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iamlamad

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It is time for Keras to apologize for doubting the truth.
 
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iamlamad

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The answer is SO SIMPLE! He comes pretrib FOR His saints, and then comes posttrib WITH His saints.
 
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iamlamad

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That is true -- Christ appears, there is the resurrection of the righteous and than all the saints both living and those that were just raised from the dead are caught up in the air and taken to heaven with Christ.
WRONG! You are mixing up two events. Christ does not appear for He remains in a cloud in the air. And Paul tells us that the dead having been raised, and the alive in Christ having be changed, TOGETHER are caught up to the cloud where Jesus will be.

However, on "the last day," that is the last 24 hours of the 70th week, at the time of the 7th vial, the Old Testament saints are caught up. John did not see it so did not write it.
It will be what causes this world's worst ever earthquake. It will include those declared righteous before the flood also.

Jesus DID say "on the last day" but that resurrection is not for the church.
 
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BobRyan

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The Sinai covenant is where we find "Do NOT take God's Name in vain"

And -- "Do not bow down to false gods"
And -- "Do not covet"
And -- "Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18

And also in the LAW of Moses we have this
"Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5
etc.

Eph 6:2 reminds NT saints that this LAW is STILL applicable with the "first commandment with a promise" being the 5th commandment.

Gal 3 points out that the phrase "until the LAW came" refers to "untill LAW written on stone"... not "LAW in existence". Thus it was always "sin" -- to take God's name in vain. It did not suddenly "Become sin" at Sinai.

Galatians 4 and Galatians 3 are absolutely not telling us to ignore the commandments of God -- though some have argued for such wild ideas.

The NEW Covenant is in Jeremiah 31:31-33 and in Hebrews 8:6-12 where we find it is "unchanged" from its OT form. It writes the LAW of God known to Jeremiah on the "heart and mind"

"31 “Behold, days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,.. I will write My LAW on their heart and on their mind." Jer 31:31-33, Hebrews 8:6-12.

Not merely "external on stone" as at Sinai with the nation - but "ON the heart" - the new creation, the New Birth, the New heart. Written on tablets of the human heart.

Exegesis demands that the term "LAW" be that which Jeremiah and his readers would have known at the time of Jeremiah 31.

Bible details matter.

Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Indeed not merely on external tables of stone - but on the tablets of the human heart.

The point remains.
 
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iamlamad

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It IS a comfort (and a blessed hope) knowing that He will come and take us out just before His wrath is poured out!
 
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BobRyan

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The answer is SO SIMPLE! He comes pretrib FOR His saints, and then comes posttrib WITH His saints.

He comes post trib and raptures the saints.

Matthew 24 "Immediately AFTER the TRIBULATIONS of those days.. He will send forth His angels to GATHER His Elect" --

Pretrib and midtrib rapture theories do not survive Matthew 24.
 
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BobRyan

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The rapture is the next major event!

According to what?

According to Paul. But it seems you don't believe him. Try 1 thes. 4 & 5.

Nothing in 1 Thess 4 or 5 says the rapture is before the tribulation.

The answer is SO SIMPLE! He comes pretrib FOR His saints, and then comes posttrib WITH His saints.

He comes post trib and raptures the saints.

Matthew 24 "Immediately AFTER the TRIBULATIONS of those days.. He will send forth His angels to GATHER His Elect" --

Pretrib and midtrib rapture theories do not survive Matthew 24.
 
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BABerean2

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Indeed not merely on external tables of stone - but on the tablets of the human heart.

2Co 3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away,
2Co 3:8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious?


Act 15:24 Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, "You must be circumcised and keep the law"—to whom we gave no such commandment—

.
 
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Choose Wisely

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Wow you left out so many. Here use this.

John 11
35 Jesus wept.
 
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DaDad

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... He comes post trib and raptures the saints.

Matthew 24 "Immediately AFTER the TRIBULATIONS of those days.. He will send forth His angels to GATHER His Elect" --
To different concepts. The first is gathering "his elect", which might mean the 144,000.
The second concept is that the DEAD arise after the Millennial Kingdom. And AFTER the DEAD are raised, then those who are alive and remain shall ascend to the New Jerusalem. (Ref. Rev. 20)

So Post-Tribulation IT IS! -- About a THOUSAND YEARS after the tribulation.

And then the earth and heavens shall pass away.

Thanks,
DaDad
 
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Choose Wisely

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Pretrib and midtrib rapture theories do not survive Matthew 24.

Proving that Jack and Jill went up the hill does not prove that Bill and Betty did not go up first.
Proving that there is a post trib rapture does not prove that there will not be a pretrib rapture.
 
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keras

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Given those texts - I have no need to retract scripture or apologize for what it says about the fact that Jesus returns to take the saints to heaven.
None of your scriptures actually say that God intends to rapture people to heaven.
Jesus said:
John 3:13 No one has gone up to heaven, except the One who came down from there…
Jesus is talking about the things of heaven, truths that apply forever.

John 7:33-34…I am going away to Him who sent Me and where I go, you cannot come.
A plain statement that also applies forever.

John 8:21-23 Again He said: Where I go, you cannot come. You belong to this world below, I to the world above….
Our home is the earth, we are earth people and not spirits and even after the Millennium, those worthy will become immortal, but will still remain on earth. Revelation 21:1-4

John 17:15 I do not pray that You take My people out of this world, but to keep them from the evil one.
Jesus was talking to God and what He asked applies to all Christians. Remember: we pray for God’s Kingdom to come on earth as it is in heaven and it will, with the New Jerusalem.

Revelation 5:10 You have made them priests for our God and they shall reign on earth.
This refers to every faithful Christian, people from every tribe, race, nation and language, they shall reign on earth. That is our destiny, we never go to heaven, only our souls if we are martyred. Revelation 6:9-11
 
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DaDad

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Proving that Jack and Jill went up the hill does not prove that Bill and Betty did not go up first.
Proving that there is a post trib rapture does not prove that there will not be a pretrib rapture.

GREAT! Now we have FOUR "raptures". LOL
Hey bidder, bidder, bidder, hey bidder, bidder, do I hear FIVE?
DaDad
 
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DaDad

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MEDIA=youtube

THERE's the BABerean2 that we've learned to know and appreciate. WE LOVE YOUR VIDEOS.
(I've always wondered what's in them, but I like them anyway)

DaDad
 
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Dorothy Mae

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It IS a comfort (and a blessed hope) knowing that He will come and take us out just before His wrath is poured out!
It was a comfort for them although Jesus did not and would not “take them” out but instead warned them when to leave. They left at the warning and avoided the wrath of God. God didn’t take Noah out, but gave instructions. God provides angels to guide Lot out but the wife refused to comply and faced the judgement. God doesn’t “take” anyone out but gives instructions for the escape.

In any case, it’s over now and not coming again.
 
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Seville90210

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Wow you left out so many. Here use this.

John 11
35 Jesus wept.

LOL!

He left out the videos too. The same videos he uses over and over again for all arguments regardless if people are having a conversation about apples, oranges or bananas.



.
@BABereans2

Hey BAB, if you're reading this, it's not because I've been ignoring you, it's because I already know what videos and scriptures you'll be posting in your reply.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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So are you saying that you did not infer that you work hard and others don't.
That’s what I’m saying. You added that. But on the same note, do you think YOU choose wisely and others don’t?

As you judge, so you too can be judged.
 
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Choose Wisely

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That’s what I’m saying. You added that. But on the same note, do you think YOU choose wisely and others don’t?

As you judge, so you too can be judged.
Given your refusal to accept what you say along with your apparent Biblical knowledge, I suggest that you stay in the kiddie pool.
 
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