Anger towards other Christians on view of suicide.

[Mobiosity]

This is probably the most amusing thread ever.

You really do need to get out more.

 

[ExistencePrecedesEssence]

You really do need to get out more.

Its 2:30 and raining, what can i say.

 

[Mobiosity]

Goodbye?

 

[ExistencePrecedesEssence]

Ha. My apology, i thought about what i said, and i suppose it might offend some people, i sincerly apologize and hopefully im not misinterpreted, what i meant was this threat is quite serious? Therefore making it amusing to read, since it had depth.

 

[Beanieboy]

nice argument. have you given thought that killing oneself is killing the temple of the Holy Spirit. Hence, it is blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

.

Following that logic, getting high, getting drunk, having premarital sex, smoking cigarettes, etc., is a blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

Are all of those people going to hell?

Are people who drink themselves to Ciriasis-town going to hell?
People who smoke themselves to cancer-ville going to hell?
Or people that smoke and never get cancer (your body is not your own, and clogging your lungs with tar is still willingly tarnishing your body.)

I would suggest memorizing Corinthians 13 to find out what love is before you memorize ways of judging the dead.

 

[Beanieboy]

Beautiful post!

I too have lived and struggled with depression but am now quite well. What I most remember about the lowest periods in my life was the unbelievable heaviness of the world around you, like you mentioned carrying groceries. It felt like the atmosphere was heavy and all the vibrant colours of the world were washed out and dull grey. Like trying to wade through thick mud. I also was hearing voices telling me to kill myself, it never felt selfish to me at the time, but I believed it would solve everyone's problems. The excrutiating pain of depression is also unbearable to many people.

My ex-husband of 17 years (bi-polar) committed suicide 4 years ago, after we divorced. The church I was raised in and that my kids go to, Roman Catholic, had a lovely funeral for him. They have recognized that noone in their "right" mind would be able to take their own life, thus a mental illness (God knows all)

I'm so sorry for you and your family.
I'm also sorry for your ex-husband. I've been suicidal a few times in my life, a combination of mild suicide that ascerbated when under stress, and situations (I was coming out in the 80s, had very religious parents, and was being called an abomination (a hateful thing of God.)

If you believe that you are hated even by God, you feel like you would be better having never been born.

I've been there. You get a warped idea of reality and you actually believe that you are doing everyone a favor.

I'm very sorry about your loss.

 

[Casstranquility]

I have depression, and I think that if there is a hell, people who commit suicide would never taste it. They've already tasted it. I could never believe God would let one be so tormented in this life and then torment them yet again in another life. How cruel! How unmerciful! How wrong! I've wanted to commit suicide to escape the pain. What a God to say "Ha, ha, you tried to escape it, but I'm going to fill your life with it for eternity!" That only conjures up a picture of an evil prison warden. If you try to escape, he tortures you, but if you behave, you are rewarded. Could that be Love? No.

 

[Waiting for the Verdict]

This thread reminds me a lot of my childhood, where evangelicals routinely condemned me to hell for feeling suicidal.

 

[THEDOMINUS]

I used to know a person from my old church who committed suicide, and the majority of the church quietly believed that he went to hell. When I asked them privately would suicide send him or anyone else to hell, some said “it was too late to ask for forgiveness” and “he rejected the gift of life therefore he cannot be forgiven”. In addition, some even questioned his salvation and said that he wasn’t saved. When I heard these comments from people within the church, it sent me out of mind with anger.

I have also read threads on this forum and other Christian forums on the common view of suicide. And I’m pretty astounded by the uncaring/condemning attitude by many so called Christians. They seem to completely ignore the fact that suicide is often the result of severe mental illness, and trauma related stress. Instead, they instantly blame the person who committed or is struggling with suicide for not having enough faith. These types of Christians make me sooo angry. I’ve lost a close a family member and friend to suicide who were both believers in Christ, and it really hurts to find out that most Christians believe suicides go to hell, and worse that they weren’t believers at all!!

My anger towards these types of people is really getting to me, and until I get this sorted out I refuse to have fellowship with other Christians. They seem so narrow minded.

Sorry, but I needed to let off steam.

