age of accountability

[Easystreet]

Where do infants go when they die?

Heaven or Hell

Just finished listening to Dr. Caner on his church history class on line.

He mentioned a situation where a person was speaking to seminary men and their wives. Dr. Caner mentioned the name only once, but I did not catch the name.

Sorry.

Anyway, this person told the audience that some babies are elect and some are not and are in hell, (Paraphrased).

According to Caner problems followed. He did not elaborate.

Personally, I am not surprised. I have heard of this over the years, on a number of occasions.

My position the correct positon : All conceptions that are still born, or die in birth are safe. All children anywhere and at anytime in all periods of time are safe. I don’t know the exact age at which each child enters accountability. I believe it is different. I believe a mentally retarded person is safe if their retardation keeps them from understanding the Gospel.


This topic will take on difference depending on your relationship to the on going lapsarian post - either for or against and even for those who are not lapsarian in one degree or the other.

Lapsarian = from Latin term “lapsus” meaning “failing” or “falling”. We use the term “Calvinism” today as a synonym of Lapsarianism mainly because most people have never heard of the term Lapsarianism.

Now for the Poll

I will use the term age of accountability for lack of a better word at this point for the sake of this poll. Please don lecture me or write a commentary by quoting endless dead peoples views, or living for that matter. If you have a view state it in your words - not others.

Time to Vote.

 

[mlqurgw]

First I challenge you to prove an age of accountability by Scriptures. Second the Scriptures are not clear concerning the everlasting state of infants that die. That doesn't mean that they go to Hell but only that we don't know for sure. My personal view is I don't know.
Third the poll is skewed and not honest. Of course that fits with all your other posts that deal with truth.

 

[RichardT]

God knows what he's doing. Can anyone find the verse about God being just, forgot where to find it..

 

[BBAS 64]

Good Day,

We have done this one before:

http://www.christianforums.com/t1365370&page=4

The age of accountability, is not based on scripture.

** Safe ???, now there is a man made doctrine if I ever saw one..... Tradition!

Peace to u,

Bill

 

[Easystreet]

First I challenge you to prove an age of accountability by Scriptures. Second the Scriptures are not clear concerning the everlasting state of infants that die. That doesn't mean that they go to Hell but only that we don't know for sure. My personal view is I don't know.
Third the poll is skewed and not honest. Of course that fits with all your other posts that deal with truth.

Answer the question to this Hypothetical illustration.

You have one child added to your family each year for 18 years.

On the 18 year all 18 die on the same day. Starting with the one year old to the 18 year old where do they go none having believed in Christ?

 

[Easystreet]

Illustration. You have a child. The child is mentally retarded. It is stuck in the mind of a 2 year old. It dies at age 40. Where is this person gong (1) hell or (2) heaven?

 

[Erinwilcox]

I'm not voting.

BUT

#1. I think that we would all agree that we need to evangelize our children, regardless of any "accountable" age.

#2. If we are doing our duty in evangelizing them, then can't we trust God to know what is best?


Let me give you an illustration:

When your child is born, you are given a glimpse into the future of your childs life and you see that he is definitely not a believer, goes out partying, drives drunk, gets into an accident and is killed instantly. So if there's an age of accountability, what do you do (1) not watch the child closely in the hopes that it might roll off a table or something and die young so he'll go to heaven or (2) let the child grow up, die, and be damned? Seems to me that if you really loved the child, you'd let it die young so that he'd be in glory with God forever.

Just some thoughts here. . .I didn't vote because I don't like any of the choices there--they seem to be focused at a certain group.

 

[PETE_]

As already stated we cannot know with certainty

we do know God's character
we do know He will save all of His elect
we do know He will do what is best

 

[Sword-In-Hand]

People can say all that want that they don't know, but a study of Romans 7 should put speculation to doubt. You can't be punished for what you don't know. Other sciptures speak of this. I read it a few days ago, but can't remember where now.

Babies aren't hell bound because they aren't aware of sin. Since they are unaware, how can they repent from it?

A study of Psalms and Proverbs gives good insight on how much God treasures small children. I'm not sure I believe in age of accountability, because a child can understand grace at any age and I believe when they understand the need to repent, then they have reached that age. It could be at 5 or 10 or earlier or later.

