only in an analogical sense: it is a sin "contracted" and not "committed"—a state and not an act.​

The Catechism goes on to say:

Although it is proper to each individual, original sin does not have the character of a personal fault in any of Adam's descendants. It is a deprivation of original holiness and justice, but human nature has not been totally corrupted: it is wounded in the natural powers proper to it; subject to ignorance, suffering, and the dominion of death; and inclined to sin—an inclination to evil that is called "concupiscence."​

In other words, Catholic teaching is that humans are inherently good, but broken.

This is not at all the same as the concept of original sin that arose out of the Reformation. Non-Catholics use the same term, but what they mean by it is very, very different.

 

[Chesterton]

Quantum mechanic's stubborn disregard for our intuitive understanding of causality.

Quantum mechanics aligns pretty well with ancient Hebrew monotheism then, eh? (They say God is uncaused.)

 

[chilehed]

Among other things, yes. Of course, no scientist worth his salt would say that a lack of evidence for X proves that X doesn't exist.

Which is why I take issue with statements such as "pair production out of a vacuum is uncaused".

Note that I'm not claiming that you've said any such thing.

The best we can validly say is "we are not able to observe a cause".

 

[chilehed]

Quantum mechanics aligns pretty well with ancient Hebrew monotheism then, eh? (They say God is uncaused.)

I don't think that I'd say that.

 

[Chesterton]

I don't think that I'd say that.

Yeah, I wouldn't say it either, but I'm trying to see if I can get him to say it.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Quantum mechanics aligns pretty well with ancient Hebrew monotheism then, eh? (They say God is uncaused.)

But they don't say God was ever non-existent, or that God popped into being without any prior cause.
Plus, pretty much every deity and pantheon is supposed to be uncaused.
And even if they were the same, it's one quantum mechanical consequence among many; they may agree in some parts, but not in others. QV our ongoing discussion regarding QM and Omniscience (which I will reply to, one of these days).

 

[pgp_protector]

Q.
Is the cat alive?