Are some people just not meant to be saved?

[LoveJC9]

Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen."

Is it possible that it is just an accident that some are in church? That maybe they are not meant to be saved and that is why they have the struggles that they have in their life?

 

[Balugon]

God doesn't choose who is saved and who is not. People choose whether they want to follow God or not. "9The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." 2 Peter 3:9. Everyone has struggles in life. Some people have struggles because they sit in church but they don't know God, or they don't really care about God. Some people come to church on Sunday and act like a full-out sinner the rest of the week. Those people can't expect good things to happen in their life if they don't actually honor God. And a lot of christians think God is a dictator, ready to zap them if they mess up. They are stuck in legalism, forgetting that it wasn't their righteous works that God them saved in the first place. Christ already did all the hard work, our job is just to grow up as God's children.

But anyway, if people would actually honor God and actually live out there Christianity. And if people were able to get out of legalism and get into grace, their lives would be easier. We all still have struggles, because the world is fallen and needs cleaned up, but at least they would be happier.

"22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace..." Galatians 5:22. So many christians are in serious lack when it comes to these three things. And yet they are what God wants for us. Christians should have joy, peace, and feel loved, and if they really knew how much God loved them (or rather knew it more-so, because I doubt many people truly know how deep and wide God's love for them is), they would have that much more joy, peace, and love. But they don't know, so they don't. And learning this is just part of the growing process as well. But if a person has been a "christian" for ten years and is still just as miserable as they were when they started, then there is definitely something they need to be continually asking God about.

 

[Rory]

I wish I was better at recalling scripture but I remember reading a few other passages that say the same thing more or less. I do believe that while God may want everyone, He knows not all will be saved. This is one of the reasons I feel I am not one of His. I heard the call, but I feel I haven't been chosen for His Kingdom.

 

[YoDude]

This thread will Fail.

 

[lostaquarium]

God chooses all who will be saved, and all who are saved were chosen by God. If you want to be a Christian, then it's because God has already chosen you.

 

[CrusaderKing]

Jesus did not die on the cross for only the few, but for everyone for all time.

 

[scraparcs]

That's the L on the TULIP if I remember my five point Calvinism correctly.

 

[Revived]

Jesus did not die on the cross for only the few, but for everyone for all time.

Exactly.


Romans 5:12-21
Death in Adam, Life in Christ

Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned— (For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come. But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many. And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification. For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)

Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.

Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more, so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.


1 John 2:2

And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

 

[LoveJC9]

Exactly.



1 John 2:2

And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

But the whole world won't be saved. People die and go to hell everyday. So, how do you know if it is just an accident that you are serving or trying to serve God. That would explain why I fail so miserably at it.

 

[JasperJackson]

LoveJC9,

In case you're sitting there reading through these posts I thought I should point out the fact that you've touched on one of the more divisive theological issues around today - how people are saved. I suggest you read up on (or ask your pastor about) Calvinism vs Arminianism vs Universalism.

Now, as for struggles, everyone has them - they're part of living in this fallen world. Is it an accident that unsaved people are in church? Well, many people come into church unsaved, hear the gospel and become Christians. But others will also go to church with other goals in mind and for immoral reasons. These are wolves and we should be careful of them. Of course discerning between the two types can be difficult and we should seek God's help in that.

 

[Edwards1984]

I'm kind of surprised this is in the singles section.

Mat 22:14For manyarecalled, but few are chosen."

Is it possible that it is just an accident that some are in church? That maybe they are not meant to be saved and that is why they have the struggles that they have in their life?

Most churches in the western world today have more tares than wheats, unfortunately. Often I wonder if the governments enacted persecution the likes of which the Roman Empire performed, how big some of these churches would remain. Or perhaps if they did what many Muslim countries did (and which the Quran commands), which was tax people for being Christians.

In John 10, Christ speaks at length about His sheep. His sheep know His voice (10:4), refuse to follow a stranger and in fact flee from them (10:5), and, again, they know His voice and their true Shepherd (10:27). To the Jews who did not believe and in fact were trying to find fault in Christ, He replied not that they didn't believe because they didn't want to, but says: "You do not believe because you are not part of my flock" (10:26). There are many masquerading as God's flock, but in the end they will the ones kept outside and told, "I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness" (Matt 7:23).

