An Adventist view of the Sabbath Commandment - and why it is applicable to all mankind

[BobRyan]

I am so glad that the saved are not in the position of the lost, such that they are free to violate as many of the OT commandments as they wish.

I am so glad that is not what Christ teaches in Mark 7:6-13

6 But He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy about you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 And in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘The one who speaks evil of father or mother, is certainly to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a person says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is, given to God),’ 12 you no longer allow him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thereby invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”

"Commandment of God" = "Moses said" = "Word of God"
​

And I am so glad that is not what Christ teaches in Matt 19

• 16 And someone came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do so that I may obtain eternal life?” 17 And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you want to enter life, keep the commandments.” 18 Then he *said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said,
  • “You shall not commit murder; Ex 20
    
  • You shall not commit adultery; Ex 20
    
  • You shall not steal; Ex 20
    
  • You shall not give false testimony; Ex 20
  • 19 Honor your father and mother; Ex 20
    
  • and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Lev 19:18

And I am so glad that is not what Paul teaches in Eph 6

• Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. 2 Honor your father and mother --Ex 20:12 -- (which is the first commandment with a promise), 3 so that it may turn out well for you, and that you may live long on the earth.

And I am so glad that is not what Paul teaches in Romans 7
And I am so glad that is not what Paul teaches in 1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the commandments of God"

 

[boughtwithaprice]

Let me just ensure i have this right, Antimonianism is

"In some Christian belief systems, an antinomian is one who takes the principle of salvation by faith and divine grace to the point of asserting that the saved are not bound to follow the moral law contained in the Ten Commandments.[2][3]

What i find interesting about the Sabbath debate is that one can somehow manage to claim one is not Antimonian (which to me seems to be a belief considered heresy from a Catholic perspective) and yet ignore Matthew 5:19 and throw out and therefore break the Sabbath Commandment?

I think the only logical argument a Catholic can make regarding the Sabbath is to say "our church changed it". It is a very unfortunate position for a Catholic to base their theology, however, in reality there isnt a better explanation that makes logical sense.

It is an excellent point that you make. One cannot claim to be against Antinomianism, yet advocate the breaking of a commandment. The question is, does the Catholic Church advocate throwing out and therefore breaking the Sabbath Commandment? The answer is No. The Catholic Church teaches that the faithful are obligated to set aside one day in seven for the worship of God. As in Acts 20:7, Christians gather on the first day of the week for the breaking of bread. This would be the Eucharist, where we gather to eat and drink the flesh and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ as commanded by Him. When you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim His death until He come in glory.

We need to keep all the commandments and not just pick and choose what suits us

 

[BobRyan]

It is an excellent point that you make. One cannot claim to be against Antinomianism, yet advocate the breaking of a commandment. The question is, does the Catholic Church advocate throwing out and therefore breaking the Sabbath Commandment? The answer is No. The Catholic Church teaches that the faithful are obligated to set aside one day in seven for the worship of God. As in Acts 20:7, Christians gather on the first day of the week for the breaking of bread. This would be the Eucharist, where we gather to eat and drink the flesh and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ as commanded by Him. When you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim His death until He come in glory.

We need to keep all the commandments and not just pick and Twhat suits us

This is a good point - the Catholic church does not argue that there are only NINE commandments. It claims all TEN remain.

In fact this is the case with ALL the Bible scholarship I point to on page 1 and 2 of this thread - on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate.

as we saw here -- Apr 9, 2021 #1

I said --

No wonder even non-Bible Sabbath keeping scholarship admits to these Bible details --
The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism

Some examples - here #7
and here: #8

===================== added 20210512

The claim that the Catholic church makes is to "edit", not to delete so it claims the Sabbath obligation is satisfied by attending mass on what the Bible calls week-day-1. An example of their claim to have made that "change" can be found in the Catholic commentary on the Baltimore Catechism by Leo Trese "The Faith Explained" - in his section on "The Sabbath" commandment.


The Catholic Commentary on the Baltimore Catechism post Vatican II - argues the SAME two points.

1965 -- first published 1959
(from "The Faith Explained" page 243

"we know that in the O.T it was the seventh day of the week - the Sabbath day- which was observed as the Lord's day. that was the law as God gave it...'remember to keep holy the Sabbath day.. the early Christian church determined as the Lord's day the first day of the week. That the church had the right to make such a law is evident...


"The reason for changing the Lord's day from Saturday to Sunday lies in the fact that to the Christian church the first day of the week had been made double holy...

