Are you a sinner after confessing Christ is Lord?

[Clint Edwards]

It is a beautiful set of verses, no ? If he was preaching holy flesh, why didn't he say, "you were resurrected like him, unable to sin " or " raised like him free off sinful flesh" ?

I have explained this to you before, I don't think you read it. Here are important words you totally ignore REIGN, DOMINION. When a king REIGNS, he has absolute total control. Whatever and whoever are under hes reign are compelled to do exactly what he says. If you are feed from his reign you are free to do as you choose. You may at times choose to do bad things, but you are not COMPELLED, regardless of your will to do so.

If sin has DOMINION over you, you cannot help but sin. You are compelled to do so. It has power over you, you cannot help but follow that power. You are in a total sinful state. Paul IS NOT saying you are free of sin. He IS NOT saying you cannot sin. He IS SAYING, that the power of sin over you has been broken. HE IS saying that you are free from being driven to sin, compelled to sin, sinning without control. HE IS SAYING that you are free of the DOMINION of sin. have a voice and choice in the matter. HE IS SAYING, that if the power of The Spirit is in you, you can fight the sin in your life, become more sinless day by day. That is why he wrote about being the chief of sinners. As an Apostle, he was still committing sin. HOWEVER, he states at the end he was SAVED from it by Jesus Christ. How could this be ??? In Christ, his SINLESS LIFE is seen by the FATHER as our sinless life. THE FATHERS seeing Christs sinless life in place of our sinless life is said to be IMPUTED to us. We are JUDGED to be SINLESS, sinless. We are position-ally in relation to God sinless. You want to stop here and pretend that you are practically sinless, literally in your everyday life sinless. Some who hold this position believe that they can do whatever they want and not sin, because they cannot sin. That is a grievous error. Since sin no longer REIGNS and has DOMINION over us, we are not forced to sin, we can chose not to sin. However, since we are inherently sinful, the choice can be difficult, and we sometimes choose wrongly, and sin, as Paul said he did. As our salvation goes, it doesn';t make any difference, because God, through Christ, judges us as sinless. It does make make a difference in our life though because we are to be an example of good, to become Christlike. By the power of The Spirit in us, the sanctifying power, we are becoming more and more Christlike, fighting our inherent nature, sinning less and less, winning the battle. Christ's nature is step by step being IMPARTED to us. Paul tells us that not co operating with this process, not fighting the battle, not progressing, means we are not co operating with the SPIRIT, we are blocking it.

I have tried to explain it as clearly as I possibly can, again. This has been essentially the Christian position from the very beginning of the Church. The Reformation made the doctrine clearer, nevertheless, it is what it is from the Bible.

My responsibility to share the true Gospel with you has been fulfilled. In your free will you can choose to accept it or deny it. It serves no purpose to further quibble about whether it is true or not. Christianity has taught it in one form or another for 2,000 years. It is the truth of the Gospel, WE are set free from the power and condemnation of sin, as I have explained it to you You ought to pray mightily about it. Peace

I didn't proofread this
very well, so as a correction I meant to say the Father sees Christs sinless life in place of our SINFUL life. Sorry

 

[Clint Edwards]

Biggest part of the problem is we have be taught by people who are still in an old man mind set.
Not many teach the new man mind set that is in scripture. As we see not many can separate them selves from the old covenant thinking/teaching, The traditions of men are a trap and stumbling bloke for them. Its my minister says so for most . So this leads to a closed mind. How many in here did you see say. Well I will meditate on it brother what you say. None they all come right back with a counter argument. They have closed heart and no ears to hear or eyes to see. They will not tale one day to spend with God and ask if what you are saying is correct.

Isn't this being an accuser of the Brethren ? Point counter point is one of the best ways to find the truth on the matter. I could turn your statement around and accuse you of exactly the same thing of you. I won't

I am curious, does you church or group have a name ? are they part of a denomination ? It';s no big deal, I go to an independent Bible Church not affiliated with any denomination. It us called "The Bible Church of......."

 

[JIMINZ]

It is a beautiful set of verses, no ? If he was preaching holy flesh, why didn't he say, "you were resurrected like him, unable to sin " or " raised like him free off sinful flesh" ?

I have explained this to you before, I don't think you read it. Here are important words you totally ignore REIGN, DOMINION. When a king REIGNS, he has absolute total control. Whatever and whoever are under hes reign are compelled to do exactly what he says. If you are feed from his reign you are free to do as you choose. You may at times choose to do bad things, but you are not COMPELLED, regardless of your will to do so.

