Analytical Thinking

ZoeyLou said:

How does one remain faithful while struggling with analytical thoughts?

I am attempting to aid someone with this.

If you have any resources - such as books or blog articles - I would love to explore anything you recommend.

Thank you so much for your support.

God bless xx

Click to expand...

The reality of God and he being who he said he was in Scripture stands up to all levels of analysis. The problem this person has is not that he or she is analyzing information, but what input they've had into their minds. I recommend they listen to the testimonies of people of their experiences with Jesus Christ. The Bible is not a book of just ideas or what people believe; it is a book of what people have experienced, and there are plenty of similar modern day experiences if one looks for them.

Even more important is what their faith is like. A change in their faith will change the way they think about the same information. Those who constantly seek God himself, the person, will have their minds renewed. Seeking information about God or understanding that information is absolutely not a substitute for seeking God himself. In this context, the second sentence in this verse can be interpreted as "know God himself better":


Correct analysis is a product of faith, (Matthew 15:19, Luke 6:45) and cannot be used to confirm the reality of God (without combining it with faith).


It is through reason that we satisfy our intellectual needs, but it is not a prerequisite for believing in God.

It should not be surprising that obedience is necessary to acquiring more faith and shedding some of the spiritual blindness that we all have which affects the way we think so extremely. God says it will result in revelation of himself.

ZoeyLou said:

From what I understand they are struggling greatly with remaining faithful. They are greatly aggravated by the thoughts they harbor, questioning things constantly. They said that all they can see are flaws. This greatly distracts them from growing spiritually.

The example I was given is this: Worshiping is a terrible struggle. They cannot stop thinking about logic long enough to absorb the sound and atmosphere of community worship.

Click to expand...

I'm very analytical myself. May be a gift. Might be a precursor to becoming a teacher. You can check my Bible study website as an example of what analytic thinkers can produce. BCBSR - The Berean Christian Bible Study Resources: Bible Study Guides for Christians

ZoeyLou said:

How does one remain faithful while struggling with analytical thoughts?

I am attempting to aid someone with this.

If you have any resources - such as books or blog articles - I would love to explore anything you recommend.

Thank you so much for your support.

God bless xx

Click to expand...

Maybe your friend would like some facts that point to the existence of God, especially since he/she has an analytical mind? If so, I would recommend a brilliant 3-DVD set on Astronomy from a Biblical perspective. You can read about it here and here. I have all three DVDs and can highly recommend this material as it's both well-presented and gives the glory to God.

So the only trouble they have is just worshiping in a large crowd? Are they Christian?

I don't like to worship around people myself. I don't attend church and I'm a Christian. I just don't like to show it around people. I can't do that. But I do worship God in my heart. I like to listen to bands like Hillsong, Elevation, Planetshaker and other Asian bands.

I'm not really sure how to explain it if they are not Christian. My guess is it's a logically problem than emotional since you said it's a analytical thought. They have to see the love of God revealed in their life in order to appreciate Him. I don't blame them if they don't worship in a large crowd, but at least know God in their hearts and worship Him in their room by themselves or something.

Your question is a fair question. So I will give you an answer. Keep in mind that I was trained to be a logical person, in the studies of science and engineering. I offer these thoughts with humility.

One of the best answers can be found in 1 Corinthians 13, one of the most famous passages written by Paul. I urge you to look at all the words there, because the wisdom comes from God himself.

"But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge (science), it will pass away. ... And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love."

ZoeyLou said:

How does one remain faithful while struggling with analytical thoughts?

I am attempting to aid someone with this.

If you have any resources - such as books or blog articles - I would love to explore anything you recommend.

Thank you so much for your support.

God bless xx

Click to expand...

You know, the person who knows and loves Jesus, who experiences the conviction, strengthening, illumination of mind, comfort, and material supply of God on a daily basis does not wonder if God exists and if the Christian faith is true. Too often, people claiming to be Christians do not really know what it means to walk with God, to experience Him, every day. They aren't sure what God's conviction is; they don't recall ever seeing God's truth in a new, and deeper, and fuller way; they have never really experienced His strengthening in the face of temptation; they don't know what it is to be comforted by Him, and so on. Is it any wonder, then, that they grow skeptical of their faith and of the God it claims to reveal? Arguments, however philosophically clever, cannot ever make up for actually walking with God. Your friend's skepticism needs to be met ultimately by the Person of Christ, by God Himself, not by arguments about Him. In the light of this fact, I offer you the following website links:

www.reasonablefaith.org
www.str.org
www.coldcasechristianity.com
www.crossexamined.org

Doubt by Os Guinness

Doubt -- by Os Guiness -- he studied under Francis Schaeffer, who wrote books on Apologetics

ZoeyLou said:

From what I understand they are struggling greatly with remaining faithful. They are greatly aggravated by the thoughts they harbor, questioning things constantly. They said that all they can see are flaws. This greatly distracts them from growing spiritually.

