Am I better than a Buddhist?

[Byfaithalone1]

Do you think there's something "better" about being a Christian than a Buddhist?

No. Both sin. Both are in equal need of salvation.

As a side note, I also would not view Christians as being better than Buddhists.

With that said, I would suspect that you are asking me a deeper question as it relates to salvation. Is that accurate? If so, then I confirm my belief that it is only through the blood of Jesus Christ that a person is justified. All persons can enter into belief of Jesus Christ; Buddhists are not excluded. Christians have no monopoly on Jesus Christ.

In contrast, I note that the SDA denomination teaches that, at the end of time, the blood of Jesus Christ is not all that is required. The sabbath is also necessary. The continuing and authoritative source of truth is also fundamental. For this reason, the SDA view of non-SDAs differs considerably from my perspective on non-Christians.

BFA

 

[Avonia]

With that said, I would suspect that you are asking me a deeper question as it relates to salvation. Is that accurate?

Yes.

If so, then I confirm my belief that it is only through the blood of Jesus Christ that a person is justified. All persons can enter into belief of Jesus Christ; Buddhists are not excluded. Christians have no monopoly on Jesus Christ.

From a larger frame of reference, your mental models are nearly identical to that of most SDAs. The perceived differences that mean so much to you are accentuated because you are zoomed in so far.

That's OK. You are seeing a lot more than many who are drawing similar comparisons among their local church brothers and sisters. Same thing - smaller circle.

But you do have the option of zooming out. A lot.

If it makes you feel any better, from an even larger frame of reference, the mental models you and I hold are nearly indistinguishable.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

From a larger frame of reference, your mental models are nearly identical to that of most SDAs.

This may be true if the SDA denomination were able to accept the blood of Jesus Christ as the only means to salvation (both now and immediately prior to Christ's second coming). If that were true, then I would agree that my mental model is nearly identical to that put forward by the SDA denomination.

The way that I view Buddhists is quite different than the way that the SDA denomination views those who leave the fold due to disagreements regarding the fundamentals.

Since I've answered your question, would you answer two of mine?

Q1: Is Jesus' blood a necessary ingredient in salvation?

Q2: In what way does my position, as articulated in the original post in this thread, differ from yours? Please be specific.
​

BFA

 

[Avonia]

Since I've answered your question, would you answer two of mine?

Q1: Is Jesus' blood a necessary ingredient in salvation?

Q2: In what way does my position, as articulated in the original post in this thread, differ from yours? Please be specific.
​

BFA

I participate in the Christian community because I understand “Christ made the way.” The way is made whether you've heard of Jesus, or not.

But the “way" is exactly what the word implies—a journey. We've made it a destination only reachable by magical transport. So we are literally “stuck in place.”

Adventists are making the same mistake that other Christians are making—confusing the existence of the path with walking the path. Christ made the path. We walk the path.

The "way" Christ makes goes infinitely behind (devolution) and infinitely ahead (evolution). There is no end one way or the other. Presently we are stuck on the path staring up—but that's okay. We will start walking when we are ready.

 

[Joe67]

There is a "common salvation."

There is a "household of faith."

Joe

 

[Byfaithalone1]

I participate in the Christian community because I understand “Christ made the way.” The way is made whether you've heard of Jesus, or not.

But the “way" is exactly what the word implies—a journey. We've made it a destination only reachable by magical transport. So we are literally “stuck in place.”

Adventists are making the same mistake that other Christians are making—confusing the existence of the path with walking the path. Christ made the path. We walk the path.

The "way" Christ makes goes infinitely behind (devolution) and infinitely ahead (evolution). There is no end one way or the other. Presently we are stuck on the path staring up—but that's okay. We will start walking when we are ready.

This is fascinating, but really doesn't answer my question. Unless I've misunderstood you, I believe you've implied that my position differs from yours. I am trying to understand where we differ. So far, I just don't see the difference.

BFA

 

[Avonia]

I am trying to understand where we differ. So far, I just don't see the difference.
BFA

This is a great example of unity at the level of principle instead of the eventual separation that often happens with excessive reduction.

Let's just leave it at "common ground" for now!

 

[MLEN]

"For we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God."

"There is none righteous, no not one."

 

[Byfaithalone1]

"For we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God."

"There is none righteous, no not one."

Indeed.

This should be compelling information to any Christian tempted to look down on a Buddhist.

And it should be compelling information to any SDA still clinging to his remnant theology.

BFA

 

[StormyOne]

I participate in the Christian community because I understand “Christ made the way.” The way is made whether you've heard of Jesus, or not.

But the “way" is exactly what the word implies—a journey. We've made it a destination only reachable by magical transport. So we are literally “stuck in place.”