If sin has DOMINION over you, you cannot help but sin. You are compelled to do so. It has power over you, you cannot help but follow that power. You are in a total sinful state. Paul IS NOT saying you are free of sin. He IS NOT saying you cannot sin. He IS SAYING, that the power of sin over you has been broken. HE IS saying that you are free from being driven to sin, compelled to sin, sinning without control. HE IS SAYING that you are free of the DOMINION of sin. have a voice and choice in the matter. HE IS SAYING, that if the power of The Spirit is in you, you can fight the sin in your life, become more sinless day by day. That is why he wrote about being the chief of sinners. As an Apostle, he was still committing sin. HOWEVER, he states at the end he was SAVED from it by Jesus Christ. How could this be ??? In Christ, his SINLESS LIFE is seen by the FATHER as our sinless life. THE FATHERS seeing Christs sinless life in place of our sinless life is said to be IMPUTED to us. We are JUDGED to be SINLESS, sinless. We are position-ally in relation to God sinless. You want to stop here and pretend that you are practically sinless, literally in your everyday life sinless. Some who hold this position believe that they can do whatever they want and not sin, because they cannot sin. That is a grievous error. Since sin no longer REIGNS and has DOMINION over us, we are not forced to sin, we can chose not to sin. However, since we are inherently sinful, the choice can be difficult, and we sometimes choose wrongly, and sin, as Paul said he did. As our salvation goes, it doesn';t make any difference, because God, through Christ, judges us as sinless. It does make make a difference in our life though because we are to be an example of good, to become Christlike. By the power of The Spirit in us, the sanctifying power, we are becoming more and more Christlike, fighting our inherent nature, sinning less and less, winning the battle. Christ's nature is step by step being IMPARTED to us. Paul tells us that not co operating with this process, not fighting the battle, not progressing, means we are not co operating with the SPIRIT, we are blocking it.

I have tried to explain it as clearly as I possibly can, again. This has been essentially the Christian position from the very beginning of the Church. The Reformation made the doctrine clearer, nevertheless, it is what it is from the Bible.

My responsibility to share the true Gospel with you has been fulfilled. In your free will you can choose to accept it or deny it. It serves no purpose to further quibble about whether it is true or not. Christianity has taught it in one form or another for 2,000 years. It is the truth of the Gospel, WE are set free from the power and condemnation of sin, as I have explained it to you. Peace

.
Your making this stuff up as you go along ......right?

I have attended a number of different, Denominations, I have never heard anything like your espousing.

What you say is so twisted up upon itself, it's truly a convoluted ball of contradictions.

You do not believe Scripture when it has been presented to you, you don't rebut anything, you gust give another long winded set of beliefs, without anything Scriptural to back anything up.

What it all boils down to is, you have a set of beliefs which I personally do not hold, while I on the other hand have a set of beliefs which you personally do not hold.

The things you believe and the way you say you believe seem to be working for you, all I can say at this point is take care of yourself.

Have a good day and may God Bless you.

 

[Johnsloan]

I had no intent of teaching you anything. You can't read my mind, can you.

I was merely reacting to your own sarcasm. If you can't take, then don't dish it out.

Your reading to much into my post. If I cant take it lol YOU started it. I just think its childish. Also childish you hiding from what you done. you are indeed trying to teach. Face the facts. You highlighted whet you think is sarcasm. To teach me its wrong. Nothing more and nothing less. Its no big deal. I know what you reacted to. You wanted to teach me I am wrong to be sarcastic lol Stop trying to hid what you done.
Its a bare faced fact. If not please give and explanation that makes sense as to why you done it if it was not to teach me I am in the wrong. So funny these silly little hiding games. Thing is online its hard to tell what age some are.

 

[Johnsloan]

Isn't this being an accuser of the Brethren ? Point counter point is one of the best ways to find the truth on the matter. I could turn your statement around and accuse you of exactly the same thing of you. I won't

I am curious, does you church or group have a name ? are they part of a denomination ? It';s no big deal, I go to an independent Bible Church not affiliated with any denomination. It us called "The Bible Church of......."

