Apparent Age & The Incredible Foreknowledge of God

[Colter]

FYI, Dennis said he was a Christian before he became an evolutionary biologist, what do you think the odds would be that he would have become a Christian after he had become an evolutionary biologist?
How do you suppose he is able to have two conflicting ideas in his head at once? do you think he's able to compartmentalize?

Those are certainly legitimate questions. As an old earth evolutionist (evolution set in motion by an implantation of the original life forms, that is) if we didn't have the creation story of Genesis and someone recently discovered it in a monastery in Syria, even people of faith would be highly skeptical of such a story bearing in mind what we know about the age of the earth and using just a little common sense.

I think religionist are inclined to believe the more difficult stories of the Bible because of the association with other more acceptable spiritual truths not because they sound true on the surface.

 

[lesliedellow]

Those are certainly legitimate questions. As an old earth evolutionist (evolution set in motion by an implantation of the original life forms, that is) if we didn't have the creation story of Genesis and someone recently discovered it in a monastery in Syria, even people of faith would be highly skeptical of such a story bearing in mind what we know about the age of the earth and using just a little common sense.

A hand coming down out of the sky to plant the first single cell organism on Earth doesn't sound much more plausible than a hand coming down out of the sky to plant the first man and woman on Earth. Since God normally accomplishes his purposes by working within the physical laws he has created, why should the origin of life be any differently?

I think religionist are inclined to believe the more difficult stories of the Bible because of the association with other more acceptable spiritual truths not because they sound true on the surface.

I don't imagine that it is the only factor at work, but I have discovered one of the driving forces behind creationism to be an inability to distinguish between Evolution and Social Darwinism.

 

[Colter]

A hand coming down out of the sky to plant the first single cell organism on Earth doesn't sound much more plausible than a hand coming down out of the sky to plant the first man and woman on Earth. Since God normally accomplishes his purposes by working within the physical laws he has created, why should the origin of life be any differently?



I don't imagine that it is the only factor at work, but I have discovered one of the driving forces behind creationism to be an inability to distinguish between Evolution and Social Darwinism.

In my theology the primitive life forms were implanted in the shallow briny seas some 550,000,000 years ago by the Life Carriers once this planet reached a point wherein life could be sustained. The Life Carriers are celestial beings who carryout such activities on the evolutionary world(s) of time and space. God is spirit, no hands reaching out of the sky.

Also, in my theology the world had fallen long before Adam and Eve arrived from their headquarter sphere on their preordained mission. The "crafty beast" was already evil, already working against the will of the Father. In a short time the pair fell into self will "sin", outflanked by the "prince of this world". They would soon repent, the beast never did.

By the times of the writing of Genesis, by Hebrews for Hebrews, the distant days of Adam and Eve were believed to have been the beginning of humanity in the Mesopotamian creation stories. However within the fragmented narratives one can clearly see Cain leaving Adams tribe to go out into a populated earth where he would find his wife and a city.

 

[BrriKerr]

In my theology the primitive life forms were implanted in the shallow briny seas some 550,000,000 years ago by the Life Carriers once this planet reached a point wherein life could be sustained. The Life Carriers are celestial beings who carryout such activities on the evolutionary world(s) of time and space. God is spirit, no hands reaching out of the sky.

Also, in my theology the world had fallen long before Adam and Eve arrived from their headquarter sphere on their preordained mission. The "crafty beast" was already evil, already working against the will of the Father. In a short time the pair fell into self will "sin", outflanked by the "prince of this world". They would soon repent, the beast never did.

By the times of the writing of Genesis, by Hebrews for Hebrews, the distant days of Adam and Eve were believed to have been the beginning of humanity in the Mesopotamian creation stories. However within the fragmented narratives one can clearly see Cain leaving Adams tribe to go out into a populated earth where he would find his wife and a city.

What makes your version of events any more likely than the thousands of others around the world? will you admit that your parents and your country are the reason for you believing as you do?

 

[Colter]

What makes your version of events any more likely than the thousands of others around the world? will you admit that your parents and your country are the reason for you believing as you do?

I'm a student of the Urantia revelation. Yes, I was born into Christianity which, as I have stated earlier, presented a disjointed, inconsistent message to me. But I do see your point, most people are taught the religion of their parents. I have always believed in God and Jesus but the associated narratives and such left a lot to be desired.

In my teens I discovered the Urantia Book as my father was a sort of closet reader. At 22 I had a spiritual awakening which motivated me to search for truth in earnest. Having heard bits and pieces of the UB I sat down and read the entire thing. All things considered the "version" of events revealed in the UB made sense to me.



Were you taught the Atheist doctrine by your parents?

 

[AV1611VET]

In my teens I discovered the Urantia Book as my father was a sort of closet reader.

What does that mean?

You mean your father, who was a closet reader, introduced you to it?

Or do you mean your father left it out and you found it?

Or do you mean your father left it out so you could find it?

Or what?

 

[BrriKerr]

Were you taught the Atheist doctrine by your parents?

I was never told that gods existed so I never thought about gods, I didn't collect stamps but I was never taught not to collect stamps, were you taught not to believe in everything you don't believe in? just because I claim there are little green men on Mars do you need to be taught not to believe in them? no your brain simply tells you it's not true.

Atheism is simply the rejection of religious claims, you say there is a God and I say I don't believe you, how many religious claims do you reject? how many people telling you their God is real do you not believe?

