Are NC Christians Lawless like Sabbath observers Claim?

[pasifika]

Yes, if we lie, but keep the other nine it's like breaking them all.

So when you claim you keep the 7th day Sabbath, that means you also not lie, steal, covet, murder (hate) etc..

You keep all the 10commandments as required...

 

[pasifika]

The rest in Christ is not the Sabath day rest. We only receive Christ rest though our obedience to the seventh day Sabbath rest. Hebrews 4:6, Hebrews 4:9-10


According to God the Sabbath is God's holy day and God wants us to keep Holy the same day that is holy to Him.
Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

We are blessed when we keep the Sabbath holy, not when we profane it:

Isaiah 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,
14 Then you shall delight yourself in the Lord;
And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
The mouth of the Lord has spoken.”


Paul said verbatim, there is a Sabbath keeping for the people of God. I know I want to be a people of God. God said the same thing the Sabbath is a sign between Him and His people. Ezekiel 20:20

Hebrews 4:9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God.
Rest here is sabbatismos which literally means keeping of the Sabbath. So this verse says there remains a keeping of the Sabbath for the people of God.

σαββατισμὸς (sabbatismos)
Noun - Nominative Masculine Singular
Strong's 4520: A keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

Hebrews 4:10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.


To receive the spiritual rest in Christ you must keep the Sabbath commandment, this is the door to enter into the spiritual rest in Christ. We work six days, and the seventh day Christ wants to give us spiritual rest by having communion with him for a full 24 hours not speaking our words but speaking the words of Christ, not doing our ways but the ways of Christ.

Since you probably won't read this post, per your previous comment, probably doesn't make a lot of sense to continue, so we will have to agree to disagree. God bless and take care

There is no reference or statement in Hebrews 4 that says "that we receive Christ Rest by obedience to the 7th day Sabbath Rest"...

But..."we who have "believed" enters that Rest...Hebrews 4:3

Believe in the Gospel (Hebrews 3), Not the 7th day Sabbath...

 

[SabbathBlessings]

So when you claim you keep the 7th day Sabbath, that means you also not lie, steal, covet, murder (hate) etc..

You keep all the 10commandments as required...

I do believe God can give us victory over sin. No one can keep the commandments by themself, "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me" (Philippians 4:13).

I do not believe that our sin is greater than our God.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

There is no reference or statement in Hebrews 4 that says "that we receive Christ Rest by obedience to the 7th day Sabbath Rest"...

But..."we who have "believed" enters that Rest...Hebrews 4:3

Believe in the Gospel (Hebrews 3), Not the 7th day Sabbath...

It's what the scripture says. I will go through it again....

Hebrews 4:6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience, Those who did not enter into this rest disobeyed and what they disobeyed was the Sabbath Ezekiel 20:13

Hebrews 4:9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God. Rest here is sabbatismos which literally means keeping of the Sabbath. So this verse says there remains a keeping of the Sabbath for the people of God.

σαββατισμὸς (sabbatismos)
Noun - Nominative Masculine Singular
Strong's 4520: A keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

Hebrews 4:10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.

He who entered His rest ALSO ceased from His works (direct reference to the 4th commandment Exodus 20:8-11)as God did from His (Genesis 2:1-3) When did God and man cease from their work? On the seventh day. When did God tell us to work? All other days except the seventh day. Exodus 20:9

We are blessed when we obey, not disobey.

Isaiah 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,
14 Then you shall delight yourself in the Lord;
And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
The mouth of the Lord has spoken.”

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I do believe God can give us victory over sin. No one can keep the commandments by themself, , "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me" (Philippians 4:13).

I do not believe that our sin is greater than our God.

The false gospel is that Jesus saves us to continue practicing known unrepentant sin. Many seem to believe this teaching seeking to do away with Gods' 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20. According to the scriptures those who continue practicing known unrepentant sin do not know God according to John in 1 John 2:3-4 and 1 John 3:6-10.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The false gospel is that Jesus saves us to continue practicing known unrepentant sin. Many seem to believe this teaching seeking to do away with Gods' 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20. According to the scriptures those who continue practicing known unrepentant sin do not know God according to John in 1 John 2:3-4 and 1 John 3:6-10.