The example I was given is this: Worshiping is a terrible struggle. They cannot stop thinking about logic long enough to absorb the sound and atmosphere of community worship.

Click to expand...

Maybe, he or she read this verse:

Proverbs 14:15
The simple believe anything, but the prudent give thought to their steps.

ZoeyLou said:

How does one remain faithful while struggling with analytical thoughts?

I am attempting to aid someone with this.

If you have any resources - such as books or blog articles - I would love to explore anything you recommend.

Thank you so much for your support.

God bless xx

Click to expand...

It is more important to obey the Lord's commandments than it is to understand why we need to obey the Lord's commandments. They are there to help us. Someday we will understand why.

I am an analytical thinker, but that doesnt mean I have doubts. I suspect you are looking at it wrong. Its not about the type of person they are, its about why they have doubts. Being an analytical thinker doesnt make you have doubts. The problem is your friend is believing what he is being taught is fact by non-believers. What they see as proof that god does not exist, even if that is far from the truth.

What you friend needs to do is use their analytical mind to look at both sides of the argument, analyze the raw information for themselves and come to their own conclusion. There is a lot of information out there about intelligent design, biblical science, etc. Your friend should look at that and their analytical mind can help them question what they already "know" and draw them closer to God.

ZoeyLou said:

How does one remain faithful while struggling with analytical thoughts?

Click to expand...

In my own struggles with analytical thinking and matching what I hear being taught in church or even in reading the Bible a couple of things have helped me:

1. understanding that when adults learn, part of the process involves filtering or matching what is being said (or more properly, what is being "heard") by personal "experience" and existing beliefs. We would rather build on what we currently think is correct, than have to change the intellectual edifice we have already invested in building within our minds.

2. we need to go back and assess our presuppositions, our assumptions, our perceptives, our starting points. Quite often, when I have changed the underlying assumptions, or begun by looking from a different perspective, many of the analytical or logical issues disappear.

This is very clear even in the Scriptures, where we find assumptions about the Messiah needed to be turned totally upside down after the crucifixion and especially the resurrection of Jesus. Jewish people, including the disciples, of Jesus' time assumed that the Messiah could not be killed, let alone by gentiles. This simply didn't exist within the realm of possibility for them. So when they heard Jesus talking about his coming death, they simply couldn't accept it and even rebuked him for "talking like that " (Such defeatism was unbecoming of the one they believed to be the Messiah).

And the resurrection in their thinking was always a collective affair which was part and parcel of the "end of the world." So accepting Jesus as the Messiah after the resurrection required a revolution in thinking - that was basically accepting not only that the Messiah could die, but that he must die. (This is also a reason why the idea that early Jewish leaders in the Church made up the story of the resurrection is nonsense - such an idea would not occur to a Jew of the time, nor would it be believed if it were coupled with a claim that Jesus was the Messiah. The resurrection was a real historic event involving physical return to life of the body, that they could not deny and were willing to die for.) Even Paul didn't see the latter point about the Messiah's suffering till well into his second missionary journey, when he understood that the cross was not a human crime against God's messenger, who God vindicated through resurrection, but the very core of God's plan for salvation. He himself was thoroughly shaken by this revelation, and for the first time, he was afraid to speak in Corinth. (1 Cor 2:1-5; 1 Cor 15:3; 1 Cor 2:3; Acts 18:9) Because "the cross is a stumbling block to the Jews (they could NOT accept that the Messiah would suffer death) and is foolishness to the Gentile - everyone else (how can you be victorious by submitting to crucifixion?)" (1 Cor 1:23) When you change your starting point, and your assumptions, suddenly everything becomes clear. .... for example among other things, one cannot defeat death simply by defering it, one must submit to death, then defeat it by coming back to eternal life.

