Ark of covenant was there in temple when Jesus died?

[dad]

The reasons I have seen so far why the ark of the covenant would have been missing hundreds of years before Christ don't seem to hold water. For example they say that the last place where the ark was mentioned was Jer 3. The problem is that is talking about the future, and 'in those days' which many familiar with prophesy will recognize pretty fast.

So, my opinion for the time being, unless evidence is produced that warrants a change, is that the ark was there when Jesus died, and at that moment was taken to heaven. Perhaps someone thinks they can make a strong case to the contrary?

 

[Strathos]

I don't think anyone will know where it is or where it went unless someone actually finds it.

 

[HTacianas]

The reasons I have seen so far why the ark of the covenant would have been missing hundreds of years before Christ don't seem to hold water. For example they say that the last place where the ark was mentioned was Jer 3. The problem is that is talking about the future, and 'in those days' which many familiar with prophesy will recognize pretty fast.

So, my opinion for the time being, unless evidence is produced that warrants a change, is that the ark was there when Jesus died, and at that moment was taken to heaven. Perhaps someone thinks they can make a strong case to the contrary?

I can make a strong case to the contrary by pointing out that there is no reason whatever to believe the ark was in the temple at the time of Jesus. Jews do not claim that the ark was there. The Arch of Titus depicts the menorah from the temple but no ark. There is no record of the ark being carried away by the Romans after the temple was destroyed.

 

[Thess]

The reasons I have seen so far why the ark of the covenant would have been missing hundreds of years before Christ don't seem to hold water. For example they say that the last place where the ark was mentioned was Jer 3. The problem is that is talking about the future, and 'in those days' which many familiar with prophesy will recognize pretty fast.

So, my opinion for the time being, unless evidence is produced that warrants a change, is that the ark was there when Jesus died, and at that moment was taken to heaven. Perhaps someone thinks they can make a strong case to the contrary?

I think that's really interesting. I like thinkers, providing it's the Spirit within. haha - But it really is interesting and hadn't thought about this. I'm interested in anything else you might discover about this, or other cool thoughts. I love to listen to everything.

 

[Lulav]

The reasons I have seen so far why the ark of the covenant would have been missing hundreds of years before Christ don't seem to hold water. For example they say that the last place where the ark was mentioned was Jer 3. The problem is that is talking about the future, and 'in those days' which many familiar with prophesy will recognize pretty fast.

So, my opinion for the time being, unless evidence is produced that warrants a change, is that the ark was there when Jesus died, and at that moment was taken to heaven. Perhaps someone thinks they can make a strong case to the contrary?

There have been studies about this and that before the captivity into Babylon it was removed to safekeeping. Jeremiah was believed to have been involved and some think he took it to Egypt. There of course is the belief that the Ethiopians have it but I believe it is just a replica given by Solomon when the Queen of Sheba returned as she was reported to have born a son to him.

There has been a discovery that has been well documented that the ark was hidden under where calvary was located. It was discovered by a man named Ron Wyatt and his story is very compelling. He was not allowed to bring it out. His claim is that it is guarded by angels. He also claimed to have found a substance on the top of it that he took a sample of and was discovered that it was human blood. A strange blood thought that only had maternal signatures in it.

There was found a crack that lead down through the earth from above that opened it up to directly over where the ark was. It was believed that this crack appeared at the moment of death of our Savior when the earthquake happened. This would have allowed for hi blood still running from his body or from where he was poked with the spear to run down the cross and into the earth and enough to be gotten through to the ark.

It it thought that Jesus was not just the Passover Lamb, but also the atonement. This required the blood to be sprinkled on the ark for the forgiveness of the sins of Israel.

 

[JackRT]

There has been a discovery that has been well documented that the ark was hidden under where calvary was located. It was discovered by a man named Ron Wyatt and his story is very compelling. He was not allowed to bring it out. His claim is that it is guarded by angels. He also claimed to have found a substance on the top of it that he took a sample of and was discovered that it was human blood. A strange blood thought that only had maternal signatures in it.

The late Ron Wyatt claimed to have discovered any number of remarkable Biblical artifacts but has never produced a shred of evidence nor have legitimate archaeologists been able to confirm any of them. Needless to say, he is widely regarded as a fraud but in spite of that he does have a devoted following.

