Any Question ?

[Raja]

I have never seen perfection yet in any "religon". Only God is perfection and judaism, christianity and islam all follow God from what I here.

Romans 2:1 Therefore, thou art inexcusable, O man--every one who is judging--for in that in which thou dost judge the other, thyself thou dost condemn, for the same things thou dost practise who art judging,Wasn't Jesus the perfect "religion"? We also look at the Writings of Paul as inspired Scripture instead of the Koran, so we will always differ in the ways we interpret the Holy Bible and the "Perfect" religion.

Perhaps muslims [and jews] don't understand the meaning of "AGE" in the Scriptures?

Romans 12:2 and be not conformed to this Age, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, for your proving what [is] the will of God--the good, and acceptable, and perfect.

Matthew 24:3 And when he is sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples came near to him by himself, saying, `Tell us, when shall these be? and what [is] the sign of thy presence, and of the full end of the Age?'

Dear friend ​

As you yourself said , " you " have never seen perfection in any religion . but this does not mean that there is no " perfect religion " . ​

Me too , I have never seen Mars or Saturn , but I know that they are there in our solar group ! ​

I have never seen Washington or Paris but I know that there are things which called United states and France . I have never seen viruses but I know that they are there and they afflict our bodies .​

You may not see a perfect religion but this does not mean that there is nothing like that !​

You admitted that only God is perfect and that is true , so His religion is necessary should be true too , isn't it ? ​

But the question here is , which religion should be considered as the religion of God ? ​

Think in this my friend without any bigotry and I am sure you will get the idea . ​

Yours ​

Raja ​

 

[Exegete12]

Salaam Raja:
I am aware that Muslims feel a strong sense of obligation to protect Mohammed's honour, therefore I do not judge your prophet.

However the Surah The Sandhills 46:9 "I am nothing new among the Prophets; what will happen to me and to my followers, I do not know; I am only a plain warner."

If he is only a warner, then we can contrast Mohammed's words with those of Jesus?

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life." (John 6:47).

Ooh how I wish Mohammed had been told those verses. But you have, Raja.

AND:

"I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go to prepare a place for you I will come again and receive you unto myself that where I am there you may be also." (John 14: 1 - 7).

AND:

The Table Spread: Surah 5: 65 – 66:

"If only the People of the Scripture (the Jews see verse 64) would believe and ward off evil, we would remit their sins from them and surely We would bring them into Gardens of Delight. If they had observed the Taurat (Torah) and the Injil (Gospel) and that which was revealed unto them by their Lord, then they would have been nourished from above them and from beneath their feet."

From this I deduct that Mohammed saw that it was permissible to seek the Torah and the Gospel as a plan for God's blessings and TRUTH.

 

[Futuwwa]

This is something which is often misunderstood by outsiders. When the Quran uses the terms taurat and injeel it does not refer to the OT and the NT. It refers to the original revelations given to Moses and Jesus.

 

[Exegete12]

It must mean that because it talks about People of the Book.

 

[morningstar2651]

What are the differences between Sufi Islam, Shi'a Islam, and Sunni Islam?

What are their similarities?

 

[Ronnee743]

Salam to everybody ,

Infact I thought to write this topic for the sake of pure knowledge not for blind argument or any other purpose .

I know that there are many persons here who may don't know much about Islam ( real Islam ) . So I am writing this thread .If any one wants to know something about Islam he can ask and I will try to give him a complete and sufficient answer as much as I can .

this is a personal attempt which devoted only to serious people to clarify some ambiguity about my religion which I am proud about .

1. Since Muhammed claimed to have received divine revelation from God via Gabriel, why are there so many things in the Koran which resemble what is in the Bible, which was written thousands of years before Muhammed was born?
How could it be revelation when it was already known by the Jews?
Please explain in detail.
Look at this;

(Webster's says that revelation means...`something not previoulsy known or realized` ` a disclosure`


2.Since Ishmael's sons whose names are recorded in 1 Chronicles do not have a history or genealogy in the Old Testament, how can you say they are relevant to BCE history and the Sacred Text?


3.If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?
Why does it say that Alllah does not love those who sin?
Jesus loves sinners and even died for them, but your god is nothing like the God of the Bible.
How come?

