Answering any questions on Evolution

[Zaius137]

And that probably explains why the Nazis banned all of Darwin's books and burned every copy found in public libraries!

(I seriously doubt that you have any understanding of "Darwinism" or "Eugenics". If you did, you wouldn't confuse the two! Yet another clue that you are a Poe.)


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How about talking the sciences… remember what the thread is? I know you have no reasonable answer to the probability problem so why don’t you just visit talkorigins for some more material.

 

[SkyWriting]

But if you are insisting on confusing ULTIMATE CAUSATION (which is the focus of theology) and PROXIMATE CAUSATION (which is a focus of science), then you are bark...<snip>

But I'm not.
I'd like to know what the proximate causation is for non-life becoming life.

And no. You can't add sunlight to matter and get life without a programmed mechanism for converting it.
And rocks got no such mechanism.

 

[SkyWriting]

I don't much get what your point is here. And you do realize I am fully aware of the existence of pubmed, right? EDIT: Just to say a little more. I had to use sources from there to write a paper on the efficacy of several generations of oncolytic viruses, their limitations, and their advantages versus current treatments.

We can't comment on vague recollections.

Originally Posted by Guy1 - If I'm not mistaken it's due to hydrophobic and hydrophilic elements clustering together in the form of a shell and organizing themselves due to their own properties. This is why water is considered a catalyst in these kinds of reactions.(Scientists. Feel free to correct me)

 

[SkyWriting]

Skywriting, I could just as easily ask you, "How does gravity benefit the earth by reuniting items with its surface?"

There is no benefit.
All matter flows to it's most worthless state.
Evolution is part of the degradation process.
Why would anything fight it? As these sites point out.
All these people worshiping the concept of evolution
and not one basic law of physics to support the idea.

ENTROPY, THE FIRST AND SECOND LAWS OF THERMODYNAMICS AND THE LAW OF MAXIMUM ENTROPY PRODUCTION

Heat Death of the Universe : Discovery News

 

[Greg1234]

So why do you assume that the methodological naturalism of science is somehow required to assign "purpose" (or even WILL) to matter and the laws of physics?

Purpose is cause. At the very heart of reality is a mind, and the motion of every "component" in the earth is the movement of a jig-saw piece to create an image of a thought in that great mind. That's why we refer to reality in terms of sin, and salvation and such. In other philosophies, where the scope of reality is significantly reduced, you take the small, dissect it into a million pieces, then fall under the illusion of grandeur granted by multiplicity. More tiny components equals more words, and more words equals intelligence. So you have the undue exaltation of some men within their own ranks.

ANSWER: The chemical bonds and other atomic/molecular forces which explain all chemistry.

All designed objects have chemical bonds. For example, a 747 has chemical bonds, but we wouldn't say that Earth, Sun, or bird, after observing their intelligence, could built it.

Those laws of physics explain all sorts of "happenings" including life from non-life. Personally, because I affirm the abiogenesis described in the first book of the Bible,

I object! The bible does not affirm Earth to bacteria or fish to human transitions. Remember, we shed reductionism.

Both theistic scientists and atheistic scientists (and every other kind of scientist) can agree that the physical laws of the universe which describe chemical bonds, valences, electron sharing, etc. cause life to happen.

But the universe is not reducible to chemicals and their bonds.

Now before you get confused by the methodological naturalism of science, consider a rainstorm watering crops. What CAUSES the rain to condense from clouds (using small particulates as the starting point of each drop) and provide water for plant growth?

From white clumps to elements to molecules to atoms to sub atomic particles, the cause and laws of that cause really depend on what era you live in. Regarding weather, that's another story in itself.

[/I][/INDENT]ANSWER: It's called the SUN. It provides solar energy that powers photosynthesis, the water cycle, and many other processes which allow life to thrive on earth.

Hm, all these things operate within the law.

The second question is answered by basic physics. But if you are insisting on confusing ULTIMATE CAUSATION (which is the focus of theology) and PROXIMATE CAUSATION (which is a focus of science), then you are barking up the wrong tree. Why are you insistent on addressing a theological question which interests Bible-believing Christians to scientists who are more interested in the PROXIMATE CAUSES?

We do not follow a false route to the ultimate cause. Just because they are proximate, doesn't mean the route is valid. Man came into being from God, to the soul (proximate) to matter. Not from God to bacteria (proximate) to man.

In an analogy, magnetic fields effect compasses. The avisiblist would say that the ultimate cause is the magnetic field, then the magnet (proximate), then the needle. Then you have visblists (people who belive only visible phenomena exists) who say that a bull came to a sudden stop after coming up to a power line, an ant landed on the needle (proximate), and the needle moved (that never happened).

Then someone else (not calling any names) comes and says its valid because avisiblists deal with ultimate causes and visiblists deal with proximate causes. Theists dont just deal with the ultimate but the route to same in varied phenomena. This principle is applied throughtout. Geddit?

 

[bjt2024]

Purpose is something that humans use to give meaning for existance. There is no
purpose in the universe except the neurological challenges and goals we set ourselves which ultimately end at death.

Humans design and then give purpose. However just because something appears to have been designed does not mean it is, or that it holds a purpose.

This universe is bleak and harsh. We live, we make our own purpose, we die, our bodies reassembled into the chemicals of other forms of life. The most we can do is make the most of the time we have while we are alive.

 

[AV1611VET]

We live, we make our own purpose, we die, our bodies reassembled into the chemicals of other forms of life.