If a friend told you he had an invisible dragon in his garage why would you not believe him? after all you expect people to believe you when you tell them there is an invisible God around somewhere?

 

[AV1611VET]

I was never told that gods existed ...

No missionaries?

And isn't "Christianity" a state religion where you're from?

 

[lesliedellow]

I was never told that gods existed so I never thought about gods,

Goodness me, surely you don't mean to say that you are a product of your culture. I mean, that only applies to theists, doesn't it?

And if you are from the Uk, you will have had more than enough conditioning to make you at least an apatheist.

 

[Colter]

What does that mean?

You mean your father, who was a closet reader, introduced you to it?

Or do you mean your father left it out and you found it?

Or do you mean your father left it out so you could find it?

Or what?

We were members a fairly moderate Methodist church which mom and dad would drag us to on Sundays. The kids would go to Sunday school and the parents went to their adult class. Occasionally we would go to 11:00 service. At home dad would read the UB a lot over in his recliner in the den while we were watching Archie Bunker and Mash. He found the book through one of his patients in the 60's. Every so often he would read one of those profound paragraphs to us. It was as if I already knew the material.

 

[AV1611VET]

We were members a fairly moderate Methodist church which mom and dad would drag us to on Sundays.

Your mom musta done a lot of sewing on Mondays.

At home dad would read the UB a lot over in his recliner in the den while we were watching Archie Bunker and Mash. He found the book through one of his patients in the 60's. Every so often he would read one of those profound paragraphs to us. It was as if I already knew the material.

As I suspected.

You were taught Urantia.

You didn't "discover" it, like you said you did.

That's two things you've said I don't believe now.

 

[Colter]

I was never told that gods existed so I never thought about gods, I didn't collect stamps but I was never taught not to collect stamps, were you taught not to believe in everything you don't believe in? just because I claim there are little green men on Mars do you need to be taught not to believe in them? no your brain simply tells you it's not true.

Atheism is simply the rejection of religious claims, you say there is a God and I say I don't believe you, how many religious claims do you reject? how many people telling you their God is real do you not believe?

If a friend told you he had an invisible dragon in his garage why would you not believe him? after all you expect people to believe you when you tell them there is an invisible God around somewhere?

Religions are for the most part man made, evolutionary. They are stimulated by the common Spirit of Worship within the mind of man. Evolutionary religions are enhanced by revelations great and small.

Common sense does seem to safeguard man but faith also stamps spiritual truth with conviction. All religions contain varying qualities of spiritual truth. Some religions have been born out of the visitation of revelation. But they to become contaminated.

 

[Doveaman]

*They refused to love the truth so as to be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie* -- (2 Thess 2:10-12).
Your bible disagrees, God sends delusions to persuade people to believe in lies, the very definition of a deceiver.

It is true that God sends delusions, but He only sends them to those who reject His revealed truth. Your rejection of God's revealed truth indicates to God that you prefer a lie, so God sends you the lie that you prefer.

So if you are deceived by the lie, it is not God's fault, it is your fault.

 

[BrriKerr]

And isn't "Christianity" a state religion where you're from?

By the time I was first told about religions I was old enough to realise they were all ridiculous, I was lucky because I know other kids who had it drummed into them.

 

[Colter]

Your mom musta done a lot of sewing on Mondays.As I suspected.

You were taught Urantia.

You didn't "discover" it, like you said you did.

That's two things you've said I don't believe now.

Dad didn't teach it to us like Jesus teaching people who sat at his feet so you are just creating things to argue about. It wasn't until after my spiritual awakening that I pursued it in earnest. I surpassed my Fathers literacy on the UB after 25 years of studying it. We would go to conferences and such early on but frankly latter in life he didn't read it much and kind of returned to his Christian roots before he died. He picked a country preacher to preach his funeral. After the preacher did his thing I got up and gave a sermon from the UB.

 

[Goonie]

It is true that God sends delusions, but He only sends them to those who reject His revealed truth. Your rejection of God's revealed truth indicates to God that you prefer a lie, so God sends you the lie that you prefer.

So if you are deceived by the lie, it is not God's fault, it is your fault.

 

[BrriKerr]

Goodness me, surely you don't mean to say that you are a product of your culture. I mean, that only applies to theists, doesn't it?

Of course I was a product of my family and culture that's why I know that what you believe did not come from anywhere other than someone else's belief and it has nothing to with truth or Gods.

And if you are from the Uk, you will have had more than enough conditioning to make you at least an apatheist.

75% of British people are not religious, why do you think that is? because they are not MADE religious like Americans are.

 

[BrriKerr]

Religions are for the most part man made, evolutionary. They are stimulated by the common Spirit of Worship within the mind of man. Evolutionary religions are enhanced by revelations great and small.

Fear is where religions come from, evolution taught us to fear what we did not know.

Common sense does seem to safeguard man but faith also stamps spiritual truth with conviction. All religions contain varying qualities of spiritual truth. Some religions have been born out of the visitation of revelation. But they to become contaminated.

There is no 'spiritual truth' because there are no spirits.

 

[Colter]

By the time I was first told about religions I was old enough to realise they were all ridiculous, I was lucky because I know other kids who had it drummed into them.

I realized the Atheist belief was ridiculous when I was a child.

 

[BrriKerr]

Goodness me, surely you don't mean to say that you are a product of your culture. I mean, that only applies to theists, doesn't it?

And if you are from the Uk, you will have had more than enough conditioning to make you at least an apatheist.

I noticed you didn't tell me how many religious claims you reject.