You may throw at me that Jesus' genealogy is corrupted, but the fact remains that his genealogy is there in some attempt by those who believed he was Messiah.

Do not try and throw anything at me that is not true because I will know if is is found in the Bible or the ancient literature of the world. I study God's Word and history and will know if you are lying.


I have more questions, but this will suffice for now.

Please refrain from copy and pasting. I could surf the web myself looking for the answers, but I want you to answer me in your own words.

 

[Islam_mulia]

1. Since Muhammed claimed to have received divine revelation from God via Gabriel, why are there so many things in the Koran which resemble what is in the Bible, which was written thousands of years before Muhammed was born?
How could it be revelation when it was already known by the Jews?
Please explain in detail.
Look at this;

(Webster's says that revelation means...`something not previoulsy known or realized` ` a disclosure`

There are many ways to define 'revelations'.
One of them is 'communication to man by divine or supernatural agency'.

Essentially, the Quran seeks to remind the readers that many of the same messages had been passed to earlier prophets, through angels and even through God himself. Some of these can still be found in the bible that Jews and Chrsitians posessed.

2.Since Ishmael's sons whose names are recorded in 1 Chronicles do not have a history or genealogy in the Old Testament, how can you say they are relevant to BCE history and the Sacred Text?

Lack of documents does not prove the history or genealogy does not exist. You may argue there is no extra biblical refernce to Abraham and Moses does not mean they do not exist. In ancient times, writings was not prevalent and it is through oral means that the history was passed.


3.If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?
Why does it say that Alllah does not love those who sin?
Jesus loves sinners and even died for them, but your god is nothing like the God of the Bible.
How come?
Why is genealogy associated with Truth?
The thought that Jesus died for sinners is a misconception as the Bible never claim Jesus said that. Pagan history, though, has that kind of association.

You may throw at me that Jesus' genealogy is corrupted, but the fact remains that his genealogy is there in some attempt by those who believed he was Messiah.

Jews say Jesus could not meet the criteria of their Messiah... even his 'genealogy'.

Do not try and throw anything at me that is not true because I will know if is is found in the Bible or the ancient literature of the world. I study God's Word and history and will know if you are lying.

In many ways, I have seen you struggle to answer questions from the Bible. You are not up to the mark to represent Christians to answer questions regarding the bible. Face it.

 

[Ronnee743]

There are many ways to define 'revelations'.

But Webster's doesn't get away from its sole definition; `something never known before... it simply gives an example that the revelation (something never known before), as something which is able to be communicated to man by divine or supernatural agency.
It does not say that a revelation is a communication by divine or supernatural agency per se.
You misunderstood Webster.

FONT=Book Antiqua]One of them is 'communication to man by divine or supernatural agency'.[/FONT]

Essentially, the Quran seeks to remind the readers that many of the same messages had been passed to earlier prophets, through angels and even through God himself. Some of these can still be found in the bible that Jews and Chrsitians posessed.

You imply that God is decrepit. That he did not get it right the frist time, so he needs to remind us of what he sealed with his own blood. (Acts 20.28).
You speak of messages, but the only message of the Bible is Jesus Christ and him crucified.
You cannot prove otherwise.
You state that a message could have "passed" through God himself implying that God is not omnipresent, which would make him subject to something passing through him. He is the Creator, not one of us. None of what you said is found in the Bible.

Lack of documents does not prove the history or genealogy does not exist. You may argue there is no extra biblical refernce to Abraham and Moses does not mean they do not exist. In ancient times, writings was not prevalent and it is through oral means that the history was passed.

It most certainly does prove it does not exist. If I cannot prove my pedigree, it means I do not have one. Sure we all can be sure we go back to Adam, but do we have documents to prove it? No.
Jesus does, and they are in order, though Jews and Muslims say they are not authentic.
Oral and writing both.
Writing was as early as the Sumerians.
The earliest version of the Mosiac Code was 2050 BCE.
Ever hear of Akkadia? Susa?
The Code of Hammurabi dates back to 1728 BCE.



3.If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?
Why does it say that Alllah does not love those who sin?
Jesus loves sinners and even died for them, but your god is nothing like the God of the Bible.
How come?