Unless you are talking about 'we' collectively, what happens if the purpose you make clashes with the purpose someone else makes; and if you are talking collectively, is that the consensus of opinion of the UK-Labour party?

 

[bjt2024]

Unless you are talking about 'we' collectively, what happens if the purpose you make clashes with the purpose someone else makes; and if you are talking collectively, is that the consensus of opinion of the UK-Labour party?

I mean we as in each person to their own.

If by clash I presume you mean. Person A and B wants object X, only 1 can own it so they fight. This is still purpose of their own wants.

I only chose Labour as my party as I believe it's the closest to my ideals for the UK, however I do not favour in strong support any of the major parties of the UK, the government is a horrific shambles.

I do not understand how the Labour Party ties into this though, could you please elaborate?

 

[AV1611VET]

I mean we as in each person to their own.

So it's a dog-eat-dog world, is it?

If by clash I presume you mean. Person A and B wants object X, only 1 can own it so they fight. This is still purpose of their own wants.

I only chose Labour as my party as I believe it's the closest to my ideals for the UK, however I do not favour in strong support any of the major parties of the UK, the government is a horrific shambles.

I do not understand how the Labour Party ties into this though, could you please elaborate?

Well the government should make laws so that people who think like pure evolutionists are kept in check, shouldn't it?

 

[bjt2024]

So it's a dog-eat-dog world, is it?

Well the government should make laws so that people who think like pure evolutionists are kept in check, shouldn't it?

It essentially is a dog-eat-dog world. Nature is brutal and unforgiving. However we as higher more advanced species with large brains and cognitive thinking have developed a wide range of emotions and a understanding for community. A biological basis for morality one may say.

The government should make laws that show to importance of facts, evidence and truth. Religion should be kept in the religious education classes and science in the science classes. The government and religion should be separate.

 

[AV1611VET]

It essentially is a dog-eat-dog world. Nature is brutal and unforgiving. However we as higher more advanced species with large brains and cognitive thinking have developed a wide range of emotions and a understanding for community. A biological basis for morality one may say.

And Klebold & Harris, did they have small, non-cognitive thinking brains?

They certainly had a wide range of emotions and an understanding for community, didn't they?

Or were they exceptions to evolution?

 

[JoeyArnold]

No; People chose to not eat sometimes. That's a decision.

Why is decision & belief different from each other?

 

[verysincere]

All matter flows to it's most worthless state.

Same with most Internet forum threads.

Evolution is part of the degradation process.

I refuse to take the bait.

(I try to resist the urge to go for the easy punchline. But that's just me. Anyone else? Ya know you want to.)

Why would anything fight it? As these sites point out.
All these people worshiping the concept of evolution
and not one basic law of physics to support the idea.

ENTROPY, THE FIRST AND SECOND LAWS OF THERMODYNAMICS AND THE LAW OF MAXIMUM ENTROPY PRODUCTION

Heat Death of the Universe : Discovery News

Ditto. I rest my case.

(Yes, even Answers in Genesis lists these classic Laws of Thermodynamics Arguments among those which "creation science" advocates should avoid. And if Ken Ham is embarrassed to use an argument, you know it has to be a double-diddly doozy!)


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[Zaius137]

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Purpose is something that humans use to give meaning for existance. There is no purpose in the universe except the neurological challenges and goals we set ourselves which ultimately end at death.

Be unwearied maybe evolution will invent eternal life. Opps it can’t because it depends on death to purge the unfit.


You….Humans design and then give purpose. However just because something appears to have been designed does not mean it is, or that it holds a purpose.

Or it is logical to assume that if something appears to be designed it is. Mine is the better conclusion, just opinion.

You…This universe is bleak and harsh. We live, we make our own purpose, we die, our bodies reassembled into the chemicals of other forms of life (but not spontaneously). The most we can do is make the most of the time we have while we are alive.

Or look forward to life everlasting in Jesus Christ.


Still I would like you to at least take a shot at really answering some evolution questions “begging an answer”. Lets see… no molecular mechanism for evolution, no possibility of random chance assembling life, fossil record shows most species are stable, C-value paradox remains a mystery to evolution, evolution cannot explain epigenetics, not enough mutations to show common descent from a Homo Pan divergence, Haldane’s dilemma still unexplained , no new real species or novel functions added by evolution, Fruit flies in captivity still remain a stable species after 40 years, ERV’s are not pathogenic viral infections maintained in the human DNA… etcetera.

(please just pick one)

By all means please don’t burn out if the questions are not answerable by evolution dogma. Remember there is always room for one more creationist around here… Love to have ya.

 

[Trogool]

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Be unwearied maybe evolution will invent eternal life. Opps it can’t because it depends on death to purge the unfit.

No, that isn't how it works.

 

[Zaius137]

I refuse to take the bait.

(I try to resist the urge to go for the easy punchline. But that's just me. Anyone else? Ya know you want to.).

Please seek the release… I would love to throw in my two cents.

 

[Zaius137]

No, that isn't how it works.

Sorry evolution must purge the deleterious mutations… just the facts man…

 

[Trogool]

Sorry evolution must purge the deleterious mutations&#8230; just the facts man&#8230;

[Scrubs] - Wrong wrong wrong wrong! - YouTube

Please buy a biology textbook and read it.

 

[JoeyArnold]

Evolution will invent eternal life maybe.

Aren't things getting worse?

 

[Trogool]

Aren't things getting worse?

No.