an absolute reality apart from our perception of it

[deshadow]

s there a absolute reality. for us anyway... in the plane of reality that we all exist in... can we say tat it is the same, one, absolute?

not to say there are not other dimensions or something, but dimension and other are just word that we humans know how to "use" to describe ideas for communication, there might be something else but we have no conception, no idea how to think about it. the fact that we do think and use language and have perceptions, sights and sounds, is werid enough. im not gonna bother trying to analyze a reality not made up of matter and energies and inorganic and organic interaction.


but within this reality, everyone has their picture of it.

is one correct? one, unchanging yet changing constant, one thing that we are all a aprt of.

and if tere is one thing.

then it could be anytihng right?

so it very well could be that christianity is right.

ad that a god, with a human like personality created all of this, and his creations became "corrupted" but not really corrupted, since in absolute reality, it is normal for that to happen, for the angels and satan to rebel and for humans to fall, and for god to think we are worthy of punishm,ent. all those are constructs that the participators like god, satan and humans percieve.

but could that wold also be the absolute reality that we all are a part of now.

ad heaven and hell are real, and we all need jesus, and if we dont get jesus now before we die we are screwed. and when you think about time and reality, our life, is puny....

life is nothing. if infinity or the rest of reality besides our life on eart is controlled by human like god being jehova, then we really might have to do what he wants right?

we have no choice


that is precisely what hardcore christians are saying.

the implications are staggering.


what do you guys think

 

[rocklife]

I hope the idea of hell you are mentioning is not the misunderstood one of being tortured in fires for billions of years. I don't believe God is sadistic. He is good, good will triumph evil. The punishment for sin is death. Jesus is the only offer of eternal life, sin brings eternal death (not torture).

Yes, death is coming, we should prepare. Seek salvation. Jesus says I am the way, no one comes to the Father but through Him. Jesus offers an answer to sin and death.

I encourage you to continue in New Testament and prayers to get to know Him and Jesus more. His teachings are sometimes misrepresented in church preachings, and that is also discussed in the New Testament as a warning of the times.

where else is salvation from sin and death? just God and Jesus, His perfect sacrifice pleasing to a Holy God.

 

[deshadow]

the bible seems inconclusive on what hell is just like many other things.

why did jesus need to save us from sin? why does god need to be pleased?



why does god need to be pleased

why does god need to be pleased

this doesnt seem perfect


they say we cant understand gods perception because we are human

ok i agree

then how do we know he is worthy of our worship?

we as humans cant understand his perfection. we cant understand his holiness, his goodness, we cant understand his judgement


why does he need to be just?

thats what humans do. we judge, we condemn, we punish

 

[rocklife]

have you read the whole bible?

have you read the whole New Testament?

you say the bible seems inconclusive, do you say this with hours of studying and seeking or just off the top of your head? I say this in sincerity.

if you are interested in a bible study about hell, I recommend http://www.amazingfacts.org/items/storacle_lessons.asp click watch on Cities of Ash. If you actually take the time to study the bible, this preaching will confirm what many others have seen from the bible about the hell teaching, God isn't torture loving and isn't going to do that, there is no justice in that

 

[rocklife]

I highly recommend reading the new testament more than even church attendance. From what I see on tv with christian preaching, and what is being done at many churches, I feel bad that Christianity is being shown like that. So much is preaching wrong things. The New Testament and Jesus even say many church leaders are just pretending to be godly.

I just hope you don't get so much information from church attendance. Get it from the Bible, unfortunately there are lot of bad pastors and preachers. There are some good ones, but there are many bad ones. You will only know what is right if you are in tune with Jesus and His right teachings.

I hope that makes sense. I can't really answer these other questions you have here, maybe someone else can. God bless

 

[Rafael]

the bible seems inconclusive on what hell is just like many other things.

why did jesus need to save us from sin? why does god need to be pleased?



why does god need to be pleased

why does god need to be pleased

this doesnt seem perfect


they say we cant understand gods perception because we are human

ok i agree

then how do we know he is worthy of our worship?

we as humans cant understand his perfection. we cant understand his holiness, his goodness, we cant understand his judgement


why does he need to be just?

thats what humans do. we judge, we condemn, we punish

Don't you enjoy the pleasures of life? Why is it so difficult to imagine that God receives and deserves pleasure too? He created us in His own image and did not alienate Himself completely from us, but became the flesh of man in Jesus and all things to us - treating us, those that love Him, as beloved. Those that hate Him must have a reason, and I can see lots of lies out there that come from the great deceiver who has his role to play in counter and contrast to God's light. His light will always and does as in nature, dispell the darkness of evil - eventually, forever. For now, it surely must provide contrast and revelation to the truth or ""all" things would not work together for good to those that love Him", as God's word says..
We understand the perfection of holiness because of His work in us through the divine nature receive from Jesus - His manifestation in the flesh to mankind and Savoir. As we submit ourselves in love to His hand, He does the work, but He does not violate the bond of love that never forces and cannot or love would only be a word with no meaning..
Check the links out about hell that are provided. The controversy lies with men about God's nature. He is love, and only expells that which is counter to it.

 

[Davis]

You asked the question: "How do we know that He is worthy of worship?"

Answer: Just look at creation for crying outloud. Look at the sun, the moon, the stars, the planets, the birds, the sunsets.

