Are we evolving?

AintNoMonkey · Mar 17, 2008

brinny said:
Human beings are called human for a reason. What is it?

Human beings are called human because that is the common English term for the species Homo sapiens, just as 'dog' is the common English term for Canis lupus familiaris.

Now I will refer you here: http://christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=44799571&postcount=75 so that you may address these issues.

atomweaver · Mar 17, 2008

brinny said:
Originally Posted by brinny
Originally Posted by brinny
why aren't apes called human beings?

what is a human being?

It's a question for you. I don't believe human beings are a 'species' of animal or are related to monkeys, apes, or animals.

Every cell of your body screams out with evidence to the contrary... cells which you would say your Creator gave you, along with a brain to understand their origins. Why do you ignore the evidence He left for you to contemplate?

I believe it's been so since the beginning when Adam named the creatures in the garden of Eden, because God gave him dominion over the earth and the creatures. Adam was who God made in His image. Not animals.

dominion, or "to dominate"... It is this willful and very Christian attempt to subjugate the earth and its inhabitants which is yet another pitfall of Christian faith. How could such a hubris-filled position do anything but cause its proponents to thoroughly mess up the elaborate network of life on earth..? You won't even consider what your own DNA has to say about your origins, yet you assert mastery by proxy for your deity over all you see...

What is a human being?

Its different things to different people. By what you've said so far, to be a Christian human being is to dominate the world around you, because your God gave it to you for that purpose... I know there's more to Christianity than that, but one gets off to a pitifully bad start with that premise.

brinny · Mar 17, 2008

what you describe is the effects of sin.

atomweaver · Mar 17, 2008

brinny said:
what you describe is the effects of sin.

No, check you Bible, please; God gave Man dominion over the Earth before the Fall...

brinny · Mar 17, 2008

atomweaver said:
No, check you Bible, please; God gave Man dominion over the Earth before the Fall...

LOL! I know God gave man dominion before the fall. What you see happening and what has happened since the fall is the abuse of said dominion.

atomweaver · Mar 17, 2008

brinny said:
LOL! I know God gave man dominion before the fall. What you see happening and what has happened since the fall is the abuse of said dominion.

You can blame it on the fall, if you'd like. I tend to hold people accountable for their own actions. Fall or not, merely starting with the premise of 'dominion' sets one up for a fall, so to speak...

Mythologies for healthier habitation of this earth are a part of many religions; several native American cultures, aborigonal Dream Time, modern Wicca, and more. None of these are so drenched with the need for domination that effuses Christian foundations, but then, they're all derived from much less warlike cultures, too, so its probably to be expected... And too, within Christianity, there are factions which emphasize the concept of Adam and Eve as gardeners, more so than proxy rulers for God. Those factions don't usually coincide with your typical Creationists, though... they're more likely to be all about ownership, IME.

biggles53 · Mar 17, 2008

brinny said:
Originally Posted by brinny
Originally Posted by brinny
why aren't apes called human beings?

what is a human being?

It's a question for you. I don't believe human beings are a 'species' of animal or are related to monkeys, apes, or animals. I believe it's been so since the beginning when Adam named the creatures in the garden of Eden, because God gave him dominion over the earth and the creatures. Adam was who God made in His image. Not animals.

What is a human being?

Brinny, sorry to disappoint you, but you are an ape...and so am I. Furthermore, we are related to other apes, monkeys, chimps and orangutangs. Some are closer relatives to us than others.

The clearest evidence for this is found in the imprints left in every one of your cells by what are known as retroviruses. The same imprints are found in the genomes of those other animals...and in exactly the same locations!

In other words, these viruses invaded the body of an ancestor which we hold in common with those other species and the information was passed down, generation by generation, speciation by speciation.

There is simply no other way for us to have the same patterns in our cells as those other primates.

The truth is there if you care to seek....

SedjmNeter · Mar 17, 2008

P.E.A.C.E and Blessings...

Are we evolving?

Physically, probably...

Spiritually, it doesn't look like it...

SHEM HETEP

Gracchus · Mar 18, 2008

SedjmNeter said:
P.E.A.C.E and Blessings...

Are we evolving?

Physically, probably...

Almost certainly!

Spiritually, it doesn't look like it...

SHEM HETEP

Since no one can point to or measure a spirit, or even demonstrate that there is such a thing, there is no way to tell. Humans are still, for the most part, greedy, stupid and vicious, and probably always have been.