 

[arunma]

Regardless of whether people believe that infants who die go to heaven, it's important to acknowledge that there is no such thing as the "age of accountability." I have no problem with the idea that infants who die are saved, but the specific doctrine of the age of accountability just isn't found in Scripture.

Furthermore, it would not be a good idea to quote Scripture which declares that God is just, because we then need to determine what what qualifies as justice (that is, by human standards rather than God's). It is somewhat arbitrary to say that infants are free of sin. Indeed Saint Augustine argued that infants are not free of sin, so this shows that the issue is at least up for debate. If we go down the emotional and logic-free path of "how could you believe that an innocent infant will go to hell!?" then one could make similar arguments for other good people like Mohandas Gandhi, Ben Franklin, and all other righteous non-Christians from the pages of history.

 

[RichardT]

we do know He will save all of His elect

lol, you're funny

 

[mlqurgw]

Answer the question to this Hypothetical illustration.

You have one child added to your family each year for 18 years.

On the 18 year all 18 die on the same day. Starting with the one year old to the 18 year old where do they go none having believed in Christ?

I will answer your question whenever you meet one of my challenges. I have given you at least three that you have failed to meet as yet. Also you should know by now that I do not deal in hypotheticals I deal with truth.

 

[HypoTypoSis]

Poll Options

age of accountability​

• people regardless of age who never reach the “age of accountability” are safe
• only those elected to believe regardless of age or condition are the only ones safe or saved
• Neither of the above

 

[mlqurgw]

People can say all that want that they don't know, but a study of Romans 7 should put speculation to doubt. You can't be punished for what you don't know. Other sciptures speak of this. I read it a few days ago, but can't remember where now.

Babies aren't hell bound because they aren't aware of sin. Since they are unaware, how can they repent from it?

A study of Psalms and Proverbs gives good insight on how much God treasures small children. I'm not sure I believe in age of accountability, because a child can understand grace at any age and I believe when they understand the need to repent, then they have reached that age. It could be at 5 or 10 or earlier or later.

Where do you get that from Rom. 7? Rom. 5:12-14 tells us that men die because of Adams sin. Adam was the federal head and representstive of all his seed the same as Christ is the federal head and representative of all His seed. Verse 14 is speaking of children who die. They die because of Adams sin.

 

[HypoTypoSis]

Originally Posted by Sword-In-Hand
You can't be punished for what you don't know.

Then those that never heard of Jesus have nothing to worry about and Christianity is not the exclusive club we--and the world--make it out to be. So, why should anyone worry?

 

[JPPT1974]

Christianity is for everybody as long
As they accept Christ as their Savior
And Lord and repent of their sins.

 

[Easystreet]

Christianity is for everybody as long
As they accept Christ as their Savior
And Lord and repent of their sins.

your child dies at age one - where is your baby going? hell or heaven

 

[Sword-In-Hand]

Where do you get that from Rom. 7? Rom. 5:12-14 tells us that men die because of Adams sin. Adam was the federal head and representstive of all his seed the same as Christ is the federal head and representative of all His seed. Verse 14 is speaking of children who die. They die because of Adams sin.

7What then shall we say? That the law is sin? By no means! Yet if it had not been for the law, I would not have known sin.

I don't know, but to me, that is ABC-123 simplicity. Babies aren't aware of the law, and thus can't know sin. On this issue, sometimes "predestinators" make God sound like the most heartless, robotic, static thing imaginable. I get a picture of Maximilian in my head.

Indeed Saint Augustine argued that infants are not free of sin, so this shows that the issue is at least up for debate.

Well if Augustine said it, it has to be right. Just razzing you my friend, but on this issue, I'm gonna side with Franklin.

**insert gasps here**

 

[HypoTypoSis]

Death is the penalty of sin.
All die. Including babies.
Thus all are sinful.

 

[Pepperoni]

Then those that never heard of Jesus have nothing to worry about and Christianity is not the exclusive club we--and the world--make it out to be. So, why should anyone worry?

I have to agree with this. Why else would we be commanded to go out and spread the Gospel to bring the lost to Christ?