FONT=Book Antiqua]Why is genealogy associated with Truth?[/FONT]

I have a birth certificate, a driver's licence, many documents which are necessary to identify important events in my life to determine who I am.
Truth is necessary to determine who God is.
And everything else.
Jesus' genealogy is recorded so the world could know who he is, where he came from, how he got her and what was his purpose of coming here.
Muhammed has nothing to go on except his word, which basically means nothing.
Go into a court of law and present a case without documents.
They will ask you to leave until you can prove what you say is true.
IN America we have checks and balances becasue man alone cannot be trusted, yet you trust aman who had no credentials, and no witnesses to his claims.

FONT=Book Antiqua]The thought that Jesus died for sinners is a misconception as the Bible never claim Jesus said that. Pagan history, though, has that kind of association.[/FONT]

If you understood the Bible, you would not say this.



[

FONT=Book Antiqua]Jews say Jesus could not meet the criteria of their Messiah... even his 'genealogy'.[/FONT]
[/FONT

]

The Jews do not determine if he was the Messiah or not.
He said he was , and over five hundred witnesses saw him alive after his resurrection.
Josephus mentioned him, so did Pliny, Tacitus. The world has gone after him.
It is quite apparent that the gospel is true.

In many ways, I have seen you struggle to answer questions from the Bible. You are not up to the mark to represent Christians to answer questions regarding the bible. Face it.

If the Christians agreed with you, then I would be concerned.
It is they whose words I value.

 

[AlanGurvey]

1


3.If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?

It doesn't need to, that he was a man, chosen by G-d to be a prophet is all that is needed.

 

[AlanGurvey]

Why does it say that Alllah does not love those who sin?Jesus loves sinners and even died for them, but your god is nothing like the God of the Bible.
How come?

Jesus hates sinners, thats why you have to inflate his ego to gain access to heaven.

 

[foreverfaithless]

Salam to everybody ,

Infact I thought to write this topic for the sake of pure knowledge not for blind argument or any other purpose .

I know that there are many persons here who may don't know much about Islam ( real Islam ) . So I am writing this thread .If any one wants to know something about Islam he can ask and I will try to give him a complete and sufficient answer as much as I can .

this is a personal attempt which devoted only to serious people to clarify some ambiguity about my religion which I am proud about .

Do you believe that Islam is right and everybody else is wrong if yes then why?

 

[Raja]

Salaam Raja:
I am aware that Muslims feel a strong sense of obligation to protect Mohammed's honour, therefore I do not judge your prophet.

However the Surah The Sandhills 46:9 "I am nothing new among the Prophets; what will happen to me and to my followers, I do not know; I am only a plain warner."

If he is only a warner, then we can contrast Mohammed's words with those of Jesus?

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life." (John 6:47).

Ooh how I wish Mohammed had been told those verses. But you have, Raja.

AND:

"I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go to prepare a place for you I will come again and receive you unto myself that where I am there you may be also." (John 14: 1 - 7).

AND:

The Table Spread: Surah 5: 65 – 66:

"If only the People of the Scripture (the Jews see verse 64) would believe and ward off evil, we would remit their sins from them and surely We would bring them into Gardens of Delight. If they had observed the Taurat (Torah) and the Injil (Gospel) and that which was revealed unto them by their Lord, then they would have been nourished from above them and from beneath their feet."

From this I deduct that Mohammed saw that it was permissible to seek the Torah and the Gospel as a plan for God's blessings and TRUTH.

Dear sister Alhanaan ​

First of all let me thank you for this rational and well-mannered comment. ​

Secondly , let me clarify some important facts about our religion and its relations with yours and with Judaism . ​

Islam is never abused Christianity or Judaism , nor it says that they were wrong or away from God . on the contrary , Islam is came to assert on the truthness of these religions , proved that they were sent by God , and Islam is the integral and consummated of the divine chain . ​

He hath revealed unto thee (Muhammad) the Scripture with truth, confirming that which was (revealed) before it, even as He revealed the Torah and the Gospel
3:3 ​

this great verse is set in Surah 3 , verse 3 , and it talks about the Three noble religions which sent from Allah !​

if you understand this concept good , you will not find any contrast between Islam and your religion . so what is the problem ? ​

the problem is reside in the " deforming and distorting " which happened to Christianity and Judaism by some people in the ancient time . ​

a fact that is known by all , even by the fanatics against Islam is that Quran – the noble book of Islam – has not get any distortion or perversion . it stills like what it was since more than 1500 years when it is revealed to Mohammad . ​

so in many verses in Quran , you will find God blames people of other scripture (Christianity and Judaism ) for their distortion of their divine books to fulfill some earthy needs !​

so Quran has send a clear message and call for the people of Christianity and Judaism : ​