These people get me angry to, friend. To think, to imagine that we would ever condemn the actions of a suicide victim, is beyond me. These people that believe these things are those who have heard hear-say from the church, that life is to be cherished to the degree of not taking your own life; but sometimes suicide is the only way out.

I do know that the church used to, I don't know if it still does, teach that suicide victims have a go to hell directly card. It is not the suicide victim who is damned but the people that say these things--they are those who are damned; as Jesus says, do not condemn and you will not be condemned. These are the people that condemn everything that is outside the moral teaching of the church--they are the believers in hell. They believe that everything that is different than their belief is condemned to hell; but it is they, make no mistake about it, that are damned--to believe and not have compassion on those who suffer gravely.

It is the temple of the damned, they follow.

 

[quatona]

At the risk of p ing everyone off, I consider suicide to be a very selfish act.

If suicide is a selfish act then I regard it a selfishness that everyone is perfectly entitled to.
[quoteTaking the easy way out[/quote]
Yes, taking the easy way out of something you hadn´t a say in taking the way into, in the first place.

and leaving your family and friends to pick up the pieces, clean up the mess, and wonder for the rest of their lives what they could have done to prevent it.[/quote
One might of course argue that expecting someone to continue his life against his will just so that you feel better isn´t any less selfish.

 

[quatona]

I have depression, and I think that if there is a hell, people who commit suicide would never taste it. They've already tasted it. I could never believe God would let one be so tormented in this life and then torment them yet again in another life. How cruel! How unmerciful! How wrong! I've wanted to commit suicide to escape the pain. What a God to say "Ha, ha, you tried to escape it, but I'm going to fill your life with it for eternity!" That only conjures up a picture of an evil prison warden. If you try to escape, he tortures you, but if you behave, you are rewarded. Could that be Love? No.

Very well said.
Fortunately I have never suffered from depression or similar diseases, but I have always wondered where people who haven´t been in the shoes of those who suffer from them take the authority of blaming them.
If expanding this a little, I have never been in the shoes of anybody else, and therefore I avoid statements that explictly or implicitly say that someone could have done differently than he did. I dont know sh about what´s going on in other persons.

 

[Emmy]

Dear Neenie. I read your replies, and I do agree with what most of you reply. I also understand your anger towards some Christians. But it is God, who is in Command, and God who judges us. He knows every thought we have, and every wrong we commit, and I thank God, that He is my Judge, He alone knows WHY we act, and behave as we do. Some of you repy, that we should not encourage, nor excuse, but also definitely not condemn. Prayers are always the most accepted Gift, in every situation. I say this humbly and lovingly, Neenie, and send greetings. Emmy, your sister in Christ.

 

[threedog]

At the risk of p ing everyone off, I consider suicide to be a very selfish act. Taking the easy way out and leaving your family and friends to pick up the pieces, clean up the mess, and wonder for the rest of their lives what they could have done to prevent it.

For what it's worth, I don't think suicides go to hell. No one with a sound mind would commit suicide and God wouldn't damn someone who is not in control of themselves; if indeed hell exists.

It is hard to blame someone who wants to end their suffering. How much pain and suffering would it take for you to commit suicide? We are all venerable to suicide if our pain and agony exceeds a certain threshold.

threedog

 

[Mailman Dan]

http://www.livingwaters.com/witnessingtool/doessomeonegotohellforsuicide.shtml


"Does someone go to hell for committing suicide?"


Those who are adamant that a person who takes his life is committing a mortal sin, and will go to hell, are basing their belief on church doctrine rather than on the Bible. Scripture is silent on the subject. There are no verses that say "He who takes his own life shall be damned." According to Scripture, only one sin does not have forgiveness, and that is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit (see Mark 3:29 footnote). That means there is forgiveness for every other sin.
Some quote 1 Corinthians 3:17, which says that God will destroy someone who "defiles" the temple of the Holy Spirit. Yet, there is disagreement about what it means to defile the temple. Does this include suicide? Does it include illicit drug abuse (slow suicide), prescription drug abuse, cigarettes (deliberately breathing in poisons that will eventually kill), tattoos, over-eating (digging a grave with your spoon), or alcohol abuse?


