Adam and Eve..

akaDaScribe said:

According to the Bible, how did the first 5 books of the Bible come about?

Click to expand...

Many think Moses was the writer...? (under divine inspiration)

God Bless!

Neogaia777 said:

Many think Moses was the writer...? (under divine inspiration)

God Bless!

Click to expand...

I know the Bible says that the commandments and the laws were given to Moses by God. Is there any indication in the Bible that Moses wrote the majority of the first 5 books?

akaDaScribe said:

I know the Bible says that the commandments and the laws were given to Moses by God. Is there any indication in the Bible that Moses wrote the majority of the first 5 books?

Click to expand...

IDK for sure...? I just think it may be a general consensus among most bible scholars, where they got it from, I'm not sure...? You could always do some research...? Google something like "did Moses write", ect...?

God Bless!

Neogaia777 said:

IDK for sure...? I just think it may be a general consensus among most bible scholars, where they got it from, I'm not sure...? You could always do some research...? Google something like "did Moses write", ect...?

God Bless!

Click to expand...

Luke 11:51

45Then answered one of the lawyers, and said unto him, Master, thus saying thou reproachest us also. 46And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers. 47Woe unto you! for ye build the sepulchres of the prophets, and your fathers killed them. 48Truly ye bear witness that ye allow the deeds of your fathers: for they indeed killed them, and ye build their sepulchres. 49Therefore also said the wisdom of God, I will send them prophets and apostles, and some of them they shall slay and persecute: 50That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this generation; 51From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, which perished between the altar and the temple: verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation. 52Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.


Matthew 19

3The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 4And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. 7They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.


John 5

45Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 47But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Jesus seems to believe that he did. He also seems to believe in Able along with Adam and Eve.

I'm not saying people have to believe Jesus was right. But if you think he's wrong...

Neogaia777 said:

Depends, Some say the supernatural is just a higher form of, or comes from a higher form of, higher natural... But the steps in coming to accept something like, or that are from, accepting Jesus as a real historical figure, to things like "this", I do not know...?

God Bless!

Click to expand...

Tell me, Neogaia..... how much does it matter to you:

1/ what "some say"
and
2/ the Word of God says?

See, that is the thing... "In the beginning was the "word" ( watch this now ) and the "word" (that's twice now) was with God, and the "word" (third time) WAS God.

This verse is about the "word". Not only was it there in the beginning.. but it was with God and WAS God..

Do you know what this "word" was? It was none other than Jesus. Jesus is the "word" become flesh.
Jesus created everything... was the living word became flesh, as Jesus Christ.

And yet.... Christians, by definition those who believe on the Name of Christ.... will put what mere men say above and beyond what the creator of the universe says. They proclaim to have faith in Christ.. but this so called faith is only in the fact that He is their Messiah... and it stops there...
I, again, will say.. that dollars to donuts... if the salvation of their souls did not depend on the death, burial and resurrection of Christ... they would dismiss that too... all of it would just be a nice little collection of allegorical stories and yarns about things that can teach us to be good.

just sad....

Neogaia777 said:

Yet it is real... and we must fit that into our logic also... The miracles, and miraculous or "supernatural" miracles, signs, and wonders were real (and that happens somewhere in the middle) anyway, it's real...

God Bless!

Click to expand...

Oh, don't worry.. I know it's real... all of it... right from "the earth was without form, and void"... past "and he became a living soul" through " and God sealed up the ark"... to "and the angel told Lot and his family that they must not look back".. on to "Jesus said Get up and Walk".... right until the end...

All of it.. every stroke of the pen on parchment..

Did you know that there is more original parchments and scriptural documents for the books of the bible.. than any other blithering of mere mortal men and their great works.? Yep, not Plato, Socrates or any of the great philosophers great works have as many proofs of their original blithering...
Not only that, but from the time that the events of the bible happened to the time they were recorded is very short to the many 100's of years from the babbling of Socrates to the time someone actually wrote it down..