"nothing is said in the bible about the change of the Lord's day from Saturday to Sunday..that is why we find so illogical the attitude of many non-Catholic who say they will believe nothing unless they can find it in the bible and yet will continue to keep Sunday as the Lord's day on the say-so of the Catholic church"

The Sabbath commandment says "the seventh day IS the Sabbath of YHWH (the LORD)" Ex 20:10

 

[AdamjEdgar]

This is a good point - the Catholic church does not argue that there are only NINE commandments. It claims all TEN remain.

In fact this is the case with ALL the Bible scholarship I point to on page 1 and 2 of this thread - on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate.

as we saw here -- Apr 9, 2021 #1

I said --

No wonder even non-Bible Sabbath keeping scholarship admits to these Bible details --
The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism

Some examples - here #7
and here: #8

The claim that the Catholic church makes is to "edit", not to delete so it claims the Sabbath obligation is satisfied by attending mass on what the Bible calls week-day-1. An example of their claim to have made that "change" can be found in the Catholic commentary on the Baltimore Catechism by Leo Trese - in his section on "The Sabbath" commandment.

The point is, does keeping Sunday, the First day of the week fulfill the Law of God? (ie 4th Commandment clearly says "in six days do all your work, but the Seventh Day is the Sabbath!")

The Disciple Matthew records Jesus himself as saying in Matthew 5

19Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven

As i have stated in a similar topic to this, most of the denominations i have had dealings with that worship on Sunday claim it under the New Covenant. The trouble is Jeremiah 31

32This covenant will not be like the one I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand and brought them out of the land of Egypt. They broke that covenant,.."

33“...this is the new covenant I will make with the people of Israel after those days,” says the LORD. “I will put my instructions deep within them, and I will write them on their hearts."

Paul even quotes Jeremiahs prophecy in Hebrews 8. There is no doubt which covenant Paul and all the other apostles believed Jesus was referring to in Luke 22:20..."This cup is the new covenant in my blood, [even] that which is poured out for you."

Are not the Catholic Church (and any other Sunday worshipping denomination) breaking the 4th commandment?

Considering Jesus statements, Jeremiahs prophecy and Pauls re-iteration of Jeremiahs prophecy, How can it be interpreted any other way than this!

 

[BobRyan]

The point is, does keeping Sunday, the First day of the week fulfill the Law of God? (ie 4th Commandment clearly says "in six days do all your work, but the Seventh Day is the Sabbath!")

The 4th commandment says "the seventh day IS the Sabbath of YHWH (The LORD)" - you are asking if worship on what the Bible calls week-day-1 fulfills that command - which is a good point.

In Ex 16 we find the statement "tomorrow IS the Sabbath" and manna fell 6 days a week but not on "the seventh". If they had chosen week-day-1 then each week they would have gone hungry one day a week.

The Disciple Matthew records Jesus himself as saying in Matthew 5

19Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven

..

Are not the Catholic Church (and any other Sunday worshipping denomination) breaking the 4th commandment?

So then you are not talking about deleting a commandment - but rather editing it and in that edit effectively breaking it.

I was responding to the point boughtwithaprice made about "deleting" the commandment - because their documents do claim that they are editing/changing the Sabbath commandment - but they never claim to delete it.

I added a quote from one of their documents to post #243

==============

Some posts in the "Sabbath and the Law" section focus on deleting a commandment or declaring all of the TEN abolished/deleted. (you can see that on this thread as well in places).

But a different form of opposing a 7th-day Sabbath is the claim to have changed/edited/altered the command to repoint it from the 7th day - to week-day-1.

 

[AdamjEdgar]

The 4th commandment say "the seventh day IS the Sabbath of YHWH (The LORD)" - you are asking if worship on what the Bible calls week-day-1 fulfills that command - which is a good point.

In Ex 16 we find the statement "tomorrow IS the Sabbath" and manna fell 6 days a week but not on "the seventh". If they had chosen week-day-1 then each week they would have gone hungry one day a week.



So then you are not talking about deleting a commandment - but rather editing it and in that edit effectively breaking it.

I was responding to the point boughtwithaprice made about "deleting" the commandment - because their documents do claim that they are editing/changing the Sabbath commandment - but they never claim to delete it.

I added a quote from one of their documents to post #243

note what Paul says at the end of Matthew 5 and verse 19 "but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven"

This i would conclude means anyone who practises and teaches Sunday worship will be called the least in the kingdom of heaven because that is not in harmony with the Commandments of God (ie 10 commandments)

 

[BobRyan]

note what Paul says at the end of Matthew 5 and verse 19 "but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven"

This i would conclude means anyone who practises and teaches Sunday worship will be called the least in the kingdom of heaven because that is not in harmony with the Commandments of God (ie 10 commandments)

No doubt editing God's word is hard to defend so also editing God's Commandments "any one of them" would be hard to defend from the Bible.