 

[DamianWarS]

For example they say that the last place where the ark was mentioned was Jer 3. The problem is that is talking about the future, and 'in those days' which many familiar with prophecy will recognize pretty fast.

Jer 3 says "in those days, declares the Lord, they shall no more say, 'The ark of the covenant of the Lord.' It shall not come to mind or be remembered or missed; it shall not be made again". What this establishes to me is that at the time this was written the Ark was present, or at the very least still talked about or missed, but "in those days" it will be gone and it won't be talked about or missed anymore.

the last historical biblical narrative where the Ark is mentioned is 2 Chr 35 where King Josiah asks the Levites to return the Ark because for whatever reason they were keeping it. His reign was 640-609 BC and Jeremiah was written right in the middle of that at 625 BC. So I would suggest when Jeremiah wrote these words whereabouts of the Ark was known and he is talking about a time when it will be gone and forgotten.

2 Maccabees says Jeremiah stole the ark and hid it in a cave. If true, perhaps his earlier remarks was a bit of a foreshadow of what he was planning on doing. Apparently, Jeremiah was acting under divine order and the cave will be revealed when "God gathers his people together again and shows them mercy" which seems a different focus than his earlier prophecy.

 

[Strathos]

The late Ron Wyatt claimed to have discovered any number of remarkable Biblical artifacts but has never produced a shred of evidence nor have legitimate archaeologists been able to confirm any of them. Needless to say, he is widely regarded as a fraud but in spite of that he does have a devoted following.

I think the guy just watched too many Indiana Jones movies.

 

[dad]

I don't think anyone will know where it is or where it went unless someone actually finds it.

Good luck with that if it is in heaven as Rev indicates.

 

[dad]

I can make a strong case to the contrary by pointing out that there is no reason whatever to believe the ark was in the temple at the time of Jesus.

Great, so do it.

Jews do not claim that the ark was there.

Nor do they claim Jesus rose from the dead or that the veil was torn. So?

The Arch of Titus depicts the menorah from the temple but no ark.

If God took the ark to heaven when Jesus died, why would it have been there decades later when Titus showed up?

There is no record of the ark being carried away by the Romans after the temple was destroyed.

Correct, the record is that the ark was now in heaven.

 

[dad]

I think that's really interesting. I like thinkers, providing it's the Spirit within. haha - But it really is interesting and hadn't thought about this. I'm interested in anything else you might discover about this, or other cool thoughts. I love to listen to everything.

Thanks. I do find the stories about the ark quite interesting. Like how when it was taken by enemies to a foreign land (due to sins of Israel) they had to send it back, it was too powerful. I find it amazing that the mother cow took it exactly back to where God wanted it with no help from man, and even abandoned her own baby calf for the important job, which is against nature normally.

It makes sense to me that God wanted to show He was no longer with the religious outfit in Israel that had arranged killing His Son. So He tore the (I hear it was 4 inches thick and very high) veil, and took His ark back showing He was not there anymore, period.

I have heard there may be a replica that was made in the time of Solomon, that possibly ended up in Ethiopia or somewhere, so if I see a supposed ark in a new temple in Israel I will not believe it is the real one.

 

[dad]

There have been studies about this and that before the captivity into Babylon it was removed to safekeeping.

Careful about stating guesses as fact. Source?

Jeremiah was believed to have been involved and some think he took it to Egypt. There of course is the belief that the Ethiopians have it but I believe it is just a replica given by Solomon when the Queen of Sheba returned as she was reported to have born a son to him.

I think so too, and I allow for the possibility it may have been taken to Israel in the days of the Ethiopian airlifts for Jews returning to Israel. But that is not know and conjecture also.

There has been a discovery that has been well documented that the ark was hidden under where calvary was located. It was discovered by a man named Ron Wyatt and his story is very compelling. He was not allowed to bring it out. His claim is that it is guarded by angels. He also claimed to have found a substance on the top of it that he took a sample of and was discovered that it was human blood. A strange blood thought that only had maternal signatures in it.

Source?

There was found a crack that lead down through the earth from above that opened it up to directly over where the ark was. It was believed that this crack appeared at the moment of death of our Savior when the earthquake happened. This would have allowed for hi blood still running from his body or from where he was poked with the spear to run down the cross and into the earth and enough to be gotten through to the ark.

I have heard that one. Nice story. Personally it doesn't sit right with me.