Yet we argue as to the authenticity of the words of our God and hold the nonsense and words of fools to be solid truth....

akaDaScribe said:

According to the Bible, how did the first 5 books of the Bible come about?

Click to expand...

It is unclear, from what I understand. Many believe that Moses wrote it. Not only that but much of it was dictated to Moses by the pre flesh Jesus, or God, if you will.

JacksBratt said:

Tell me, Neogaia..... how much does it matter to you:

1/ what "some say"
and
2/ the Word of God says?

See, that is the thing... "In the beginning was the "word" ( watch this now ) and the "word" (that's twice now) was with God, and the "word" (third time) WAS God.

This verse is about the "word". Not only was it there in the beginning.. but it was with God and WAS God..

Do you know what this "word" was? It was none other than Jesus. Jesus is the "word" become flesh.
Jesus created everything... was the living word became flesh, as Jesus Christ.

And yet.... Christians, by definition those who believe on the Name of Christ.... will put what mere men say above and beyond what the creator of the universe says. They proclaim to have faith in Christ.. but this so called faith is only in the fact that He is their Messiah... and it stops there...
I, again, will say.. that dollars to donuts... if the salvation of their souls did not depend on the death, burial and resurrection of Christ... they would dismiss that too... all of it would just be a nice little collection of allegorical stories and yarns about things that can teach us to be good.

just sad....

Click to expand...

John 1:3, and John 1:4-5 also...

Colossians 1:15-16, Colossians 1:15-23...

God Bless!

Sorry if I seem heated. It's just that, recently, I found out that the church, as a collective group, was straying from the literal interpretation of the Holy Scriptures. So, when I see evidence of it.. I try to explain that if you don't believe part of it... how can you believe the part that saves you?


You cannot cherry pick what you want to believe and what you want to toss out as a tale or yarn....

Let God be true and every man a liar.... The Bible is God's word. It is breathed by God into the hands of men who put it to paper. It is true.. all of it.

Many men of "education" will try to condemn it, deny it, explain it away with their so called "wisdom".... but God said that He will make these self proclaimed wise men to be fools.

It is Satan's plan to confuse and deceive people into believing that God doesn't exist and that he doesn't exist and all of this glorious universe just happened.....

So far.. he is succeeding.

Neogaia777 said:

John 1:3, and John 1:4-5 also...

Colossians 1:15-16, Colossians 1:15-23...

God Bless!

Click to expand...

Thank you and God Bless you too...

But you didn't answer my question... do you believe in what "some say" or in what God says?

JacksBratt said:

Oh, don't worry.. I know it's real... all of it... right from "the earth was without form, and void"... past "and he became a living soul" through " and God sealed up the ark"... to "and the angel told Lot and his family that they must not look back".. on to "Jesus said Get up and Walk".... right until the end...

All of it.. every stroke of the pen on parchment..

Did you know that there is more original parchments and scriptural documents for the books of the bible.. than any other blithering of mere mortal men and their great works.? Yep, not Plato, Socrates or any of the great philosophers great works have as many proofs of their original blithering...
Not only that, but from the time that the events of the bible happened to the time they were recorded is very short to the many 100's of years from the babbling of Socrates to the time someone actually wrote it down..

Yet we argue as to the authenticity of the words of our God and hold the nonsense and words of fools to be solid truth....

Click to expand...

I know, right, I heard it something comparable to as many as thousands of copies or parchments, compared just a few from others, yet they are more authentic, OK...?

1,000 for every one of theirs I meant...

God Bless!

JacksBratt said:

Thank you and God Bless you too...

But you didn't answer my question... do you believe in what "some say" or in what God says?

Click to expand...

I try to, try to, make a distinct difference between what God says and what "some say", or others say, and if I ever lose sight of that, I know where I need to go and be for while (in his presence), and not lose sight of that fact...

God Bless!

Neogaia777 said:

I try to, try to, make a distinct difference between what God says and what "some say", or others say, and if I ever lose sight of that, I know where I need to go and be for while (in his presence), and not lose sight of that fact...

God Bless!