Agreed. It's amazing to me that churches are actively preaching that you do not have to obey God's commandments, that you can willfully sin without consequences or that it is not a sin to break God's commandments. If the commandments of God didn't matter, the devil would certainly not make war with the remnant who still keep the commandments of God.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Agreed. It's amazing to me that churches are actively preaching that you do not have to obey God's commandments, that you can willfully sin without consequences or that it is not a sin to break God's commandments. If the commandments of God didn't matter, the devil would certainly not make war with the remnant who still keep the commandments of God. Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Yes, there is all sorts of false doctrines out there as Jesus predicted. You should visit the controversial section of the CF. There is a teaching there called Universalism that is teaching that all the unrepentant, unbelieving wicked will be saved after the second coming which is based on the same lies spoken to Eve in the garden of Eden when the Serpent told here you can disobey God and will not surely die - Genesis 3:1-5.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Yes, there is all sorts of false doctrines out there as Jesus predicted. You should visit the controversial section of the CF. There is a teaching there called Universalism that is teaching that all the unrepentant, unbelieving wicked will be saved after the second coming which is based on the same lies spoken to Eve in the garden of Eden when the Serpent told here you can disobey God and will not surely die - Genesis 3:1-5.

All the signs from Bible are there, we just need a few more things that is predicted in scripture and our precious Savior is coming back! Just like the days of Noah...so will be like the Son of Man.

Speaking of, I just found this documentary on Amazon, I think Freth told me about it. I hear it is really good.

Watch The Days of Noah: The Flood - Part 1 of 4 | Prime Video (amazon.com)

I'll check out the other thread a little later. I have stopped in on it previously. There is every wind of doctrine now which is also predicted in scripture.

I need to do some other things so I am off for now. God bless!!

 

[LoveGodsWord]

All the signs of the Bible are there, we just need a few more and our precious Savior is coming back! Just like the days of Noah...

Speaking of, I just found this documentary on Amazon, I think Freth told me about it. I hear it is really good.

Watch The Days of Noah: The Flood - Part 1 of 4 | Prime Video (amazon.com)

I'll check out the other thread a little later. I have stopped in on it previously. There is every wind of doctrine now which is predicted in scripture.

I need to do some other things so I am off for now. God bless!!

Did you see it yet? Anyhow I know the bible verses, its' today.

 

[pasifika]

I do believe God can give us victory over sin. No one can keep the commandments by themself, "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me" (Philippians 4:13).

I do not believe that our sin is greater than our God.

And that's is the problem!..God is Not required under the old covenant. it's all man by itself to follow the commandments...

But, as you quoted...God is the only one who can make you fulfilled or follow His commandments according to His Will...

This is the agreement under the old covenant..." We (people) will do everything what God said"...Exodus 19:8

Hebrews 8:7,8..if there had been nothing wrong with the first covenant, no place to sought for another. But God found fault with the "people"...

Yes, the people because we're all sinners and nothing good that dwells within us to follow a holy, righteous and spiritual law and commandments.

New covenant is covenant of promised...God will fulfilled what He'd promised. Man has no part in this covenant in regards to follow the commandments it's All God's work. And is certain!

Understanding this covenant agreement might be helpful in future discussion..

 

[SabbathBlessings]

And that's is the problem!..God is Not required under the old covenant. it's all man by itself to follow the commandments...

But, as you quoted...God is the only one who can make you fulfilled or follow His commandments according to His Will...

This is the agreement under the old covenant..." We (people) will do everything what God said"...Exodus 19:8

Hebrews 8:7,8..if there had been nothing wrong with the first covenant, no place to sought for another. But God found fault with the "people"...

God is Not the doer of this covenant but man itself or whoever followed this covenant...

New covenant is covenant of promised...God will fulfilled what He'd promised. Man has no part in this covenant in regards to follow the commandments it's All God's work. And is certain!

Understanding this covenant agreement might be helpful in future discussion..

