Appalachian Mountains: Refutation of Catastrophic Plate Tectonism

Mechanical Bliss

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Catastrophic plate tectonism is an explanation that has no supporting evidence, no explanation for the evidence that refutes it, and no viable mechanism. There are three general categories of fatal problems with CPT:
(1) Mechanism (discussed previously: http://www.christianforums.com/t60449)
(2) Rate of plate motions (discussed previously: http://www.christianforums.com/t50891)
(3) Configuration of the plates--this thread

Catastrophic plate tectonism is wishful thinking devised by young earth creationists to circumvent the fact that there is a lack of water available for a global flood to occur given earth's topography. It serves as a way to "flatten" earth's topography and generate it afterwards to produce what we see today.

Creationists usurp the notion of a supercontinent fragmenting, but this is only half the story. CPT is summarized by the compression of the breakup of Pangea over the past ~200 million years into a single year.

However, this still fails to explain earth's topography.

Paleomagnetic studies (simplified: measuring the orientation of magnetized minerals in rocks, the orientation of the rocks in the ground, and radiometric dating) give us the position of the continents with respect to the earth's dipole magnetic field.

They show that the configuration of tectonic plates has changed such that there has been more than one supercontinent. Supercontinents form in cycles, which explains the facts that (1) mountain ranges are not all the same age as CPT would predict and (2) mountain ranges that were in the supercontinent interior, like the Appalachians, exist. CPT does not predict the existence of the Appalachian Mountain range.

The Appalachians were a result of the formation of Pangea, not its breakup. They formed in three stages, two of which were the accretion of continental fragments (e.g., Taconic) and finally the collision of Europe and Africa which sutured the continents together. These stages took place mainly from the Devonian to the Permian. Pangea then fragmented after the Appalachians formed from these collisions, and therefore, CPT cannot account for their existence. CPT only allows for half the story (the breakup of pangea) without accounting for mountain ranges that still exist, but were formed before Pangea existed.

Here are some visual aids to consider:

Here is a generalized diagram of the earth during the Devonian. The ocean between modern North America (Laurentia) and modern Africa/Europe (Baltica) was reduced by the subduction of the oceanic crust between these continents beneath Africa (see the line with the triangles indicating the direction of subduction). The other two collisions of continental fragments sutured onto modern North America (Laurentia) in the early stages of the formation of the Appalacians (see the line with dash marks). This is prior to the formation of Pangea:

devonian.JPG


Here is a generalized diagram indicating how mountain ranges that do not result from volcanic activity along a subduction zone form: continental collision. You can see the two accretionary events as the Taconic and Avalon terranes collided with Laurentia in the Silurian and Devonian. Formation of Pangea caused the uplift that formed the Appalachian Mountains at the end of the Paleozoic:

fig53.jpg


And finally, here is a java animation constructed from paleomagnetic data. This illustrates what creationists claim CPT is (minus the ages of course). As you can see, the continents are diverging. The Appalachians were once at the center of Pangea and formed because of those collisions rather than after it:

http://www.scotese.com/sfsanim.htm

Usually the focus is on the Himalaya mountain range which CPT could predict if it overcame the other falsifications against it, and this distracts from what CPT cannot explain. CPT does not predict the existence of the Appalachian range because there is no collision with North America to form them. Their existence prior to Pangea brings back the water problem CPT was designed to avoid in the first place (minus all other problems with CPT). Thus, their existence disproves a global flood/CPT combination used by YECists.

Sources:
Condie, Kent C. and Sloan, Robert E. Origin and Evolution of Earth: Principles of Historical Geology. New Jersey: Prentice Hall, Inc., 1998. (Image 1 - Devonian plate configuration)
http://3dparks.wr.usgs.gov/nyc/valleyandridge/valleyandridge.htm (Image 2 - Paleozoic plate tectonic cross section from the United States Geological Survey)

OP Summary:

In conclusion, the crux of my argument is that since the Appalachian Mountain Range was formed as a result of the assembly of Pangea rather than after its breakup, their existence is not predicted by catastrophic plate tectonism, which proposes a low-relief supercontinent that fragmented over the course of one year.

Since CPT does not predict their existence, CPT is false, and the supercontinent is no longer a low-relief one, but rather one with a tall mountain range, reintroducing the problem of a lack of water on earth for a global flood to occur thereby falsifying a global flooding event as well.
 

Bargainfluger

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And-U-Say said:
Prediction: no response.
And here's Tom Tasselmeyer with our five-day forcast. Tom, over to you.

Tom: Thanks Lindsay. As you can see, we just had a large post blow in from the eastern seaboard. With it came some very solid evidence, and even a few graphics to better illustrate a point. We're expecting a sprinkling of "bumps" from a few evos, and you might see an occasional weak attempt at a refutation by some hopeful creationists, but it seems we've been through the biggest of this post, and it should start tapering off by Monday night into Tuesday, where our Darwin radar shows it will have dropped off the first page completely. Back to you, Stan.
 
