Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Speak for yourself. This is not taught or believed in any of the local Baptist churches here in New Yorkdaveleau said:Baptists consider their history to range back to the origins of the Church.
Hi Matrona,Matrona said:Matthan, you are quite welcome to ask in The Ancient Way why we have icons. I would say so here but I am Orthodox and therefore unable to debate here.Suffice it to say for now, we do not believe God changed His mind about images.
jcright said:I am not a protestant, I did not break away from the Catholic Church. I do not believe that Baptists are protestants either simply because we have NOT broken away from the Word. Whether we can trace ourselves back to the early churh or the reformation is irrelevant...the true break is from the Word. A good example of this would be Christian Science...if anyone is a protestant, it would be them.
What are these folks protesting? What does the term protestant mean to you?S682 said:I never liked the term "protestant" either. I think you're right about the Christian Science being more protestant. You could go on and say Seventh Day Adventists, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, etc., you know, the latter day stuff that came about.
To me a protestant is someone who goes against the Word of God. I would contend that we are not going against the Word of God and therefore we do not protest the true Church. However, a group like the Christian Scientists, of which I grew up in (so I know plenty about them), does go against the Word of God. If any one is a protestant, it would be them. I can't speak to the others you mentioned.Gold Dragon said:What are these folks protesting? What does the term protestant mean to you?
Protestant
All these groups are from the Restoration Movement in the 1800s in the US. Are you trying to redefine the term protestant as a group originating during this period?
Seventh Day Adventists
Jehovah's Witness
Mormons
Christian Science
I have never heard of this definition of protestant and I don't believe I have ever seen it used this way. In fact, it is much more common to hear the word protestant as being "people of the book" since the doctrine of Sola Scriptura gained its strongest support during the Protestant Reformation.jcright said:To me a protestant is someone who goes against the Word of God.
Wikipedia - Protestant
....
Protestants are often considered to be another people 'of the book', in that they adhere to the text of the Bible, that they grew out of the enlightenment and universities, that they attracted learned intellectuals, professionals, and skilled tradesmen and silversmiths, that their belief is more abstracted than ritualized, and that the great dissemination of protestant beliefs occurred with the translation by Protestants into native tongues from Latin (Greek and Hebrew) with the new technology of the printing press. Protestants are also less fond of hierarchy, having relentlessly attacked the priestly cast and the Holy See's authority, and thus are closely associated with the local control and political democratization during the 16th and 17th century.
...
Thank you lismore!lismore said:Hi Matrona,
I have been to Athens and to the rock churches in cappadocia and I have to say that the Orthodox art is some of the most beautiful I have ever seen! Please dont be offended if some calls you an idol worhshipper etc. They are zealous and mean well
Shouldn't it be the definition? What does it matter if we protest the Catholic church? The only thing that matters is God's Word. The word is derogatory in intent...shouldn't that be saved for the group that aren't believers?Gold Dragon said:I have never heard of this definition of protestant and I don't believe I have ever seen it used this way. In fact, it is much more common to hear the word protestant as being "people of the book" since the doctrine of Sola Scriptura gained its strongest support during the Protestant Reformation.
I see no reason to change the understanding that most people have.jcright said:Shouldn't it be the definition?
It doesn't. It is simply an honest understanding of the history of the words we use so that others can understand what we are talking about. If you say that the word protestant means a green frog living in a meadow, nobody will understand what you are talking about.jcright said:What does it matter if we protest the Catholic church?
Maybe you grew up in an environment where the word protestant was used primarily in a derogatory fashion, but that is not true in many other cases and the origin of the word.jcright said:The only thing that matters is God's Word. The word is derogatory in intent
The terms Anabaptist and Methodist actually were used initially as derogatory names. They sorta stuck. Nobody says that they should be reserved for non-believers.jcright said:...shouldn't that be saved for the group that aren't believers?
Perhaps I was raised in a different environment...then again, I see the same outlook from some of the Catholics on CF. We are little children who are rebelling against our parents, in this case, the Catholic church. If it wasn't intended in a negative way, then why not call us the other believers? Why call us protestants? What exactly are we protesting? Would we really be called protestants if they thought we were protesting just the Catholic rules? I don't think so. Why is it so important to follow what they follow? Because they think they have true course where as we've stumbled off the path.Gold Dragon said:I see no reason to change the understanding that most people have.
It doesn't. It is simply an honest understanding of the history of the words we use so that others can understand what we are talking about. If you say that the word protestant means a green frog living in a meadow, nobody will understand what you are talking about.
Maybe you grew up in an environment where the word protestant was used primarily in a derogatory fashion, but that is not true in many other cases and the origin of the word.
That's their battleThe terms Anabaptist and Methodist actually were used initially as derogatory names. They sorta stuck. Nobody says that they should be reserved for non-believers.
I think it is pretty obvious why Catholics view protestants that way. It's all part of the "I'm right, they're wrong" syndrome expressed by both sides of all Christian schisms.jcright said:Perhaps I was raised in a different environment...then again, I see the same outlook from some of the Catholics on CF. We are little children who are rebelling against our parents, in this case, the Catholic church.
Why do you think it is Catholics who called us protestants and not protestants who first used the term?jcright said:If it wasn't intended in a negative way, then why not call us the other believers? Why call us protestants? What exactly are we protesting? Would we really be called protestants if they thought we were protesting just the Catholic rules?
Maybe both are on the true course with some unfortunate detours.jcright said:I don't think so. Why is it so important to follow what they follow? Because they think they have true course where as we've stumbled off the path?
Don't worry, I won't call you protestant.Uncle Bud said:What you don't understand is GD, that we do not want to be called that no matter if you think it is okay for us to be called that or not. The original meaning was deragatory, and the broader meaning is not acceptable by me.
Gold Dragon said:I think it is pretty obvious why Catholics view protestants that way. It's all part of the "I'm right, they're wrong" syndrome expressed by both sides of all Christian schisms.
Why do you think it is Catholics who called us protestants and not protestants who first used the term?
Luther made his formal protest in 1517 for issues that all evangelicals (using a different term on purpose) probably agree were valid issues of protest. Many of those issues are no longer a point of contention, but fundamental issues like Sola Scriptura and the Priesthood of all believers are still areas of disagreement that modern evangelicals would identify with the original Protestant Reformers and thus fit under the umbrella of protestantism.
Show me a church that never strays...one that isn't Jesus.Maybe both are on the true course with some unfortunate detours.
Of course Catholics view the reformers negatively and heretical. They were challenging the authority of the Catholic Church.jcright said:However, as your source points out: "In a broader sense of the word, Protestantism is the collective name for numerous heresies, of Western European origin, that broke with the Roman Catholic Church...". Heresy being with protestant...and you don't see that as negative?
Mary was born by immaculate conception?Gold Dragon said:Of course Catholics view the reformers negatively and heretical. They were challenging the authority of the Catholic Church.
Why do we need to view the reformers as heretical as well? I believe we stopped caring what the RCC considered heretical after the 1500s. It is also heretical not to consider the Deuterocanonicals as canon and it is heretical to say that Mary was not born by Immaculate Conception.
From our perspective, we should be proud that Luther, Calvin, et al stood firm on the bible and made their protest.
That is the view and the belief of the Catholic church.jcright said:Mary was born by immaculate conception?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?