The problem appears to be you don’t understand the New Covenant and that God’s laws didn’t disappear in the New Covenant, but are written in our hearts and minds. Hebrews 8:10, Jeremiah 31:33. I am sorry your response doesn’t make any sense and your argument that the Ten Commandments is only Old Covenant is flawed because Jesus quotes from them often in the NC. Matthew 5:19-28, Matthew 19:17-18, Revelation 22:14-15, James 2:10-12, Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7, Revelation 14:12. The role of the Ten Commandments is the same in both OC and NC, it points out sin and what we will be judged on James 2:10-12

 

[pasifika]

The problem appears to be you don’t understand the New Covenant and that God’s laws didn’t disappear in the New Covenant, but are written in our hearts and minds. Hebrews 8:10, Jeremiah 31:33. I am sorry your response doesn’t make any sense and your argument that the Ten Commandments is only Old Covenant is flawed because Jesus quotes from them often in the NC. Matthew 5:19-28, Matthew 19:17-18, Revelation 22:14-15, James 2:10-12, Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7, Revelation 14:12. The role of the Ten Commandments is the same in both OC and NC, it points out sin.

God's law uphold under the new covenant...

Not the old way of the letter, but the new way of the Spirit..Romans 7:6

Again, understanding this will be blessings..

 

[SabbathBlessings]

God's law uphold under the new covenant...

Not the old way of the letter, but the new way of the Spirit..Romans 7:6

Again, understanding this will be blessings..

If one is truly in the Spirit they will be keeping the letter. When Jesus said murder begins in the heart, He is wanting us to change our thoughts so we don’t commit the act of murder because thats where it starts. If you are walking in Christ in His Spirit you will not be sinning. Jesus gives us the Holy Spirit to those who obey. John 14:15:18, Acts 5:32.

 

[pasifika]

If one is truly in the Spirit they will be keeping the letter. When Jesus said murder begins in the heart, He is wanting us to change our thoughts so we don’t commit the act of murder because thats where it starts. If you are walking in Christ in His Spirit you will not be sinning. Jesus gives us the Holy Spirit to those who obey. John 14:15:18, Acts 5:32.

Both the "Spirit" and the "letter" are ways to follow God's law..or "Righteousness"

The old way to follow God's law is by the "letter"...

The new way is the Spirit...

As I said before God is Not required under the old covenant (letter), hence why the Spirit is the one under the new covenant way.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Both the "Spirit" and the "letter" are ways to follow God's law..or "Righteousness"

The old way to follow God's law is by the "letter"...

The new way is the Spirit...

As I said before God is Not required under the old covenant (letter), hence why the Spirit is the one under the new covenant way.

How can one claim to be in the Spirit if they are worshipping other gods, committing murder, adultery, bowing to idols, lying, stealing, not keeping the Sabbath holy, that spirit is not Christ but the other spirit. 1 John 3:8

Rom 8:
4 .. the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who are in accord with the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are in accord with the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,

 

[pasifika]

How can one claim to be in the Spirit if they are worshipping other gods, committing murder, adultery, bowing to idols, lying, stealing, not keeping the Sabbath holy, that spirit is not Christ but the other spirit. 1 John 3:8

Rom 8:
4 .. the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who are in accord with the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are in accord with the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,

If you're given the Holy Spirit to lead you then He will not lead you to do such things as you've mentioned...

But, since it's (Spirit) missing under the old covenant (letter), then your flesh will always dictate your actions. (Sin rule the flesh)
And as you've quoted..."mind set on the flesh is hostile to God"..This is the result when the SPIRIT of God is missing!

So, under the old way the "Spirit" is missing only the flesh (our sinful flesh)

 

[SabbathBlessings]

If you're given the Holy Spirit to lead you then He will not lead you to do such things as you've mentioned...

But, since it's (Spirit) missing under the old covenant (letter), then your flesh will always dictate your actions. (Sin rule the flesh)
And as you've quoted..."mind set on the flesh is hostile to God"..This is the result when the SPIRIT of God is missing!

So, under the old way the "Spirit" is missing only the flesh (our sinful flesh)

If one finds themself not keeping the law of God, they are not walking in the Spirit and are hostile to God. I agree the Holy Spirit will never lead us to sin, which is breaking the law of God, so if one is breaking God’s law it would be a good time to examine yourself to be sure you are in the faith.

Late my time so I am signing off. God bless

 

[pasifika]

If you find yourself not keeping the law of God, you are not walking in the Spirit and are hostile to God. I agree the Holy Spirit will never lead you to sin, which is breaking the law of God, so if one Indus themself breaking God’s law it would be a good time to examine themself to be sure they are in the faith.

Late my time so I am signing off. God bless

Put it this way, " when you find yourself not keeping the Law of God, is because you're not leading by Him"

Anyway, thank you again for the discussion until next time..