Wiccan_Child · Mar 18, 2008

brinny said:
Human beings are called human for a reason. What is it?

A human is:

Me.
Any member of the set of individuals with whom I can reproduce (this defines human females),
All those with whom (2) can reproduce (this defines human males),
All those who are descended from (1), (2), and/or (3) (this defines all those who can't reproduce: children, the elderly, the infertile, etc).

Yes, I think that should suffice.

brinny · Mar 18, 2008

biggles53 said:
The clearest evidence for this is found in the imprints left in every one of your cells by what are known as retroviruses. The same imprints are found in the genomes of those other animals...and in exactly the same locations!

In other words, these viruses invaded the body of an ancestor which we hold in common with those other species and the information was passed down, generation by generation, speciation by speciation.

There is simply no other way for us to have the same patterns in our cells as those other primates.

The truth is there if you care to seek....

apparently we're not related

Loudmouth · Mar 18, 2008

brinny said:
Human beings are called human for a reason. What is it?

The same reason that chimps are called chimps.

What are we evolving into? Humans. However, over time the definition of human will have to encompass larger amounts of variation, and possibly even several species. In fact, most people consider Homo habilis, Homo erectus, Homo heidelbergensis, Homo neanderthalis, and Homo sapiens as all human with Homo sapiens being the only living species of human. Any description of "human" must also describe these other species of human. That description will also have to include whatever changes occur to our species in the future.

brinny · Mar 18, 2008

Loudmouth said:
The same reason that chimps are called chimps.

What are we evolving into? Humans. However, over time the definition of human will have to encompass larger amounts of variation, and possibly even several species. In fact, most people consider Homo habilis, Homo erectus, Homo heidelbergensis, Homo neanderthalis, and Homo sapiens as all human with Homo sapiens being the only living species of human. Any description of "human" must also describe these other species of human. That description will also have to include whatever changes occur to our species in the future.

thank you for so generously sharing your opinion on the future of mankind.

Loudmouth · Mar 18, 2008

brinny said:
thank you for so generously sharing your opinion on the future of mankind.

Actually, that is an interesting topic on it's own because we could completely remove ourselves from the process of evolution. Molecular biology is advancing at such a rate that we could, in the future, shape our own genomes to our own ends instead of filtering random changes through the stochastic process of evolution. We are already doing this in our domestic plants and animals, otherwise known as genetically modified foods or frankenfoods depending on your stance. At some point it will be incorrect to ask "what are we going to evolve into". The question will be "what do we want to be".

AintNoMonkey · Mar 18, 2008

It's funny, because we haven't received any answers from brinny yet. She's quite a convincing debater.

brinny · Mar 18, 2008

AintNoMonkey said:
It's funny, because we haven't received any answers from brinny yet. She's quite a convincing debater.

miss me?

actually i'm not a debater. i mostly think out loud on these posts.

they do prompt me to think in more depth about why it is i believe what i do. for that i thamk you.

I gotta get to work. it's been riveting. I'll be back on tonight if i don't fall asleep.

AintNoMonkey · Mar 18, 2008

When you do come back, bring some answers to post #75, pleax, and any other unanswered posts thus far. Thx, bbgrl.

Skaloop · Mar 18, 2008

brinny said:
Human beings are called human for a reason. What is it?

To distinguish Homo sapiens from other extant apes without needing to resort to clumsy cladistic terms and names. That is, for the same reason we call Pan troglodytes "chimps".

biggles53 · Mar 18, 2008

brinny said:
apparently we're not related

Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but we are related. I may not be your cousin, but I am related to you, in that we belong to the same species of ape, and that we are both related to a distant ancestor which we have in common with other species of ape.

The evidence is there...look.

brinny · Mar 18, 2008

Originally Posted by brinny
not a human being....

AintNoMonkey said:
Then what is a human being, if not a species? And is anything that is not a human a species? Is salt a species?

Or is it that biological organisms existing in nature are species? Aren't humans biological organisms? Do we not exist in nature?

We, us'n, are human beings. I have not considered nor done enough research to agree or disagree at this point if we are considered a 'species'. I would need to look up the origin of the word to determine if I find it a legitimate term or if it's a word that is just taken for granted without giving it any thought, because it is presently the norm to do so.

In the meantime I define myself as part of the human race, a human being, created in the likeness of my Creator.

We are more than just biological organisms. God formed us from the dust of the earth and breathed into us His breath of life, and we became a living soul. (that is awesome)

Are we evolving?

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