No not with the horrible manner in which its being done in here. Why do you think that has anything to do with Christ.
There is no desire in anyone in this discussion in the last week who wants real truth. Your minds are set. I used to believe in the same way you are do. Now I dont. Now most every thing I heard is wrong.
Heres a simple one for you that shows the contradiction in traditional church.
Yall say we are the church not the building.
The word church means out goers. Why yall going in. and NOT talking the good news out. Yall hiding behind "Oh we send out missionaries" Or "we aint pastors that his job" You are told to go out. as whole the church does not go out. And if for the odd one that does go out all stone faced to preach. Preaches hell and damnation. Its called the good news.

Who cares where I go or don't go. You want to box me. see it all the time. We have to churches on the planet. You would not have heard of us.

 

[Clint Edwards]

No not with the horrible manner in which its being done in here. Why do you think that has anything to do with Christ.
There is no desire in anyone in this discussion in the last week who wants real truth. Your minds are set. I used to believe in the same way you are do. Now I dont. Now most every thing I heard is wrong.
Heres a simple one for you that shows the contradiction in traditional church.
Yall say we are the church not the building.
The word church means out goers. Why yall going in. and NOT talking the good news out. Yall hiding behind "Oh we send out missionaries" Or "we aint pastors that his job" You are told to go out. as whole the church does not go out. And if for the odd one that does go out all stone faced to preach. Preaches hell and damnation. Its called the good news.

Who cares where I go or don't go. You want to box me. see it all the time. We have to churches on the planet. You would not have heard of us.

You sound like the pope when Luther came before him, ¨we have and are the truth¨. You then go into a rant describing every believer with your broad brush of condemnation and complaints. You haven´t a clue what every Christian here does or does not do, let alone every believer there is. You have it backwards, you and your sidekick don´t want the real truth.

You have the right to believe whatever you choose, those who drank the kool aid with Jim Jones believed only they had the truth too.

I don´t want to box you, why should I ? The Bible says ¨come ĺets reason together¨ You don´t want to reason. you want to shove your ideas down someones throat, then expect them to accept it, because you know the truth.

If a brother wanders astray, we are told to make every effort to bring him back. When you proclaim your new found holy flesh religion, you show you have wandered far astray.

We, in attempting to bring you back into harmony with God have used the Bible to try and do so. That isn´t boxing with you, it is trying to reason with you.

I have done all I can on the matter, it is up to you as to whether you will follow the Bible or heresy.

We will both find out in the end who was right, won´t we ?

Peace

 

[Johnsloan]

You sound like the pope when Luther came before him, ¨we have and are the truth¨. You then go into a rant describing every believer with your broad brush of condemnation and complaints. You haven´t a clue what every Christian here does or does not do, let alone every believer there is. You have it backwards, you and your sidekick don´t want the real truth.

You have the right to believe whatever you choose, those who drank the kool aid with Jim Jones believed only they had the truth too.

I don´t want to box you, why should I ? The Bible says ¨come ĺets reason together¨ You don´t want to reason. you want to shove your ideas down someones throat, then expect them to accept it, because you know the truth.

If a brother wanders astray, we are told to make every effort to bring him back. When you proclaim your new found holy flesh religion, you show you have wandered far astray.

We, in attempting to bring you back into harmony with God have used the Bible to try and do so. That isn´t boxing with you, it is trying to reason with you.

I have done all I can on the matter, it is up to you as to whether you will follow the Bible or heresy.

We will both find out in the end who was right, won´t we ?

Peace

Its not about being right or wrong. Its all about love. You accuse me of many thing. I accuse the church or Christians in general because of what I see. I do not judge its plain to see that the church is doing nothing and 99% of christians or the leaders have ZERO power, no signs follow the 99%. Unless I missed something did I? What brother is astray that you are trying to bring back in love. I missed that also?
I see you also have a habit of ignoring what ever suits you but call this reasoning together. This is typical Christian behaviour in the church or forums. No matter who debating no one in these forums is ever wrong why is that lol. The conversation here is a ty[ical argument with zero ears to hear with zero love. Its all selfish and pride not to be wrong at any cost even the word of God is twisted in here. Just so we can be right and never wrong. Yet you are sitting there say what a pathetic sinner you are. But funny how you are always right to funny. I reached the audience I wanted to reach already in the first week. They all moved on now. They all understand and moved on saying nothing new here. There gone on with out you and the other one or two who knows it all. They already had eyes and ears to see and hear. You are stuck with pride. You talk like you are talking for the majority. They aint here its you and 2 or three other unbelievers. These signs will follow those that believe. That's not you.
You are missing out because of pride nothing else. And pride will not allow you to stop. You will typically have to come back and show me how wrong I am lol.