Adventists are making the same mistake that other Christians are making—confusing the existence of the path with walking the path. Christ made the path. We walk the path.

The "way" Christ makes goes infinitely behind (devolution) and infinitely ahead (evolution). There is no end one way or the other. Presently we are stuck on the path staring up—but that's okay. We will start walking when we are ready.

which might be part of the problem... is it possible to be ready but not realize that indeed you are ready..... I am thinking of the exercises taught to the Karate Kid when he wanted to learn martial arts.... wax on.... wax off...

 

[Avonia]

which might be part of the problem... is it possible to be ready but not realize that indeed you are ready

That's well said. We are outsourcing our readiness.

 

[Joe67]

Those who are "IN" Christ Jesus are given to know when they pass from death unto life.

This "passing" is being buried with Jesus by baptism into the likeness of his death and being raised with him in the likeness of his resurrection.

Joe

 

[StormyOne]

Those who are "IN" Christ Jesus are given to know when they pass from death unto life.

This "passing" is being buried with Jesus by baptism into the likeness of his death and being raised with him in the likeness of his resurrection.

Joe

speculative... what does that look like? Other than self-report how would you know one is in Christ and has passed from death to life?

 

[Joe67]

speculative... what does that look like? Other than self-report how would you know one is in Christ and has passed from death to life?

SO,

The two witnesses tell what it looks like. Witnesses are not proofs. Witnesses speak to us concerning experience.

John 5:24
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. KJV

1 John 3:14
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. KJV


A double-edged sword. Face answering face in the water.

The one who experiences these two witnesses know that it is true.

Joe

 

[StormyOne]

SO,

The two witnesses tell what it looks like. Witnesses are not proofs. Witnesses speak to us concerning experience.

John 5:24
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. KJV

1 John 3:14
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. KJV


A double-edged sword. Face answering face in the water.

The one who experiences these two witnesses know that it is true.

Joe

not sure what you are saying Joe.... are you suggesting that John is quoting the words of Jesus? How do we know that to be the case, or is it an accepted assumption? Who has experienced the "two witnesses" and can share what that encounter was like?

 

[Joe67]

not sure what you are saying Joe.... are you suggesting that John is quoting the words of Jesus? How do we know that to be the case, or is it an accepted assumption? Who has experienced the "two witnesses" and can share what that encounter was like?

SO,

I was reading on the other thread your discussion with JM. You and JM were discussing assumptions. You also mentioned your 2 decades of work in the field of mental health. What you said concerning the Bible and assumptions and also your field of labor does shed some light upon the gulf that exists between us concerning the literature we each value and the point of reference that orientates from the authority of our labor.

I graduated from PUC with a BA in social studies and enough religion classes to be hired by a conference for the ministry and was sent to the seminary at Andrews U. This was in 1964. As you can see there also is an age gap between us. This accounts for a great difference in informational exposure. Dogmatics was giving way to Criticism as a way of study at both PUC and Andrews. PUC was a conservative liveral arts school at that time, but changed from the time I began until the time of graduation.

I spent 3 months at Andrews and resigned from the appointment. I did not continue in the conference ministry or conference work. I did become involved in various independent ministries. Though being raised on a dairy, eventually carpentry became my main field of labor. I appreciated it, especially through the application of the Pythagoras principle; which is a statement of certainty. The only number by which the Pythagorean works is 2. It is the same as Jesus' statement that the only way to the Father is through the Son. Both are very specific and certain and exclusive in their foundational statement. Application is very inclusive and builds a house with rooms for many. Continuity is dependent upon remaining on the foundation.

Carpentry, as applied, has very little allowance for communications stated as: suggestion, maybe, possibly, probably and other forms of non-specific communication. When those type of communications occur, often people are injured or killed, and usually it is the person receiving the uncertain message. Carpentry, as applied, is very direct and specific; just as on the dairy.

What is being said is: First, truth is dogmatic, even as Avonia wrote on another thread that the law IS. I AM that I AM, is the Foundation upon which the house is built. Second, the building of the House bears fruit in the Reward. He IS and He IS a Rewarder.

Jesus' words are the Foundation of the house. John's words are the building of the House, yet on the Foundation. Two halves of a whole. The Father sent Jesus to lay the Foundation. Jesus sent his apostles to build the House on the Foundation.

There is no suggestion. There is no assumption. Only he who has the white stone with the new name can know it. All we are given to do is to be Jesus' witnesses concerning his resurrection and his ministry of reconciliation through his blood.

Legalism/dogmatics stumble at this. Philosophy considers it speculative foolishness. Nonetheless it is the power of God to the legalist and the wisdom of God to the philosopher and scribe.

Joe

 

[StormyOne]

Thanks Joe for clarifying, I understand where you are coming from....