If by "struggles" you meant temptations and stumbling blocks, we all have those in our life from time to time. If you mean people who come across a stumbling block and declare, "I left Christianity because I got tired of going to church on Sunday," or, "I left Christianity because people made fun of me," or, "I left Christianity because I wanted to do my own thing," then no, they were never meant to be saved. God has sent them a "strong delusion" to show that they "did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness" (2 Thess 2:11-12).

 

[Sketcher]

Other than Judas Iscariot and a handful of Pharisees, I don't put stock in people not being meant to be saved.

 

[Luther073082]

1 Tim 2:3-4

This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.

It is a choice as to if a person decides to take grasp of the Holy Spirit's gift of faith given to them.

The Holy Spirit gives everyone the gift of faith. But it doesn't mean one has to use it.

 

[Avatar]

Romans 9
9For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sarah shall have a son. 10And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
12It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
14What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.



'nuff said.

 

[Revived]

1 Tim 2:3-4


It is a choice as to if a person decides to take grasp of the Holy Spirit's gift of faith given to them.

The Holy Spirit gives everyone the gift of faith. But it doesn't mean one has to use it.

Absolutely. For some of us (myself included) we need reach a point in which we must re-evaluate our definition of faith. God's word is infallible and the gift of faith (substance of things hoped for and evidence of things not seen) is available to everyone.

The bible, pastors and other believers can continually provide us with scriptural principles and truths but at some point, we have to believe He will deliver us. We have to believe that God is faithful and He "will not allow us to be tempted beyond what we are able" and that He "will also make the way of escape, that we may be able to bear it." If we have the wisdom and the principles ... in other words we know what to do yet we're continually not doing it ... that's not a spiritual problem. That's a rebellion problem.

Praying.

 

[b.hopeful]

Just one little point.....we are all on this side of the grave.....so never say never...we are all works in progress.

The UCC (boo hisssss...I know, now lets move on) has a campaign that says "Never put a period where God has put a comma"...no matter how you feel about that denomination...I think they make a really valid point.

 

[ampbelle3130]

lovejc,
You stated that you fail miserably at being saved.
At serving the LORD.
That is absolutely impossible.
Jesus Christ is a PERFECT redeemer. He was the PERFECT sacrifice.
And because of that, you were made perfect in Him when you
chose to wholeheartedly accept Him as your LORD and
Savior.
Everyone stumbles. Everyone misses the mark - that is the reason Christ
died for all mankind. Jesus' blood was spilled for everyone.
Accepting it does not require perfection...it simply requires faith
that even when you're imperfect, His blood makes up for what you lack.



And to answer the question - I do not believe that anyone is ever in their
walk of faith by accident. Jesus' blood is for all. Not all will be
saved but that is by exercising the free will to choose death
over life, not because God has neglected to call everyone to salvation.

 

[Scottish Knight]

Christ's death was and is sufficient for all of humankind and God offers the gift of salvation to evryone - God commands evryone to repent and believe. The problem is that there is "no-one who seeks God, no not one" No-one will come to Christ until God first makes that person willing. But all praise be to God who makes us willing and keeps us and enables us to persevere in the faith. God offers salvation to everyone but only those who God has, in His mercy, decided to love and save from eternity will accept it. It's all of Grace

 

[penNpaper]

Mat 22:14For manyarecalled, but few are chosen."

Is it possible that it is just an accident that some are in church? That maybe they are not meant to be saved and that is why they have the struggles that they have in their life?

Jesus Christ came to this world to SAVE EVERYONE. Some are called to higher things such as Preachers, Missionaries, in the Ministry, and so on. Some aren't chosen because we don't do the "call" that the Lord has set in our lives. We are human beings and we have free-will and free-choice to live for His Name or do whatever we want.

Jesus Christ SAVED all...He wasn't like Drewski won't be Forgiven...or LoveJC9 is off the list...and so on...He saved ALL who ask for Forgiveness and the Sinner's Prayer and to be SAVED through Grace and Love from the Lord Jesus Christ.

God Bless,
Drew

 

[Luther073082]

Christ's death was and is sufficient for all of humankind and God offers the gift of salvation to evryone - God commands evryone to repent and believe. The problem is that there is "no-one who seeks God, no not one" No-one will come to Christ until God first makes that person willing. But all praise be to God who makes us willing and keeps us and enables us to persevere in the faith. God offers salvation to everyone but only those who God has, in His mercy, decided to love and save from eternity will accept it. It's all of Grace

Is that the traditional teaching of the Kirk?

(I'm sorry I just had to use my own name in a sentence.)