 

[Clint Edwards]

Its not about being right or wrong. Its all about love. You accuse me of many thing. I accuse the church or Christians in general because of what I see. I do not judge its plain to see that the church is doing nothing and 99% of christians or the leaders have ZERO power, no signs follow the 99%. Unless I missed something did I? What brother is astray that you are trying to bring back in love. I missed that also?
I see you also have a habit of ignoring what ever suits you but call this reasoning together. This is typical Christian behaviour in the church or forums. No matter who debating no one in these forums is ever wrong why is that lol. The conversation here is a ty[ical argument with zero ears to hear with zero love. Its all selfish and pride not to be wrong at any cost even the word of God is twisted in here. Just so we can be right and never wrong. Yet you are sitting there say what a pathetic sinner you are. But funny how you are always right to funny. I reached the audience I wanted to reach already in the first week. They all moved on now. They all understand and moved on saying nothing new here. There gone on with out you and the other one or two who knows it all. They already had eyes and ears to see and hear. You are stuck with pride. You talk like you are talking for the majority. They aint here its you and 2 or three other unbelievers. These signs will follow those that believe. That's not you.
You are missing out because of pride nothing else. And pride will not allow you to stop. You will typically have to come back and show me how wrong I am lol.[/QU God have mercy on your soul. I will pray for you. Peace

 

[ViaCrucis]

Have you sinned at all since your baptism? If your answer is yes, then you are, in fact, a sinner. It doesn't have to mean that you're unrepentant, only that sinning is part of your (fallen) nature, just like everyone else. If your answer is no, then you're a liar, for
if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Holiness isn't a one-time deal; it's something to pursue. You don't cease to be a sinner unless you somehow manage to remove all sin from your life. Likewise, you don't cease to be a saint just because you have some sins that you keep falling into. If you're repentant, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I'm shocked how many people seem to act as though Romans ch. 7 isn't in their Bibles. Where the Apostle cries out in grief that the good he wants to do he doesn't do, and the evil he doesn't want to do, he does. The battle between the old man and the new is the daily struggle of the Christian life in this present and adulterous age. Which is why Scripture continuously and constantly calls us to repentance, to seek, to knock, to ask, to carry our cross.

The one who claims they are without sin claims they have no cross to carry, that they have no need for repentance, and ultimately no need for faith and the mercies of God in Christ. In truth, the one who says they are without sin stands dangerously on the precipice before the chasm of apostasy and faithlessness.

Cry out to God and cleave to Jesus, for we are all but beggars.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Johnsloan]

I'm shocked how many people seem to act as though Romans ch. 7 isn't in their Bibles. Where the Apostle cries out in grief that the good he wants to do he doesn't do, and the evil he doesn't want to do, he does. The battle between the old man and the new is the daily struggle of the Christian life in this present and adulterous age. Which is why Scripture continuously and constantly calls us to repentance, to seek, to knock, to ask, to carry our cross.

The one who claims they are without sin claims they have no cross to carry, that they have no need for repentance, and ultimately no need for faith and the mercies of God in Christ. In truth, the one who says they are without sin stands dangerously on the precipice before the chasm of apostasy and faithlessness.

Cry out to God and cleave to Jesus, for we are all but beggars.

-CryptoLutheran

I'm shocked how many people seem to act as though they have read or understood the OPs posts.
Who said we don't sin ever?
I'm shocked how many people seem to think that we our sinful nature is our IDENTITY.
We are not sin. Its not who I AM. You obviously love dwelling in the I am nothing but a sinner traditions of mans false teaching. That's fine for you. But why do YOU wont to force the false claims on everyone else. God says we are holy. IS GOD WRONG? God say we are worth the blood of Jesus. But You say we are beggars Do you have any scriptures calling us the low life that you like to call us?
God say we are beyond reproach with regards to sin. Because of what Jesus has done. Its called the finished work.

When we are told to consider our selves DEAD to sin. You are being told to think on your self as a sinner NOMORE EVER.
I'm shocked how many people seem to act as though they are nothing but a sinner when God paid the highest price. He paid it because you are worth it. Stop listening to the traditions of men there teaching makes a mockery of what God actually says in His word

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

No you are not. You are a new creation and all things are new the old is gone.

To many churches are still teaching from an old covenant understanding.
If you are in Christ you are not a sinner. Again because of this false teaching that we are all sinners. Is a lie from the pit of hell.

yes becuase that doesn't save you. I mean even demons believe Jesus is God james 2:19