Say: O People of the Scripture. Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partners unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him).
3:64​

and Allah also blames them for their disbelieving despite their knowledge of the truth : ​

O People of the Scripture! Why disbelieve ye in the revelations of Allah, when ye (yourselves) bear witness (to theft truth ) ?​

O People of the Scripture! Why confound ye truth with falsehood and knowingly conceal the troth?​

3:70-71 ​

and in that verse you cited about Mohammad , it is a great evidence of the truth ness of this Prophet . because he aimed to orient people towards God only . His Lord asked him to confess in a very humble way that he is nothing except a noble prophets like his brothers of former prophets . at the end he is no longer a human , sent by God to warn people and learn them how they should worship their real creation and the deserve able of worship . ​

this message is remained and still as it is through all prophets , even Jesus said the same but regrettably some people has deform the words of Jesus himself . and if you devote time for reading the Gospels , you will discover that this meaning ( the same meaning of Mohammad's words ) is exist in some Gospels , and , wonderfully , became another meaning in other books or verses ! while you can never find any contradiction in Quran . ​

Jesus was a noble prophet too , who called people to worship one God , not worship him . and this is the universal mutual message of all messengers and prophets that sent from God . ​

So , it is right ad you said that Mohammed saw that it was permissible to seek the Torah and the Gospel as a plan for God's blessings and TRUTH.​

But this concept needs some explanation , the message of that concept is not related to current Gospel and Torah because they faced much distortion and never become as what they were . ​

The aim here is the real and the original scriptures of Gospel and Torah before becoming " deformed " . ​

The translation is always not a precisely way to convey the meaning , if you know Arabic and you read this verse you mentioned , you will notice that the phrase " had observed " is used to translate the Arabic word " Akaamo " and the meaning of this word is very profound and not only could be confined to the phrase " had observe " . this is really one of the important points which may cause misunderstanding of meaning , the problem of " translation " .​

And as my dear brother Janissary has said in the next replay : ​

This is something which is often misunderstood by outsiders. When the Quran uses the terms taurat and injeel it does not refer to the OT and the NT. It refers to the original revelations given to Moses and Jesus.​

This is what exactly I want to convey . and you have said : ​

It must mean that because it talks about People of the Book.​

And let me tell you again that is not true , yes it talks about People of the book but it refers to the original scriptures not the recent one . and if you skim Quran carefully , you will find many verses talk about the same concept and always blame those people for their distortion of the original scriptures which were revealed to them by Moses and Jesus . ​

Best regards ​

 

[Fares]

2:222 They question thee (O Muhammad) concerning menstruation. Say: It is an sickness, so let women alone at such times and go not in unto them till they are cleansed. And when they have purified themselves, then go in unto them as Allah hath enjoined upon you. Truly Allah loveth those who turn unto Him, and loveth those who have a care for cleanness.

Maybe I am misunderstanding this, so please Raja, explain.

 

[Ronnee743]

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Quote
Originally Posted by: Ronnee743




1

Ronnee...3.If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?

Alan Gurvey...
It doesn't need to, that he was a man, chosen by G-d to be a prophet is all that is needed.

How absurd.
But you made an excellent point for Christianity.
Because Muhammed had no witnesses, no credentials, no credibility is the precise reason Islam is what it is....without purpose.
because they believe as you, that proof means nothing.

I can hardly believe you think that documentation and witnesses are not relevant.

 

[very_irreverand_Bill]

Salam to everybody ,

Infact I thought to write this topic for the sake of pure knowledge not for blind argument or any other purpose .

I know that there are many persons here who may don't know much about Islam ( real Islam ) . So I am writing this thread .If any one wants to know something about Islam he can ask and I will try to give him a complete and sufficient answer as much as I can .

this is a personal attempt which devoted only to serious people to clarify some ambiguity about my religion which I am proud about .

Greetings;
can you defend Mohammed against the fact that he had sexual relations w/a 9 year old girl, Aisha{his youngest bride}, and desired her when she was much younger, when he himself wa sin his 50's?

