ANZAC Day...what does it mean to you...will you be doing anything to commemorate it ?

[Grannie Annie]

For me it's a day when I remember the fallen from all wars, as most people do. On a personal level, I had an uncle who was blown out of the sky in a Lanc bomber on a raid to Germany in 1944. He was 24 and my mother's only brother, RIP Uncle George.

 

[tgg]

For the first time, I will attend a dawn service.

 

[tBCfC]

I went to Gallipoli a couple of years ago - in June, not April.

It was very moving. The battleground is so small and rugged it's a wonder anyone survived. The fighting was so intense that there are bullets in the museum that have collided in mid air and been welded together. It must have been hell. When you get there you can immediately see that it was the worst possible place to land. A kilometer either side there is flat land with an easy path across the hills.

What impressed me most was the reverence the Turks have for the battle too. In a very real sense it was also their nation's birth. Winning against the allies gave Ataturk the power and respect to confront the Sultans and wrest power into the hands of the general population.

Over history Istanbul and that region of Turkey have been arguably the most invaded piece of land in the world.

Aussies are made to feel very welcome - this could be because we were Turkey's first victory in centuries!

 

[Grannie Annie]

TGG...I hope you have a very moving time at the service. My nephews have been to Gallipoli and I believe like most people who go there, it was a very profound experience. I've never been to a dawn service, but when I was a little girl I marched a couple of times with my father in memory of my uncle. I had a great-uncle killed in the first war, but I don't think it was at Gallipoli. I remember when I was little I used to look on all the war memorials to try and find my dad's name...it was years before I learned these were the names of those who had died. I've found my uncle George's name on the Canberra War Memorial...I found that a very emotional experience.

 

[TheDag]

i get woken up by a dawn service each year. held across road from where i live.
flatmate sleeps right through it

 

[Bungle_Bear]

Always a dawn service. My great uncle was killed in the Great War @ Passchendaele. My Mum's dad fought in Africa in WWII. My cousin's husband was killed in first Gulf War and my brother-in-law is an army surgeon currently in Afghanistan.

We usually go with a mate of mine who is ex-special forces. Just watching the emotions crossing his face remembering men and events he can never tell us about is very moving.

 

[Grannie Annie]

Bear you certainly have a long family history of involvement in wars. My son-in-law is in the Army now and is expected to go overseas this year. Unfortunately I'm estranged from my daughter, so don't know if she'll tell me when he goes.

 

[DarkMonk]

I know I'm going to take a hammering for this post...so go ahead...

But why is it that countries tend to honor people that have gone into war???

irrespective of what they fought for, freedom, liberty, oil, money, etc...

WAR is never the answer!, making an "excuse" to kill another human being for whatever reason is not an excuse!!!!!

I've lived in many countries, I have friends who have fought against Australia in the past, I've lived in countries in which battled current Western countries,
Some of my friends would call the diggers who have died their enemies, and how Australians invaded their country etc, etc...

I'm just curious though..., from the Christian perspective...
Why are we remembering/honoring "The sins of our friends/relative/brothers"?

PS: I have relatives that have died in wars, although I remember them.
I will never honor them for going to WAR, whatever cause that is.

 

[tgg]

I know I'm going to take a hammering for this post...so go ahead...

But why is it that countries tend to honor people that have gone into war???

irrespective of what they fought for, freedom, liberty, oil, money, etc...

WAR is never the answer!, making an "excuse" to kill another human being for whatever reason is not an excuse!!!!!

I've lived in many countries, I have friends who have fought against Australia in the past, I've lived in countries in which battled current Western countries,
Some of my friends would call the diggers who have died their enemies, and how Australians invaded their country etc, etc...

I'm just curious though..., from the Christian perspective...
Why are we remembering/honoring "The sins of our friends/relative/brothers"?

PS: I have relatives that have died in wars, although I remember them.
I will never honor them for going to WAR, whatever cause that is.

The Byrds - Turn! Turn! Turn! - YouTube

Ecclesiastes 3:

1 There is a time for everything,
and a season for every activity under the heavens:
2 a time to be born and a time to die,
a time to plant and a time to uproot,
3 a time to kill and a time to heal,
a time to tear down and a time to build,
4 a time to weep and a time to laugh,
a time to mourn and a time to dance,
5 a time to scatter stones and a time to gather them,
a time to embrace and a time to refrain from embracing,
6 a time to search and a time to give up,
a time to keep and a time to throw away,
7 a time to tear and a time to mend,
a time to be silent and a time to speak,
8 a time to love and a time to hate,
a time for war and a time for peace.

 

[Born to Watch]

I know I'm going to take a hammering for this post...so go ahead...

But why is it that countries tend to honor people that have gone into war???

irrespective of what they fought for, freedom, liberty, oil, money, etc...

WAR is never the answer!, making an "excuse" to kill another human being for whatever reason is not an excuse!!!!!

I've lived in many countries, I have friends who have fought against Australia in the past, I've lived in countries in which battled current Western countries,
Some of my friends would call the diggers who have died their enemies, and how Australians invaded their country etc, etc...

I'm just curious though..., from the Christian perspective...
Why are we remembering/honoring "The sins of our friends/relative/brothers"?

PS: I have relatives that have died in wars, although I remember them.
I will never honor them for going to WAR, whatever cause that is.

The Old Testament is relative today as it was over 2000 years ago.
Sadly this world is not Christian and without war the world would be a far different place.
Hitler needed to be stopped by violence
Stalin needed to be stopped by violence, millions died.
Mao needed to be stopped by violence, he wasn't and millions and millions died.

