Discussion Apostolic Power - what is it? What does it look like?

[Guojing]

Not so obvious. In fact I would consider that a unique interpretation, and not supported to any degree by any scripture.

So why didn't Simon made him that same offer he did when he met peter and John later?

 

[Always in His Presence]

If what you are saying is true, then have you ever ask yourself why no one is even bothered to offer anyone with those gifts today, anything, to "pass those gifts", whatever they are?

"Those Gifts" are given as the Spirit wills - see verses already quoted - and are given by God to the church - Still is happening 2,000 years later because the church is here 2,000 years later.

It happens every Sunday in churches world wide. People are filled with the Holy Spirit.

The infilling of the Spirit happens continuously -

Please note:

Statement of Purpose - REVISED:Spirit-Filled/Charismatic Community Statement of Purpose

Spirit-Filled / Charismatic Community Statement of Purpose This forum is for All Spirit-Filled/Charismatic Members to discuss and Fellowship Together. Since it is mainly for Discussion and Fellowship we have also given certain additions to that with the use of Thread Tags. These you will find...

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Spirit-Filled, Pentecostal and/or Charismatic believers can be from ANY Christian Denomination. They are those who believe that all the various spiritual gifts (or charisms) listed in the New Testament (including but not limited to the manifestations gifts found in I Corinthians 12:8-10) are active in the Church today and desirable in the life of the individual believer, for the edification of the Body of Christ.​

It is not a requirement that the individual exercises/exhibits any specific spiritual gift(s).​

 

[Guojing]

"Those Gifts" are given as the Spirit wills - see verses already quoted - and are given by God to the church - Still is happening 2,000 years later because the church is here 2,000 years later.

It happens every Sunday in churches world wide. People are filled with the Holy Spirit.

The infilling of the Spirit happens continuously -

Please note:

Statement of Purpose - REVISED:Spirit-Filled/Charismatic Community Statement of Purpose

Spirit-Filled / Charismatic Community Statement of Purpose This forum is for All Spirit-Filled/Charismatic Members to discuss and Fellowship Together. Since it is mainly for Discussion and Fellowship we have also given certain additions to that with the use of Thread Tags. These you will find...

www.christianforums.com

Spirit-Filled, Pentecostal and/or Charismatic believers can be from ANY Christian Denomination. They are those who believe that all the various spiritual gifts (or charisms) listed in the New Testament (including but not limited to the manifestations gifts found in I Corinthians 12:8-10) are active in the Church today and desirable in the life of the individual believer, for the edification of the Body of Christ.​

It is not a requirement that the individual exercises/exhibits any specific spiritual gift(s).​

Since you are not addressing my statement, alright then, we can agree to disagree about this.

I will await your "Phillip is one of the 12" explanation.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Since you are not addressing my statement, alright then, we can agree to disagree about this.

Your statement on Philip was off topic -

 

[Always in His Presence]

Definitions?

I have heard the term "Apostolic Power" used a number of time over the last 35 years or so.

I thought this would be a good discussion to have.

1. What is it?
2. What does it look like in real life?
3. Was it only for the 12?
4. Did the 84 other Apostles in the New Testament operate in it?
5. Is there a modern day Apostle flowing in this power?

Let's do our best to be kind to one another - tender hearted

This is the topic of the thread.

 

[Guojing]

Your statement on Philip was off topic -

It is related to your points 2, 3 and 4, as I have already explained.

So you still think Phillip in Acts 8 is one of the 12, but you don't want to explain why you think that, even after you stated you will do so?

Interesting, alright then.

 

[jiminpa]

So why didn't Simon made him that same offer he did when he met peter and John later?

So many problems with that question. For starters, I'm not Simon the Sorcerer, so I have no idea why he made his decisions.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Definitions?

I have heard the term "Apostolic Power" used a number of time over the last 35 years or so.

I thought this would be a good discussion to have.

1. What is it?
2. What does it look like in real life?
3. Was it only for the 12?
4. Did the 84 other Apostles in the New Testament operate in it?
5. Is there a modern day Apostle flowing in this power?

Let's do our best to be kind to one another - tender hearted

when I hear the word power juxtaposed to the word apostolic I envision people wanting the spiritual powers to alter reality, afflict detractors, stuff like that.

Skipping the "what it is not" dialogue. What it is, is a spiritual connection to the creator that surpasses what born again Christians already have. Its power is based on the laws of physics in the new heaven and new earth that are yet to come.

Because of politics, if there is a modern day Apostle, they're probably avoiding the "all talk" and focusing on what God "sent" them to do. So in circular logic form, unless your spiritual purpose intersects with theirs - you probably won't meet one. (my answer to question 5 don't know)

 

[Guojing]

So many problems with that question. For starters, I'm not Simon the Sorcerer, so I have no idea why he made his decisions.

So instead of saying that my view is "not supported to any degree by any scripture", can I invite you to agree with me that "there is some support in scripture, in the way Simon reacted to Peter and John vis a vis Phillip, but just not to a degree that will convince someone like yourself"?

Would that be a more reasonable conclusion?

 

[Always in His Presence]

What it is, is a spiritual connection to the creator that surpasses what born again Christians already have. Its power is based on the laws of physics in the new heaven and new earth that are yet to come.

Where do i find this in Scripture - and what are the laws of physics in the new heaven and new earth. I don't remember ever reading anything like this, but If you can show it to me in Scripture I am willing to learn.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Where do i find this in Scripture - and what are the laws of physics in the new heaven and new earth. I don't remember ever reading anything like this, but If you can show it to me in Scripture I am willing to learn.