Can you defend Mohammeds calling other beliefs by very insulting names? Can you defend him and the Quran against the implication that if Islam becomes the promient belief somewhere that the followers of Islam and the theocratic rulers must kill the apostates, treat Jews and Christians as second class citizens{at best} and treat them as criminals or worse if they refuse to submit to the rule of Islam and its's followers, treat the Pagans{people of all other beliefs, including faiths such as Buddhism and other non-pagan religions} and Infidels{faithless} worse than even the Christians and Jews get treated. Can you defend your faith gets the insults and prejudices,intolerance and ignorance it displays towards others by the commands of Allah and Mohammed, and why it demands special treatment and special privelage by the non-believing world?

What about this idea that Islam means peace, when it actually means "submission",and in the long run it means peace through submission to the religion of Islam, and when we bypass the few verses used by "moderate" muslims and supporters of Islam, the very few used OVER AND OVER again, and take the teachings of the Quran and Hadiths in further context, that there is actually much Intolerance,PREJudice,insults towards others beliefs,and even some more violent and hateful teachings.

Can you defend your aProphet against his more brutal and tyrannical side, his occasional theivery,violence,opression and persecution of others during his time.

Can you defend the moderate Muslims whom are not moderate even in the sense that Moderate Christians are moderate, only that they are NOT extremist types{but still equivelent to evangelical and fundamentalist christians-NOT Liberal/moderate christians}, and whom when terrorists and extemists do atrcoious things to themselves and others, that the Moderates speak only{most, not ALL the time}somewhat softer rebukes against their more extreme brethren, but when someone critisizes the faith or does something in the name of free speech such as those infamous{but not actually all that extreme; not nearly as extreme as the cartoons that Islamic publications in Islamic nations tend to do about others-=especially the Jews}Danish cartoons- the moderates become alarmist and whine for special treatment and get more angry at these harmless free speech actions than at their extremist terrorist brethren?

Can you explain why global religiously based terrorism against others is allmost specifically a Islamic thing, not christian or buddhist or Pagan or Satanist or Hindu,etc

Can you truly explain away the claims of many Ex-Islamics{many beeing themselves Arabaic, most actually} whom wer elonf time devotents of the faith; such as those behind
faithfreedom {dot} org
apostatesofislam {dot} com

Thank you.

In Reason:
The very irreverand Bill

 

[Raja]

What are the differences between Sufi Islam, Shi'a Islam, and Sunni Islam?

What are their similarities?

Dear morningstar

First of all let me apologize for being so late in replay . actually I am engaged in examinations nowadays so please excuse me .

In fact your question is so short but so profound and intensive so it took sometimes to replay because I am not that expert in these issues . what I had is just general ideas so I had to search and read in order to give you a satisfied answer .

If we try to answer your question in a complete way we will need pages and pages ! so I will try to make it short and intensive .

Let us start with Sunah . Sunah is the group who follow the instructions of Prophet Mohammad . you can say that this group is the right one among other groups because it follows Sunah ( means what Prophet Mohammad used to do and say ) without deviation or exaggeration . it is the group with the largest number among other Muslim groups .

Shi'a is Muslims too but regrettably they deviate from the right instructions of Islam . because their exaggerated love for the family of Prophet Mohammad ( his cousin , Imam Ali and his two sons ), they fabricated some issues which were not included in Real Islam before . Islam does not say " don’t love Mohammad's family " , in the contrast , we are ordered to love them because we love prophet Mohammad , however , exaggeration in love for them is forbidden . this love should not lead us to dissent from Islam's instructions and from what our prophet himself said . Shi'a people claimed that Imam Ali was the right person who should take the leadership of Muslims after the death of prophet Mohammad . they denied the great rank of other accompaniers of prophet Mohammad .

Shi'a people are considered as our brothers too , and we always pray for them and ask God to guide them to the right way .

Sufism is a religious movement spread in the Islamic world in the 3th century ( according to the islamic calendar ) . this movement called to extreme worship ( to Allah ) and asceticism. This movement was a reaction against the live in great luxury at that time . this movement has developed after that and reach to what is known now as " Sufism " .

What Sufism calls for , like strong worship , asceticism etc are a great things which Islam also calls for , but in doing that , Sufi people fabricate some things which Islam never incite to .