Click to expand...

It happens. Sometimes I get punch drunk on these forums.
I was asking about Moses, saw one scripture, and a flood of others came back to me. It's so easy for compromise to set in. It's so easy to let what we already know become obscured. Can only do this place in doses lol

Neogaia777 said:

I know, right, I heard it something comparable to as many as thousands of copies or parchments, compared just a few from others, yet they are more authentic, OK...?

1,000 for every one of theirs I meant...

God Bless!

Click to expand...

And their are little to no errors or discrepancies in any of the copies or parchments, the thousands we have to their one or a few... What if theirs had errors...? (Some of theirs I think do, yet many ignore that) ours doesn't however, and that says, or should say something...

Chrétien de Troyes said:

Adam means "earth" and Eve means "sense-perception". The text is definitely an allegory. These are not anthropogenic but symbolic names. The earth has always been the symbol of sin.

St Paul said that it is through a man (Adam) that sin entered the world.
Which means: it is through the earth (Adam) that sin entered the world.

Sin is in the earthly world and bliss in the heavenly world.

Click to expand...

Adamah means earth. Adam means man, but it’s in reference of being formed from the earth (adamah)

Chawwah means life. Eve (chava) means mother or giver of life. Eve was not named til after they were kicked out of the garden, btw. Which makes sense because before then she had no kids. The names in the Old Testament are usually in tune with the character or purpose of the people.

It’s not allegory at all.

salt-n-light said:

Adamah means earth. Adam means man, but it’s in reference of being formed from the earth (adamah)

Chawwah means life. Eve (chava) means mother or giver of life. Eve was not named til after they were kicked out of the garden, btw. Which makes sense because before then she had no kids. The names in the Old Testament are usually in tune with the character or purpose of the people.

It’s not allegory at all.

Click to expand...

Semitic languages have the particularity of having several definitions for a word and the ability to produce figures of interesting styles.

Tutorman said:

You said sin came through the earth, God created the earth. You are saying God created sin.,

Click to expand...

No, that doesn’t follow. God brought the physical world into order, and mankind into being, with everything that entails - everything in the physical that temps us to sin. That is not the same as saying that God created sin. God gave us the potential to sin.

Tutorman said:

Were Adam and Eve real or is it all a lie and myth.

Let's talk about that.

Click to expand...

Genesis is a tricky book. Pre-abraham you get a lot of myth-like accounts where Abraham and after although there is the supernatural it is less myth-like and with far more detail.

Why is this so? I suspect it is related to the 400 years that pass before Moses comes into the picture. The Israelites were an oral culture and so accounts would be passed down from households. But before Moses there was no leader, no temple, no priest just the accounts passed down from generation to generation.

But still why such a difference in the accounts? Abrahamic accounts are intimate and unique to the Hebrews so they cherished and preserved their details. Accounts like creation, the flood and other early accounts we read would have wide overlap with other cultures so it makes sense that either they knew little about them or they appear myth-like because they had a much higher chance of being influenced by more dominating and advanced cultures (that did have temples, priests and leaders). Not to mention the amount of time that separates them... creation to Moses is something like 2500 years.

To me these early Genesis accounts like creation are examples of these influenced myth-like accounts that have been pulled in and redeemed to point to God and give him glory. To read it and say it is a lie misses the point, it is not a lie as God is glorified and how could that be the wrong focus? But it may also not be a literal account and characters like Adam and Eve may not have existed as is explained in Genesis. But this doesn't matter and if you think it does you don't understand how ancient Eastern cultures valued these things.

Genesis is not a science book, it is a book that gives God all the glory but we need to interpret each account with all the information we know which leaves groups of accounts that should be read and interpreted differently.

There is overwhelming evidence that Adam and Eve is true. All of science and all of history can verify how true the story is. There is nothing anywhere to show that the story is not true. Skeptics and scoffers may not understand, but their lack of understanding has no impact on how accurate and true the Bible is. Even we are told: Romans 1:28, "God gave them up unto a reprobate mind"