The bible (OT) teaches that from a secular perspective the only way to stop violence is to return it. God in the OT used violence to destroy the violent, this is not acceptable for Christians obviously but it is the only answer for secular society.
Legally the tooth for tooth eye for eye system works effectively, it would reduce crime. It can be extended to nations. From a secular perspective only.

Sadly in the same respect war is an answer to keep violent regimes in check. To deny that is to deny our fallen nature.
Irrespective of if we can make an excuse to kill others, others have a reason ,whatever it is, and do kill. This needs to be rectified.
I hate war but it is a reality of life in a fallen world. The system of checks and balances.

Most of our soldiers stood up against communism fascism and of late religious oppression. We are remembering them because they are our history, they are our family's, they are loved.

 

[Grannie Annie]

Born to Watch....I agree with you totally !! If my relatives hadn't fought against aggression, then I would not have the freedom I have today....I am PROUD of their sacrifice. I don't believe it's a sin to defend yourself or your country.

 

[Born to Watch]

Born to Watch....I agree with you totally !! If my relatives hadn't fought against aggression, then I would not have the freedom I have today....I am PROUD of their sacrifice. I don't believe it's a sin to defend yourself or your country.

Sorry thats not what I said, I said for secular society the law is different to that of the Christian society.
Can Christians fight and kill to defend themselves, I think the bible is clear on that teaching.

Our promise is Jesus not ourselves.
Sorry to disagree.

 

[Grannie Annie]

Sorry thats not what I said, I said for secular society the law is different to that of the Christian society.
Can Christians fight and kill to defend themselves, I think the bible is clear on that teaching.

Our promise is Jesus not ourselves.
Sorry to disagree.

Sorry... my confusion !!

 

[TheDag]

A interesting statement was made today by a friend. they said imagine if the japanese wanted to come here once or twice a year every year to mourn those who died in war. Would we show them the same respect and courtesy that the turkish people show us. Upon thinking about it I came to the same conclusion they did. The answer is no we would make a huge fuss and start media campaigns and the like to stop it from happening.

 

[Born to Watch]

A interesting statement was made today by a friend. they said imagine if the japanese wanted to come here once or twice a year every year to mourn those who died in war. Would we show them the same respect and courtesy that the turkish people show us. Upon thinking about it I came to the same conclusion they did. The answer is no we would make a huge fuss and start media campaigns and the like to stop it from happening.

If the money was right???

 

[WayonDown]

If you've got contrary views to soldiering, ANZAC day and whatever else, you are well entitled to it, but keep it out of this thread, you can rant and rave elsewhere. Jesus had nothing against the military, and people parading with this view are delusional. He told a Roman soldier to be happy with his wages. Would he have told a prostitute to be happy with her wages? Unlikely. War is an inevitable part of life, it always has been and it will be for the foreseeable future. You can construct whatever candy views you want on how we must avoid it and how evil it is whilst all the whilst forgetting your freedom to make nonsensical comments is bought by the servicemen and women who have served and presently do serve, and in the next 50 years this will be a big thing as China starts flexing its military might.

Was in the infantry reserves for a while, so the spirit of ANZAC is a big thing for me, it means slightly different things to different people. I guess for me it means the commemoration of course, but generally to push hard and persevere in whatever I do. A live well lived in service whether militarily or not I guess is a way to show that appreciation of what was done a long time ago.

 

[WayonDown]

A interesting statement was made today by a friend. they said imagine if the japanese wanted to come here once or twice a year every year to mourn those who died in war. Would we show them the same respect and courtesy that the turkish people show us. Upon thinking about it I came to the same conclusion they did. The answer is no we would make a huge fuss and start media campaigns and the like to stop it from happening.

Um, how many Japanese soldiers died in Australia? There were bombing raids in Darwin, but that was about.

The mourning is done in Turkey, because we had 5000+ troops that died there, why would the Japanese want to come here and mourn when they didn't have any casualties here? If there were any casualties, it would be very few.

Furthermore, the battles we had with the Turkish infantry was somewhat different with Japan. Japan had a long list of horrendous war-crimes that went far beyond any conventional infantry battles. If there were any uproar of Japanese commemorations here, it would largely be because it would be completely pointless, the majority of their deaths were elsewhere.

 

[Bungle_Bear]

Don't all you pacifist types claim to be "Soldiers of Christ"?

 

[TheDag]

If you've got contrary views to soldiering, ANZAC day and whatever else, you are well entitled to it, but keep it out of this thread, you can rant and rave elsewhere.

the thread asks what people think of ANZAC day. Those views are all that are being expressed. Just because you don't agree does not mean they are not entitled to post their views here. I remember a high school teacher saying it was a day where we celebrate a massive defeat. When it comes to the parades I have to agree with him. I disagree when it comes to memorial services.

The mourning is done in Turkey, because we had 5000+ troops that died there, why would the Japanese want to come here and mourn when they didn't have any casualties here? If there were any casualties, it would be very few.

So according to your logic in this post we should not have any celebrations in turkey. So what is the real reason we expect this special treatment?

Furthermore, the battles we had with the Turkish infantry was somewhat different with Japan. Japan had a long list of horrendous war-crimes that went far beyond any conventional infantry battles. If there were any uproar of Japanese commemorations here, it would largely be because it would be completely pointless, the majority of their deaths were elsewhere.

Ah the good ol war crimes argument. How did I know someone would bring that up! If people want to honour those who have fallen at the battlefields then the argument is still valid in that where the deaths occoured was in Australia. In any case the point being that would we as a country allow them to hold services here if there had been deaths? the answer is no because of crimes they committed. of course we won the war so we write the history! I have spoken to world war 2 vets and I think you would be surprised at some of the stories they tell about regrets regarding actions.

 

[TheDag]

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