So in discussions with your friend, try to dig down deep into your (both of you) assumptions and see whether or not this is a source of misunderstanding, a place where if changes are made, many more things become clear and consistent.

ZoeyLou said:

they reached out to me.

Click to expand...

...

ZoeyLou said:

I will try to convince Bill to talk to them.

Click to expand...

Depending upon this person, it could be seen as betrayal.. if they have confided in you then they have seen something about you that is trustworthy and useful, so if you know that Bill is able to be useful too, then I would be inclined to suggest to that person that Bill might be worth speaking to. Otherwise, there is another chance for the flesh to be offended (eg: pride, envy etc).

When I see this happening (the confiding), I tend to recognise that it is Jesus Christ who is drawing that person to me (because the flesh, ego has the opposite effect).. so I look to see Him in that person, to find out what it is that He needs me to add to that person for their growth (1 Corinthians 3:6c). This is our service to each other (Mark 10:43b, 1 Corinthians 8:1b).

ZoeyLou said:

From what I understand they are struggling greatly with remaining faithful. They are greatly aggravated by the thoughts they harbor, questioning things constantly. They said that all they can see are flaws. This greatly distracts them from growing spiritually.

The example I was given is this: Worshiping is a terrible struggle. They cannot stop thinking about logic long enough to absorb the sound and atmosphere of community worship.

Click to expand...

Worship is something we do for God with our life. Just because a person can't sing in a crowd doesn't mean they do not worship.

Perhaps your analytical mind could use thier way of thinking in service to God, this would be an act of worship.

ZoeyLou said:

From what I understand they are struggling greatly with remaining faithful. They are greatly aggravated by the thoughts they harbor, questioning things constantly. They said that all they can see are flaws. This greatly distracts them from growing spiritually.

The example I was given is this: Worshiping is a terrible struggle. They cannot stop thinking about logic long enough to absorb the sound and atmosphere of community worship.

Click to expand...

There are some excellent minds who wrote or present fairly flawless logic in matters of our faith. I am fond of Mere Christianity. There are some debaters who can logically defend the faith. Sounds to me like the person might want to realize that loving God with the mind is not only possible, it is extremely rewarding. Many Christians either do not know about this or have no interest in it. It is seldom preached as the people in church seem to want experience that transcends the mind which is too bad because that is not what our faith is to be. We are to love God with the mind as well and it is possible.

I personally do not have much use for terms like "growing spiritually" and do not understand what that means. I think in terms of growing in my knowledge of God and my willingness to love and obey Him and hear his direction for me. This is done, as mentioned, by obeying Him in my day. The questions my mind has come up with, I have asked Him and He has answered. I do not have to pretend the were no questions. And with time, I have come to see that there are no flaws in God but there are flaws in our thinking. In relationship with Him, those can be corrected as He gives understanding. But it is very complex. It is not a child's faith but an adult's faith that understands complex matters. Just as a child might eat dinner and feel better afterwards, it is the adult who can understand the complexity of digestion in it full biochemical process. So the answers are there, but they are complex same as biology is complex.

So I would suggest they bring their questions to God for answers. Seek Him in order to understand. Them who seeks, finds.

On a separate note, I would avoid Calvinism or what they like to call "reformed" theology (to hide its founder) as that is divorced from logic when it comes to God. They can reason out everything except God being morally good so at that point, reason has to be jettisoned to conform with the theology. So if your friend is struggling with the rational, Calvinism will only make matters words.

It takes a faithful critical thinker to teach a doubting critical thinker the virtues of faith. Personally, I like to find and point out the fallacies in the doubts they are having or the lies they are tempted to believe.

Sketcher said:

It takes a faithful critical thinker to teach a doubting critical thinker the virtues of faith. Personally, I like to find and point out the fallacies in the doubts they are having or the lies they are tempted to believe.

Click to expand...

I feel the same way. Been doing that to my own thinking for years.

Dorothy Mae said:

On a separate note, I would avoid Calvinism or what they like to call "reformed" theology (to hide its founder)

Click to expand...

Actually, Reformed theology is the only correct theology.

Radagast said:

Actually, Reformed theology is the only correct theology.

Click to expand...

...well, now that that is settled, I guess we can all just close our accounts here on Christian Forums and get on with life.