To all of you religious people who think that god is the best, and would forgive him. I have a question. Say god is this great pure being, and does no evil... Why would he send people who are misguided into not believing in him to be tortured for all eternity? You would forgive him? "Because he created us!" is not a good reason. Say you gave birth to a child, and tortured it all of it's life, would you expect it to forgive you because "you created it!"? I find all of the "facts" on here to be false. Why would you trust a book from 600 AD or multiple long documents from the past 100 years with lots of proof? Of course a sensible person would choose the new, proven research
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
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- Thread starter Ryan Schrock
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You allow yourself to believe certain things that aren't true. There are those Christians who believe you will burn in hell forever if you don't do this or don't do that. That isn't the way it works, though. When you sin, you are disciplined and then forgiven. Read Ezekiel 33:17-20.
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There is one thing the Lord can do that science can't do: The Lord can give us peace of mind.
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PeaceJoyLove
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Ask God to reveal Himself to you. He will...
In the beginning, when God saw all that He created, He declared it very good. A deep slumber and change of eyesight (after "the fall") has everything to do with how each perceives...the mind of man cannot understand the things of the spirit. When man tries to fit God into a box (while HE is infinite and immeasurable), that is not God revealing Himself, but an image created in the mind of man...and we end up with many denominations, doctrines and dogma.
And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden...
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall not eat..." The woman prepared the feast that Adam ate...she reasoned with the serpent, perceiving she lacked something and desired it...so begins the journey of our soul, eating the wrong fruit, perceiving lack...what God has declared very good.
Jesus said the kingdom is within us. Paul said God called him from the womb and "by grace was pleased to reveal His Son in me "...just as the son is being revealed in you/me/us...each is somewhere in the process taking place within...some still in deep slumber...some wide awake/single of eye.
In the beginning, when God saw all that He created, He declared it very good. A deep slumber and change of eyesight (after "the fall") has everything to do with how each perceives...the mind of man cannot understand the things of the spirit. When man tries to fit God into a box (while HE is infinite and immeasurable), that is not God revealing Himself, but an image created in the mind of man...and we end up with many denominations, doctrines and dogma.
And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden...
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall not eat..." The woman prepared the feast that Adam ate...she reasoned with the serpent, perceiving she lacked something and desired it...so begins the journey of our soul, eating the wrong fruit, perceiving lack...what God has declared very good.
Jesus said the kingdom is within us. Paul said God called him from the womb and "by grace was pleased to reveal His Son in me "...just as the son is being revealed in you/me/us...each is somewhere in the process taking place within...some still in deep slumber...some wide awake/single of eye.
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I don't think he was paying attention to me. Maybe he'll pay attention to you.
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How can god reveal himself if he is just an entity made by the needy who need some fake being to cling to?
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I've shown you the way. I'd suggest you buy a Bible and start reading it.
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Where did you get the idea that "eternal death" means eternal life in torment?
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The god of this world has blinded the minds of those who don't believe so that they do not understand the gospel of Christ. They cannot perceive the reality of God because their spirit is dead and it is in the spirit that we perceive the reality of God and know that He is really there and is not silent. The person who comes successfully to God must believe that he really does exist and that He rewards those who sincerely seek Him. He said that if people seek Him with all their heart, they will find Him.
The fact that some do not find God in their frame of reference and their personal reality is that there is something within them that is in enmity with God. There is a principle within them that wants to resist even the idea of God. Therefore they have no knowledge that they are blind to anything pertaining to God and if they were not, they would hate Him and rebel against Him. There is a principle within them that causes them to be that way.
It is very interesting that many people like that are heavily involved in the occult. If you take the reality of God away from a person, there is still a hunger for the supernatural and so they turn to the occult and spiritism to fill the empty gap in their hearts and lies. Many will believe in UFOs because there is a seeking for the possibility that there is a greater intelligence out there in the universe that may come and visit us and make our planet and lives better than what it is right now.
Many atheists will enjoy movies like Star Wars and Star Trek, because there is an inner hunger for something more than what they are experiencing in the here and now. They enjoy Batman, Superman, Spider Man and other super heroes, because they have an inner desire for a messianic figure to rescue them from their pointless and meaningless lives.
Deep down, they fear death, because for them it is oblivion, and there is something within every human being that makes the thought of oblivion unthinkable and unimaginable. Many feel that they are square pegs in a round hole living in this world, and they feel out of place and uneasy. They have an inner desire for something more than what life has to offer them, but they don't want to believe that there is a God who could offer them that, so they challenge Christian people in the hope that they can conclusively prove what they actually believe, that there is no God, no hope, no future, absolutely nothing for them after death.
Doctors observing atheists on the death beds have noticed that many struggle and fight death as if they desperately don't want to die and so they try to hang on to every second of life they have left. While observing Christians, they notice a deep sense of peace and as readiness to go out into eternity because those ones seem to know where they are going and are looking forward to it. This is not fiction. These come from actual clinical reports.
So there it is. The Apostle Paul said at the end of 1 Corinthians 14, "If a man wants to remain ignorant, let him be ignorant." This may mean that he is saying, "Leave them alone, because that's the way they want to be, so let's move on and enjoy the company of those who have a different attitude to life."
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