The main difference between Islam's doctrine and Sufism is the source of religious knowledge . whereas in Islam there is no right doctrine without Quran and Sunah of Prophet Mohammad , In Sufism they depend on inspiration , and assumed revelation for some great men ( they call them Wali which means a very great person , very close to God ) .

The main similarity between these three , that they worship only one God , the same God who created everything and who deserve worship . and they believe also in the truthness of Prophet Mohammad ' message .

I wish I could give you clear and satisfied answer .

Raja


​

 

[Raja]

1. Since Muhammed claimed to have received divine revelation from God via Gabriel, why are there so many things in the Koran which resemble what is in the Bible, which was written thousands of years before Muhammed was born?
How could it be revelation when it was already known by the Jews?
Please explain in detail.
Look at this;

(Webster's says that revelation means...`something not previoulsy known or realized` ` a disclosure`


.

Firstly ,I am so sorry for being so late in replay . I am engaged in my final examinations nowadays and I coud not find time to come here so please forgive me and be patient with me !
Secondly , let me greet you for these important questions , from your style in writing I could know that you have a good background and knowledge . ​

Thirdly , I will do as you said , I will only copy the point you made to make the answer of it clear . now let us start !! :

Since Muhammed claimed to have received divine revelation from God via Gabriel, why are there so many things in the Koran which resemble what is in the Bible, which was written thousands of years before Muhammed was born? ​

How could it be revelation when it was already known by the Jews?

Please explain in detail.​

in fact what you have said now is a strong evidence asserts the truthfulness of Mohammad's prophecy !

I think I have to assert again in a fact I always mention it here . that non-Muslims should understand that the message of God is one and the same and all these noble messengers and prophets had come with one universal and clear message that " Allah is the only God who deserve worship from all human " . ​

First God had choose Jews to bear His message and to lead others , He sent them a noble prophet Moses with a noble scripture " Torah " . after that many prophets had follow but the ultimate result that Jews fell and did not fulfill the task. However , God sent them another great and noble prophet , Jesus who came to confirm on the same Holly message . this is manifested in Quran , when Jesus himself have said : ​

And will make him a messenger unto the children of Israel, (saying): Lo! I come unto you with a sign from your Lord. Lo! I fashion for you out of clay the likeness of a bird, and I breathe into it and it is a bird, by Allah's leave. I heal him who was born blind, and the leper, and I raise the dead, by Allah's leave. And I announce unto you what ye eat and what ye store up in your houses. Lo! herein verily is a portent for you, if ye are believers.​

3:49 ​

Jesus told them that he came to confirm what they already have but they distorted :​

And (I come) confirming that which was before me of the Torah, and to make lawful some of that which was forbidden unto you. I come unto you with a sign from your Lord, so keep your duty to Allah and obey me
3:50 ​

this is the second circle in the chain . there is no contradictory at all between them . thus the third and the final circle has come by the coming of prophet Mohammad who also came to confirm which was before him :​

And when there cometh unto them a messenger from Allah, confirming that which they possess, a party of those who have received the Scripture fling the Scripture of Allah behind their backs as if they knew not,
2:101 ​

so there is no wonder if there are so many things in the Koran which resemble what is in the Bible, which was written thousands of years before Muhammed was born . because Mohammad did not invent Quran or fabricate a new thing . He – as all his brothers prophet – came with one and only one aim . while the source was the same ( God the Almighty ) why then Mohammad's revelation should be different from that of Jesus or Moses or any other honest prophet ??​

and let me tell you that this meaning being repeated many times in Quran , always Quran reminds Jews and Christians about this truth that the message is the same and they know good that Mohammad is a true prophet came to assert and confirm that which they already have and know ! :​

Those unto whom We gave the Scripture recognize (this revelation) as they recognize their sons. But lo! a party of them knowingly conceal the truth.
2:146 ​

thus , you may notice that not only Quran reminds them by this truth , but it also blames them for hide it and claimed that they don’t know !
Among them are unlettered folk who know the scripture not except from hearsay. They but guess.
2:78​

and Allah expose their mean behavior and tell us that they distort and deform their original scripture :
Therefore woe be unto those who write the Scripture with their hands anthem say, "This is from Allah," that they may purchase a small gain therewith. Woe unto them for that their hands have written, and woe unto them for that they earn thereby.
2:79 ​

and in one crucial verse , Quran asserts on the universality of all prophets' message : ​