First point to examine is when the apostles are called first fruits of the new creation, and that we are called new creations.

Another good point is what Jesus said "what can be done" with even a little faith (anything).

Another good thing to observe is when Jesus teaches to pray, one of the concepts is "may your will be done on earth as it is in Heaven." this illustrates God's will is already done as soon as He wills it in Heaven.

Yet another thing to take note of is when it is written, of while they were yet speaking or before they even asked God answered the prayer. Since God teaches as a base, "do unto others, as you would have them do unto you" this speaks to His environment .. in that before God speaks, there are results. However, at what point it came to this, I do not know .. as it is also written, He spoke of things that were not as though they were .. when He created everything.

The references are peppered throughout the scripture, but made clearer in the new testament writings. The above is what came back to remembrance, but "what I said" was based on a lot of "coming back to remembrance" over the years.

 

[Always in His Presence]

First point to examine is when the apostles are called first fruits of the new creation, and that we are called new creations.

When did that happen? Chapter and verse please.

Another good point is what Jesus said "what can be done" with even a little faith (anything).

Citation showing it's exclusive connections to Apostolic power please.

Another good thing to observe is when Jesus teaches to pray, one of the concepts is "may your will be done on earth as it is in Heaven." this illustrates God's will is already done as soon as He wills it in Heaven.

Citation showing it's exclusive connections to Apostolic power please

Yet another thing to take note of is when it is written, of while they were yet speaking or before they even asked God answered the prayer. Since God teaches as a base, "do unto others, as you would have them do unto you" this speaks to His environment .. in that before God speaks, there are results. However, at what point it came to this, I do not know .. as it is also written, He spoke of things that were not as though they were .. when He created everything.

Citation showing it's exclusive connections to Apostolic power please.

The references are peppered throughout the scripture, but made clearer in the new testament writings. The above is what came back to remembrance, but "what I said" was based on a lot of "coming back to remembrance" over the years.

I may be a little dense - but I fail to see any connection whatsoever to anything remotely close to an answer to this question:

Where do I find this in Scripture - and what are the laws of physics in the new heaven and new earth. I don't remember ever reading anything like this, but If you can show it to me in Scripture I am willing to learn.

and/or anything remotely close to what "Apostolic Power" is supported in Scripture

 

[jiminpa]

So instead of saying that my view is "not supported to any degree by any scripture", can I invite you to agree with me that "there is some support in scripture, in the way Simon reacted to Peter and John vis a vis Phillip, but just not to a degree that will convince someone like yourself"?

Would that be a more reasonable conclusion?

That requires creating an event out of biblical silence. The overall context of the Bible is that Phillip was no less capable than any other disciple then and now.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

When did that happen? Chapter and verse please.

Citation showing it's exclusive connections to Apostolic power please.

Citation showing it's exclusive connections to Apostolic power please

Citation showing it's exclusive connections to Apostolic power please.


I may be a little dense - but I fail to see any connection whatsoever to anything remotely close to an answer to this question:



and/or anything remotely close to what "Apostolic Power" is supported in Scripture

I actually don't care if there are apostles, I just posted information I remembered from the scriptures because that's the topic of the thread. I posted some stuff, but am not really interested in continuing an interrogation. The things I posted were to spark ideas so you could continue your own research on the topic.

 

[Always in His Presence]

I actually don't care if there are apostles, I just posted information I remembered from the scriptures because that's the topic of the thread. I posted some stuff, but am not really interested in continuing an interrogation. The things I posted were to spark ideas so you could continue your own research on the topic.

Thank you for your thoughts....

 

[Guojing]

That requires creating an event out of biblical silence. The overall context of the Bible is that Phillip was no less capable than any other disciple then and now.

It is hardly silence since scripture did tell us Simon made an offer to Peter and John, but not to Phillip.

But I can see you are determined to believe that Phillip the deacon was no less capable than any of the 12., even when I still offered you an "out" where you can still disagree, in that conclusion.

Alright then.

 

[jiminpa]

It is hardly silence since scripture did tell us Simon made an offer to Peter and John, but not to Phillip.

But I can see you are determined to believe that Phillip the deacon was no less capable than any of the 12., even when I still offered you an "out" where you can still disagree, in that conclusion.

Alright then.

How is the Bible saying nothing, not silence? The Bible does not say why Simon did not offer Philip money. If it does, please cite the chapter and verse.

 

[Guojing]

How is the Bible saying nothing, not silence? The Bible does not say why Simon did not offer Philip money. If it does, please cite the chapter and verse.

All I am saying is that scripture recorded

• Simon did not make an offer to Phillip to get that power but
• Simon made an offer to Peter and John to get that power

Of course the Bible did not say "why", that was not my point.

 

[jiminpa]

All I am saying is that scripture recorded

• Simon did not make an offer to Phillip to get that power but
• Simon made an offer to Peter and John to get that power

Of course the Bible did not say "why", that was not my point.

But you want us to draw a conclusion not in evidence. No thanks.

 

[Guojing]

But you want us to draw a conclusion not in evidence. No thanks.

I am merely saying that this is not an example of scripture silence.

That is why I offered you the more reasonable conclusion that ""there is some support in scripture, in the way Simon reacted to Peter and John vis a vis Phillip, but just not to a degree that will convince someone like yourself"?"

You do not need to conclude that scripture backs my interpretation, but just to conclude there is "some support".

Is that conclusion that unreasonable to you, that you have to reject it completely?