It it thought that Jesus was not just the Passover Lamb, but also the atonement. This required the blood to be sprinkled on the ark for the forgiveness of the sins of Israel.

If both the blood and ark were taken to heaven I suppose this could happen also?

 

[dad]

Jer 3 says "in those days, declares the Lord, they shall no more say, 'The ark of the covenant of the Lord.' It shall not come to mind or be remembered or missed; it shall not be made again". What this establishes to me is that at the time this was written the Ark was present, or at the very least still talked about or missed, but "in those days" it will be gone and it won't be talked about or missed anymore.

There are certain phrases in the bible that are common in prophesy. In thse days is one of them. Right away I suspect it is talking about the period usually associated with those words. In Jer 3 it doesn't take long to see this has to be the case.

17 At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the LORD; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the LORD, to Jerusalem: neither shall they walk any more after the imagination of their evil heart.

the last historical biblical narrative where the Ark is mentioned is 2 Chr 35 where King Josiah asks the Levites to return the Ark because for whatever reason they were keeping it. His reign was 640-609 BC and Jeremiah was written right in the middle of that at 625 BC. So I would suggest when Jeremiah wrote these words whereabouts of the Ark was known and he is talking about a time when it will be gone and forgotten.

No. That was absolutely prophesy of the future time.

2 Maccabees says Jeremiah stole the ark and hid it in a cave.

Problem with those suicidal zealots writings is that they can't be trusted. Remember that the official rulers of Israel engaged in a cover up of things pertaining to Jesus. If the ark had disappeared and the veil was ripped open, they would have tried to cover that up however they could. Can you even assure us that the Maccabee documents were never altered or tampered with?

If true, perhaps his earlier remarks was a bit of a foreshadow of what he was planning on doing.

The primary concern when thinking about the ark is what God wanted done. Not some possible conniving move by a prophet that is not in the bible.


Apparently, Jeremiah was acting under divine order and the cave will be revealed when "God gathers his people together again and shows them mercy" which seems a different focus than his earlier prophecy.[/QUOTE] If you are referring to the suicidal folk's writings, sorry, we cannot think much about them was divine.

 

[Jonathan Mathews]

I don't think anyone will know where it is or where it went unless someone actually finds it.

Ron Wyatt found it in Jeremiah's Grotto, a cave 20ft below the hill of Golgotha. He found it on January 6th 1982.

 

[Jonathan Mathews]

The reasons I have seen so far why the ark of the covenant would have been missing hundreds of years before Christ don't seem to hold water. For example they say that the last place where the ark was mentioned was Jer 3. The problem is that is talking about the future, and 'in those days' which many familiar with prophesy will recognize pretty fast.

So, my opinion for the time being, unless evidence is produced that warrants a change, is that the ark was there when Jesus died, and at that moment was taken to heaven. Perhaps someone thinks they can make a strong case to the contrary?

The Ark of the Covenant was hidden by priests in Jeremiah's Grotto when Babylon raided Jerusalem in 597 B.C. Jeremiah's Grotto is a cave 20ft below the exact spot Jesus was crucified at Golgatha. This cave was connected to the Temple mount by underground tunnels. During Jesus' crucifiction, the Ark was beneath him on the cross. Solomon had escape tunnels built under the Temple, and the Ark was lowered by the priests and carried thru the tunnels outside the city during the Babylonian raid. Ron Wyatt found the Ark while excavating in Jeremiah's Grotto on January 6th 1982. When the rocks were "torn" during the earthquake at Jesus' crucifiction, Jesus' blood dripped down on the lid of the Ark which is the Mercy Seat, just like the priest would spring it with blood in the Old Covenant. The leading Jews to this day know where the Ark is. I've seen prominent Jewish authorities on TV saying they never lost it. It just cannot be moved our touched by non-Born again people yet, because God's Spirit still protects it. In the last days, the Ark will be placed in the rebuilt Jewish temple, and the Anti-Christ will stand or even sit on it and claim to be God. I can testify to Ron Wyatt's finding the real Ark on Jan.6th 1982. God confirmed it to me thru signs and wonders when I did not believe Ron Wyatt's testimony. But Ron Wyatt was telling the truth. He really did find the Ark. All other stories are rumors and myths.

 

[dad]

The Ark of the Covenant was hidden by priests in Jeremiah's Grotto when Babylon raided Jerusalem in 597 B.C.

Says...who?