God forbid that we add to the pain of someone who has lost a loved one through the tragedy of suicide, by making a judgment about their eternal destiny. God is the ultimate Judge, and we should therefore leave the issue in His hands. It would be wise to follow the biblical example and not come to any verdict in the case of suicide.


Dan~~~>has never seen any bibical proof of that doctrine

 

[kiwimac]

Amen friend, amen!

 

[threedog]

http://www.livingwaters.com/witnessingtool/doessomeonegotohellforsuicide.shtml


"Does someone go to hell for committing suicide?"


Those who are adamant that a person who takes his life is committing a mortal sin, and will go to hell, are basing their belief on church doctrine rather than on the Bible. Scripture is silent on the subject. There are no verses that say "He who takes his own life shall be damned." According to Scripture, only one sin does not have forgiveness, and that is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit (see Mark 3:29 footnote). That means there is forgiveness for every other sin.
Some quote 1 Corinthians 3:17, which says that God will destroy someone who "defiles" the temple of the Holy Spirit. Yet, there is disagreement about what it means to defile the temple. Does this include suicide? Does it include illicit drug abuse (slow suicide), prescription drug abuse, cigarettes (deliberately breathing in poisons that will eventually kill), tattoos, over-eating (digging a grave with your spoon), or alcohol abuse?


God forbid that we add to the pain of someone who has lost a loved one through the tragedy of suicide, by making a judgment about their eternal destiny. God is the ultimate Judge, and we should therefore leave the issue in His hands. It would be wise to follow the biblical example and not come to any verdict in the case of suicide.


Dan~~~>has never seen any bibical proof of that doctrine

thank you Dan...thank you!

threedog

 

[Mobiosity]

It is hard to blame someone who wants to end their suffering. How much pain and suffering would it take for you to commit suicide? We are all venerable to suicide if our pain and agony exceeds a certain threshold.

threedog

I agree that it's hard to blame someone who wants to end their suffering. My statement is meant to make someone who is having suicidal thoughts due to depression or trouble to stop for a minute and maybe change his/her mind. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. If one person thinks twice about the pain they'd cause and the fact that it more than outweighs any burden they feel they are to their loved ones, it'll be more than worth the ill feelings of those who are opposed to my statement.

 

[Abiel]

The God I serve is infinitely loving and merciful, not a bully mind control tyrant. He is on the side of the suffering. It is perfectly obvious that a person weho has suffered so much in life will be safe eternally in His loving arms.

 

[Im_A]

I used to know a person from my old church who committed suicide, and the majority of the church quietly believed that he went to hell. When I asked them privately would suicide send him or anyone else to hell, some said “it was too late to ask for forgiveness” and “he rejected the gift of life therefore he cannot be forgiven”. In addition, some even questioned his salvation and said that he wasn’t saved. When I heard these comments from people within the church, it sent me out of mind with anger.

I have also read threads on this forum and other Christian forums on the common view of suicide. And I’m pretty astounded by the uncaring/condemning attitude by many so called Christians. They seem to completely ignore the fact that suicide is often the result of severe mental illness, and trauma related stress. Instead, they instantly blame the person who committed or is struggling with suicide for not having enough faith. These types of Christians make me sooo angry. I’ve lost a close a family member and friend to suicide who were both believers in Christ, and it really hurts to find out that most Christians believe suicides go to hell, and worse that they weren’t believers at all!!

My anger towards these types of people is really getting to me, and until I get this sorted out I refuse to have fellowship with other Christians. They seem so narrow minded.

Sorry, but I needed to let off steam.

personally i just hold the view that it's up to God where people go so i see no reason to speculate on who goes where in the afterlife even with suicide. i find it best to just pray for them, even tho they are in the afterlife.

 

[threedog]

I agree that it's hard to blame someone who wants to end their suffering. My statement is meant to make someone who is having suicidal thoughts due to depression or trouble to stop for a minute and maybe change his/her mind. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. If one person thinks twice about the pain they'd cause and the fact that it more than outweighs any burden they feel they are to their loved ones, it'll be more than worth the ill feelings of those who are opposed to my statement.

Hi Mobiosity,

An excellent point that I failed to see in your post. I retract my previous comments to you as I now appreciate and understand the consideration you gave in your post. Also, Thank you for not overeacting to my comments.

Bless you,

threedog