Say: O People of the Scripture. Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partners unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him).
3:64 ​

this is an obvious call to the people of scripture ( Jews or Christians ) to avoid disagreement and come to an agreement .​

the essence in this issue is that Mohammad's prophecy has unfolded and exposed all the defects that people of scripture has done !
he came to confirm what was truth and still as it was , and to unfold what is become " deformed " . ​

Since Ishmael's sons whose names are recorded in 1 Chronicles do not have a history or genealogy in the Old Testament, how can you say they are relevant to BCE history and the Sacred Text?​

You may mean Abraham's sons . because we don’t know more about Ishmael's sons . we know that our noble prophet Mohammad belongs to the offspring of Ishmael .

Honestly , I could not understand your point here good . but let me tell you that Old Testament is not consider as an authoritative resource that we can depend on because it faced many deforming and distorting .

to be follow....​

​

 

[Raja]

If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?​

Why does it say that Alllah does not love those who sin?

Jesus loves sinners and even died for them, but your god is nothing like the God of the Bible.
How come?​

​

​

​

Quran is revealed to Mohammad not to become a historical book or a ancestry to him . if you check Quran you will notice many wondering points :​

1- the name of Jesus for example is mentioned more the name of Mohammad .
2- Quran does not include any personal details about Mohammad's life or his suffering or personal problems . even when there are some mentions about each of these it would be relevant to something more important and related to all Muslims or to religion itself
3- Quran is a true book , never include any deforming facts or contradict with its parts
4- We have a full Surah in Quran entitled " Mary " the virgin mother of Jesus , ,and we have not any Surah with titles like " Fatima " a daughter of Mohammad or " Aisha " his lovely wife . ​

I think these points are clear enough and if you consider them good you will come out with very important conclusions .​

Now let us consider the second point , to explain this idea let me talk about some important issues , and before I say anything let us agree with the way we should follow in this discussion , that is the rational way which based on reason and logic not on bigotry or narrowmindedness . I am not try to lie or to throw something wrong . like you , I studied more about religions – not only about Islam - and besides I am a student of English Literature so I know somethings in this field . all what I want is to reach to truth . this truth may come from your side or mine , we don’t know yet , and by the rational and intellectual discussing we will come across it . ​

If we say that Allah loves sinners , we will destroy all the rational principles that any one can come across by using his mind !​

Let me give you a small example , if we agree that Allah loves sinners , why we – as human – act against this concept ??​

Why my country and yours build jails and courts ??​

Why we have police ??​

Why we punish those who steal or murder ??​

If the creator of all these humans loves the sinners and never punish them why we go against that ?? we are not a creator or God to do this !!​

If we say that God loves sinners , then for God's sake tell me what would be the worth of any good deed in our life ??​

Why should I be a good man and try to do good deeds in my life ??
While God loves sinner it will be better to me to be one of them !! ​

So what will be the scale of the " reward and punishment " concept in the Here after ??​

If we agree with this concept , all of us should be sinners or criminals not a good people ! and we don’t need to worship God because either we worship Him or not we will go to heaven at the end !!​

Another concept you mention and really it is one of the most wondering things I ever met in my life , is the concept of sacrificing of Jesus for sinner's sake !!​

This concept in fact is an invitation to incite people to be negative and dependent !​

As an educated person you must see some defects in this concept without needing to be religious or not !​

This concept contrasts with the simple bases of rational thinking . I don’t deny that such thinking is very comfortable ! if I embrace such idea , then I have no thing to worry about because all my sins are beard by another person !! so all what I should do is enjoying life and do whatever I want !!​

Is this sounds rational thinking ??​

Look at the big difference between what you believe and what our great Prophet says to his own daughter : ​