Jeremiah's Grotto is a cave 20ft below the exact spot Jesus was crucified at Golgatha.

Let me guess, it is for 'eyes only' and we can't have a looky poo now?

This cave was connected to the Temple mount by underground tunnels. During Jesus' crucifiction, the Ark was beneath him on the cross.

Speculation. You are not the only one that can speculate.

"The Council of the Garden Tomb Association (London) totally refute the claim of Wyatt to have discovered the original Ark of the Covenant or any other biblical artifacts within the boundaries of the area known as the Garden Tomb Jerusalem. Though Wyatt was allowed to dig within this privately owned garden on a number of occasions (the last occasion being the summer of 1991) staff members of the Association observed his progress and entered his excavated shaft. As far as we are aware nothing was ever discovered to support his claims nor have we seen any evidence of biblical artifacts or temple treasures.[17]"

wiki

Solomon had escape tunnels built under the Temple, and the Ark was lowered by the priests and carried thru the tunnels outside the city during the Babylonian raid.

Proof? Oh, you made that up. OK.

Ron Wyatt found the Ark while excavating in Jeremiah's Grotto on January 6th 1982.

See the quote above from folks that were there and disagree. Therefore please state your weak and wild conspiracy theories as such and not in a matter of fact way.

When the rocks were "torn" during the earthquake at Jesus' crucifiction, Jesus' blood dripped down on the lid of the Ark which is the Mercy Seat, just like the priest would spring it with blood in the Old Covenant.

This you know...how??

The leading Jews to this day know where the Ark is.

If they read Revelation they do.

I've seen prominent Jewish authorities on TV saying they never lost it. It just cannot be moved our touched by non-Born again people yet, because God's Spirit still protects it.

?? Jewish authorities claimed only born again people could move it!? Ha. Sure.

In the last days, the Ark will be placed in the rebuilt Jewish temple,

An ark...I think will be placed. I even agree they may claim it is THE ark. It won't be.

and the Anti-Christ will stand or even sit on it and claim to be God.

Sorry, since it will be the replica, I don't much care if they use it in a Macdonald's commercial, and ship it to Hollywood.

I can testify to Ron Wyatt's finding the real Ark on Jan.6th 1982.

Ha.

God confirmed it to me thru signs and wonders when I did not believe Ron Wyatt's testimony.

Paaleeeese.

 

[Jonathan Mathews]

You're confused because you read Revelation where John saw the Ark being in Heaven and you don't understand that there are 2 Arks.... The Heavenly Ark and the copy that God had Moses build. God did not take Moses' earthly Ark of gold and wood into Heaven. It's still on Earth. John saw the original, Heavenly Ark of the Covenant, not Moses' earthly copy.

 

[dad]

You're confused because you read Revelation where John saw the Ark being in Heaven and you don't understand that there are 2 Arks.... The Heavenly Ark and the copy that God had Moses build. God did not take Moses' earthly Ark of gold and wood into Heaven. It's still on Earth. John saw the original, Heavenly Ark of the Covenant, not Moses' earthly copy.

No. I am not confused. I have heard that one too. Now the fun part..prove it? Who says there are two?

Looking at revelation itself, I see this

Re 11:19 - And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

It doesn't say 'original duplicate ark, not to be confused with the ark that was on earth'! It talks about THE ark.

 

[Jonathan Mathews]

No. I am not confused. I have heard that one too. Now the fun part..prove it? Who says there are two?

Looking at revelation itself, I see this

Re 11:19 - And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

It doesn't say 'original duplicate ark, not to be confused with the ark that was on earth'! It talks about THE ark.

Exodus 25:40 "See that you make them according to the pattern shown you on the mountain."

What do you think they were patterns/images/copies of? Moses' Ark and the utensils in the Temple were COPIES/IMAGES/PATTERNED-AFTER the ones in Heaven which God showed Moses on the mountain.

Do you think the Mercy Seat....God's Throne in Heaven.... is created out of Gold and Acacia wood??? LOL NO. What do you think God's Throne in Heaven was BEFORE Mose's built the Ark of wood and Gold? There are 2 Arks of the Covenant. And in Revelation, John saw the Heavenly one. Ron Wyatt saw the Earthly one.

 

[Strathos]

Ron Wyatt is a liar. He never found any of the things he said he found.

If the Ark is somewhere on earth, no one alive knows where it is.