 

[EmbracingHim]

s there a absolute reality. for us anyway... in the plane of reality that we all exist in... can we say tat it is the same, one, absolute?

not to say there are not other dimensions or something, but dimension and other are just word that we humans know how to "use" to describe ideas for communication, there might be something else but we have no conception, no idea how to think about it. the fact that we do think and use language and have perceptions, sights and sounds, is werid enough. im not gonna bother trying to analyze a reality not made up of matter and energies and inorganic and organic interaction.


but within this reality, everyone has their picture of it.

is one correct? one, unchanging yet changing constant, one thing that we are all a aprt of.

and if tere is one thing.

then it could be anytihng right?

so it very well could be that christianity is right.

ad that a god, with a human like personality created all of this, and his creations became "corrupted" but not really corrupted, since in absolute reality, it is normal for that to happen, for the angels and satan to rebel and for humans to fall, and for god to think we are worthy of punishm,ent. all those are constructs that the participators like god, satan and humans percieve.

but could that wold also be the absolute reality that we all are a part of now.

ad heaven and hell are real, and we all need jesus, and if we dont get jesus now before we die we are screwed. and when you think about time and reality, our life, is puny....

life is nothing. if infinity or the rest of reality besides our life on eart is controlled by human like god being jehova, then we really might have to do what he wants right?

we have no choice


that is precisely what hardcore christians are saying.

the implications are staggering.


what do you guys think

It is good that you are thinking about the greatness of God and the decisions we make in life.

There is one truth and one God, but in this current system it appears that there is a maze of beliefs to sort through.

I send prayers your way so that you might sort through this with God's guidance.

When I was a child I sought to learn all I could from the Bible. It is for this reason that I have assessed all the information in the Bible to be true, accurate and for our benefit. With this I trust God and His promises to me. I can find no fault in the scriptures and God, while I find so much error in mankind.

This is what built my Faith originally. Not just my desire not to die...but my love for what is good and righteous in the midst of a world that is unrighteous.

Prayers that you find this certainty in an uncertain world as well.

 

[deshadow]

Don't you enjoy the pleasures of life? Why is it so difficult to imagine that God receives and deserves pleasure too? He created us in His own image and did not alienate Himself completely from us, but became the flesh of man in Jesus and all things to us - treating us, those that love Him, as beloved. Those that hate Him must have a reason, and I can see lots of lies out there that come from the great deceiver who has his role to play in counter and contrast to God's light. His light will always and does as in nature, dispell the darkness of evil - eventually, forever. For now, it surely must provide contrast and revelation to the truth or ""all" things would not work together for good to those that love Him", as God's word says..
We understand the perfection of holiness because of His work in us through the divine nature receive from Jesus - His manifestation in the flesh to mankind and Savoir. As we submit ourselves in love to His hand, He does the work, but He does not violate the bond of love that never forces and cannot or love would only be a word with no meaning..
Check the links out about hell that are provided. The controversy lies with men about God's nature. He is love, and only expells that which is counter to it.

in nature there is no good and evil. there is a balance of forces. sometimes organized, sometimes chaotic. there arent even labels to call them chaotic and orgaized or balanced or even positive ad negative in nature. nature is. and it can be observed by us

in the bible, we are advised to not go by our instincts. going by our instincts is considered dark, or bad

in nature, things go by their instincts.

 

[deshadow]

It is good that you are thinking about the greatness of God and the decisions we make in life.

There is one truth and one God, but in this current system it appears that there is a maze of beliefs to sort through.

I send prayers your way so that you might sort through this with God's guidance.

When I was a child I sought to learn all I could from the Bible. It is for this reason that I have assessed all the information in the Bible to be true, accurate and for our benefit. With this I trust God and His promises to me. I can find no fault in the scriptures and God, while I find so much error in mankind.

This is what built my Faith originally. Not just my desire not to die...but my love for what is good and righteous in the midst of a world that is unrighteous.

Prayers that you find this certainty in an uncertain world as well.

many people find faults in man, not just christians. most "good people" want to be righteous.

so god in te bible wants this too? join the club jehova!

 

[deshadow]

You asked the question: "How do we know that He is worthy of worship?"

Answer: Just look at creation for crying outloud. Look at the sun, the moon, the stars, the planets, the birds, the sunsets.

that creator isnt necessarily the one in the bible. cant you see that? i never siad i was not in awe of creation.

christians always act like i am not ecstatic to be alive to experience all of this.

beleive me, i am. religious beleifs kind of get in the way if you ask me!

 

[deshadow]

have you read the whole bible?

have you read the whole New Testament?

you say the bible seems inconclusive, do you say this with hours of studying and seeking or just off the top of your head? I say this in sincerity.

if you are interested in a bible study about hell, I recommend http://www.amazingfacts.org/items/storacle_lessons.asp click watch on Cities of Ash. If you actually take the time to study the bible, this preaching will confirm what many others have seen from the bible about the hell teaching, God isn't torture loving and isn't going to do that, there is no justice in that

thee are great lessons! thanks. are these guys 7th day adventists?

 

[BelindaP]

Yep, pretty much.

 

[rocklife]

thee are great lessons! thanks. are these guys 7th day adventists?

I am glad they are helpful to you deshadow. Yes, they are 7th Day Adventists. I agree with many of their teachings for the most part. I personally interpret the Sabbath a little differently than they do though, But the hell teaching is and many others are well done and biblical. It is helpful to hear preachings, and we can e-mail any questions we have to this ministry, I also recommend continuing bible studying on our own too, we can see for ourselves, reading straight bible on our own too.