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Mr. Ex Nihilo

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Mechanical Bliss said:
Paleomagnetic studies (simplified: measuring the orientation of magnetized minerals in rocks, the orientation of the rocks in the ground, and radiometric dating) give us the position of the continents with respect to the earth's dipole magnetic field.

Have the earth's magnetic poles moved over time?
 
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Dennis Moore

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Mr. Ex Nihilo

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Dennis Moore said:
Yes. They still drift to this day.

Record of recent drift in the North Magnetic Pole.

The South Magnitic Pole is actually off the Antarctic ice sheet, it has drifted so much.

Thanks, but I know that they drift today. The south magnetic pole has drifted some 500 miles in the last 400 years or so if I recall correctly.

I guess I was wondering if anyone has rendered a map of the meandering of the earth's magnetic poles as they repositioned themselves along earth's geological history in conjunction with the continental drift -- that is, according to the geomagnetic record.

I'd be very interested in viewing it. :)
 
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Mr. Ex Nihilo

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Dennis Moore said:
Then you need to phrase your questions better. :p

My apologies.

I figured that the "long range" nature of my question concerning the earth's magnetic fields would be self-evident since the nature of this thread is highly detailed in the "long range" positioning and effects of plate tectonics.

For that matter, I even quoted the text that I was inquiring about:

Paleomagnetic studies (simplified: measuring the orientation of magnetized minerals in rocks, the orientation of the rocks in the ground, and radiometric dating) give us the position of the continents with respect to the earth's dipole magnetic field.

Is this not talking about determining the positions of the continents in the distant past based on paleomagnetic studies?

In other words, since the nature of this thread is the discussion of plate tectonic over long time periods (and the evidence thereof), I thought it would be safe to assume that my request for information regarding the placement of the earth's magnetic fields in the earth's history would be seen within this context.

Apparently, I was wrong in assuming this.

Having said this, though -- and having now explained it even further -- can someone please provide me a link to a map of what I requested if there is one available?
 
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zeontes

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The shifting magnetic pole is a good question. I always enjoyed the diagrams that also showed where the equator was during different times. Of course I mean where the continents were in relation to the equator. Has anyone done the math on the energy released by these colisions? It must have been massive. Then the break up would take massive amounts of energy as well. It is very fascinating.
 
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zeontes said:
The shifting magnetic pole is a good question. I always enjoyed the diagrams that also showed where the equator was during different times. Of course I mean where the continents were in relation to the equator. Has anyone done the math on the energy released by these colisions? It must have been massive. Then the break up would take massive amounts of energy as well. It is very fascinating.

You're right about the energy amounts, but you have to consider a time span of a few million years. You'd get plenty of volcanic activity, though.
 
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Mr. Ex Nihilo

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Well...I've been searching for possible maps which might display this information (the migration of the magnetic poles in relation to continental drift over time) -- and so far I haven't been able to find anything solid (except for the most recent changes on a web site at NASA).

I did, however, come across one web site which had some intesting information. Apparently scientists have been observing changes in the direction of earth's magnetic field which took place recently as well as in the distant past. For example, NASA’s website features a map showing the gradual northward migration of the north magnetic pole in the past century and a half.

Since more than double the time interval has elapsed since the last reversal, compared to the time lapse between the previous two pole reversals, some believe we may be overdue for the next north-south flip. (1,2) However, though the interval between reversals of the Earth’s magnetic field can be as short as 5,000 years, it can also be as long as 50 million years. There does not seem to be any logic or rule governing the planet’s behavior.

It is not only the direction but also the strength of this magnetic field that is a concern. For example, according to the web site I was reading, in the time of dinosaurs, at an estimated 2.5 gauss, it was eighty percent stronger than it is now. Some suspect that this may have been one of the reasons such gigantic life forms thrived.

It is now accepted that a catastrophic event ended the reign of giant reptiles. However, they did not re-evolve to equivalent dimensions. And the disappearance of mammalian “mega-fauna” in more recent times is still considered to be a mystery. The mastodons and mammoths would have towered over modern elephants.

Why are there so few large terrestrial animals today? Does the earth's magnetic field play a factor in this?

BTW: this was the web sight where I found this information:

http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/02/27/6900064_Magnet_Pole_Shift/
 
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Split Rock

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Mechanical Bliss said:
In conclusion, the crux of my argument is that since the Appalachian Mountain Range was formed as a result of the assembly of Pangea rather than after its breakup, their existence is not predicted by catastrophic plate tectonism, which proposes a low-relief supercontinent that fragmented over the course of one year.

Since CPT does not predict their existence, CPT is false, and the supercontinent is no longer a low-relief one, but rather one with a tall mountain range, reintroducing the problem of a lack of water on earth for a global flood to occur thereby falsifying a global flooding event as well.
Another excellent post!

One additional point I would like to make is that the Appalachians are worn down compared to the Rockies and Himalayain mountain ranges, which shows that they have undergone a longer period of erosion. This supports the old mainstream age for these mountains.
 
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