" O Fatima , the daughter of Mohammad , do good deeds and do not think that I can do anything for you " !​

this is what it should be . even this noble prophet can not do something for his own daughter as " a prophet " . he can advice her , teach her the true religion but she has to work and elaborate her work to be satisfied for her God . she should not depends on her father and think that because he is a prophet she can do whatever she wants without being punished by Allah .​

a man came to prophet Mohammad and told him that his wish is just to be with him in the Hereafter life , what did prophet Mohammad tells him ?? does he tells him " ok you have got it ! go and enjoy life "? !!
he told him " if you really want that so help yourself , try to pray more and more " . ​

prophet Mohammad taught us how we can be close to God , and if we commit sins it is very necessary to repent and ask forgiveness from God not any one else . He told us that " those who do good deeds will be closer to me in heaven " . He claimed for a highly moral society where everybody worship God and tries his best to become good person and obeyed slave of Allah . ​

dependence is something with no existence in Islam . the only thing you have to depend on is the mercy of Allah and your good deeds . ​

but let us recorrect these wrong principles you mention .
yes God loves all his creations ( including sinners ) but his love for the good people is bigger than his love for those who commit sins . unless those sinners repent , Allah will not love them . ​

if it is normal to commit sins then tell me what is the purpose of our existence ? ( I assume that you are not atheist ! ) .
what will be the difference between us and animals if we just eat , drink then sleep ? animals do the same so what is the thing which make us " Humans " ?
let us formulate this concept in a mere mathematical description : ​

we have a creator and creations , God and us as humans ..He created us of course not for committing sins ! ​

worship God >>> doing good deeds >>> God love us >>> the reward will be the heaven !
disobey God >>> committing sins >>> God dose not love >>> the punishment will be the Hell ! ​

Jesus , was a great and noble prophet who tried his best to convey the message of Allah to his people :​

Lo! Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is a straight path.
3:51​

he told them about the truth and never say something like he sacrifices his life to redeem them nor he claims that he is God or a son of God . Quran recorded this fact in a wonderful and effective verses please try to read them carefully : ​

And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? he saith: Be glorified It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou art the Knower of Things Hidden.
5:116 ​

I spake unto them only that which Thou commandedst me, (saying) : Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. I was a witness of them while I dwelt among them, and when Thou tookest me Thou wast the Watcher over them. Thou art Witness over all things.​

5:117 ​

and by the way this concept is existed too in the your noble books and I read some verses there assert the same meaning .​

in conclusion , let me say that it is one and only one God . there is nothing like " God of us " and " God of yours " . This God has sent prophets to us not to worship them but to lead us to the straight way and to teach us how we should worship our Creator . to clarify the important principles to us such as the principle of " reward and punishment " , " good deeds and bad deeds " , " how to be close to God " , " how to organize our life and make it better and transcended".​

This is something which my mind can accept , then let us talk about the various ways of it . but please do not tell me that to gain God's love I have to be a sinner . or tell me that another person will bear my own sins !​

Forgive me because I had to make this replay very looooong ! I wish you will not sleep during reading ! ​

I am waiting for your rest questions . ​

May Allah guide you to the right way my sister .​

Raja ​

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[Raja]

There are many ways to define 'revelations'.
One of them is 'communication to man by divine or supernatural agency'.

Essentially, the Quran seeks to remind the readers that many of the same messages had been passed to earlier prophets, through angels and even through God himself. Some of these can still be found in the bible that Jews and Chrsitians posessed.


Lack of documents does not prove the history or genealogy does not exist. You may argue there is no extra biblical refernce to Abraham and Moses does not mean they do not exist. In ancient times, writings was not prevalent and it is through oral means that the history was passed.


3.If Islam is from God, why is the Koran without chronolgy and without Muhammed's ancestry?
Why does it say that Alllah does not love those who sin?
Jesus loves sinners and even died for them, but your god is nothing like the God of the Bible.
How come?
Why is genealogy associated with Truth?
The thought that Jesus died for sinners is a misconception as the Bible never claim Jesus said that. Pagan history, though, has that kind of association.



Jews say Jesus could not meet the criteria of their Messiah... even his 'genealogy'.


In many ways, I have seen you struggle to answer questions from the Bible. You are not up to the mark to represent Christians to answer questions regarding the bible. Face it.

let me thank you and greet you from my heart for this great answer you made .

I am deeply grateful for my brother's help because my circumstances do not help me in carry this alone .

thank you very much and I really enjoyed reading your replay .​

 

[Raja]

It doesn't need to, that he was a man, chosen by G-d to be a prophet is all that is needed.

That’s right !

Thanks for the explanation . ​