A Trump Rally Speaker Trashed Puerto Ricans. Harris reached out to them.

stevevw said:

This is what I find strange about this idea that its about insulting American citizens that the Left want to charge the Right with.

What they don't seem to understand and even see is that when they dismiss Trump supporters as Nazi followers, Deplarables and stupid for supporting TRump they are actually insulting them. They are calling them the very things they say about Trump.

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I understand and I agree with what you're saying.
It is important to note, that definitely NOT all Trump supporters should and could be characterized that way. The issue is that, there are quite a few people who do deserve that label.
The left would do better in being more pointed in their critique. And the right would benefit from not circling the wagons and just saying "Yeah. That was kinda awful" instead of mental gymnastics to justify some pretty misanthropic behaviour.

...

Larniavc said:

Mr Trump letting these guys say what they said is truly baffling.

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can I point out that Trump wasnt even there for most of the speakers...

hislegacy said:

Yes the insult comic. Insulted PR

Shame on him.

Campaign already admitted they did not properly vet him. Shame on them.

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They vetted him enough to remove the c-word reference to Harris. His spiel was submitted ahead of time so it could go up on the teleprompter, I read..

DaisyDay said:

They vetted him enough to remove the c-word reference to Harris. His spiel was submitted ahead of time so it could go up on the teleprompter, I read..

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I believe the watermelon joke was ad libbed. I'm skeptical the Puerto Rico joke was. I say that solely based on the ways in which the jokes were delivered.

iluvatar5150 said:

That was the answer I was going to give to @Hazelelponi - that it’s generally considered more acceptable to make these sorts of jokes when the speaker and the audience are both from the group at the butt of the joke, which was the case with Lopez. I’m not going to say that I’d advise making a joke like that, but a Mexican making a joke like that in Phoenix, where a sizable percentage of the crowd is likely of Mexican descent, is likely to be about the most okay context for it.

OTOH, Hinchcliffe is not Puerto Rican, nor, presumably, was much of his audience.


Huh? The “woke left” laughed at Lopez’ joke but not Hinchcliffe’s, meaning that we DO understand the difference.

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Honestly, that's silly.

I don't have to be a Mexican to tell certain jokes. Things are either funny - regardless of race - or they aren't.

If they aren't funny said by a white guy then they aren't funny said by anyone.

That's just honest. We are all Americans and as such one nation and one people.

As this one people, race shouldn't make a joke either funny or insulting. We are all raised in the same culture. If a white guy thinks Lopez is funny he should be able to tell the same joke. If he cannot - the joke was never funny...

White people, black people, brown people, we are one people here. A white person is going to be watching Dave Chapelle and George Lopez and and and..

But then you demand white people not laugh at the jokes everyone else laughs at? Really?

You don't think if you tell people from birth something is funny they are going to eventually believe it?

Then why punish them for telling the same jokes, or the same type of jokes?

It's abuse what the left does to whites.

Hazelelponi said:

Honestly, that's silly.

I don't have to be a Mexican to tell certain jokes. Things are either funny - regardless of race - or they aren't.

If they aren't funny said by a white guy then they aren't funny said by anyone.

That's just honest. We are all Americans and as such one nation and one people.

As this one people, race shouldn't make a joke either funny or insulting. We are all raised in the same culture. If a white guy thinks Lopez is funny he should be able to tell the same joke. If he cannot - the joke was never funny...

White people, black people, brown people, we are one people here. A white person is going to be watching Dave Chapelle and George Lopez and and and..

But then you demand white people not laugh at the jokes everyone else laughs at? Really?

You don't think if you tell people from birth something is funny they are going to eventually believe it?

Then why punish them for telling the same jokes, or the same type of jokes?

It's abuse what the left does to whites.

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Do you joke around with family members? Do you tease each other? Do your kids wrestle with their cousins?

Now, what would happen if some stranger started busting your chops the same way your siblings do? What would happen if a stranger came up and started wrestling or tickling one of your kids?

You'd interpret it entirely differently, wouldn't you? Comedy works the same way. Jokes made about a group, by and to people within group are perceived differently than jokes made among outsiders. You could argue about whether or not they're still "funny", but the question here is not whether Hinchcliffe's jokes were funny (most of them weren't, but that's a separate issues); the question is whether they were offensive.

The Trump campaign obviously wants to distance itself from this blunder and pass it off as a one off from some random comic nobody vetted before going on stage but let’s not forget Trump himself is the one who at the debate voluntarily brought up the hateful and ignorant lie about Haitians eating people’s cats and dogs. Trump himself is one who’s insulted Puerto Rico in the past during his presidency. This isn’t just a one off thing and it’s not just some comic telling a joke that didn’t land. Hate and division and racism and ignorance have been consistent themes with this man and his presidency.

iluvatar5150 said:

Do you joke around with family members? Do you tease each other? Do your kids wrestle with their cousins?

Now, what would happen if some stranger started busting your chops the same way your siblings do? What would happen if a stranger came up and started wrestling or tickling one of your kids?

You'd interpret it entirely differently, wouldn't you? Comedy works the same way. Jokes made about a group, by and to people within group are perceived differently than jokes made among outsiders. You could argue about whether or not they're still "funny", but the question here is not whether Hinchcliffe's jokes were funny (most of them weren't, but that's a separate issues); the question is whether they were offensive.

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I called the men in my house worthless yesterday because on my son's first day of vacation I wanted him to run an errand for me and he wanted to do nothing on his first day of vacation.

When I went then to my husband with the same request he decided he was on vacation too ..

So I called them both worthless.. it was in jest the whole family was there, everyone was laughing...

It was funny - it would have been funny had a black comedian gotten his hands on it, or a Latino or or or - because it was funny.

Start talking about Arabs and white people and it wouldn't be funny. But talk about husband's, wives and sons? Totally hilarious.

iluvatar5150 said:

I believe the watermelon joke was ad libbed. I'm skeptical the Puerto Rico joke was. I say that solely based on the ways in which the jokes were delivered.

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What was the watermelon joke? I missed that one.

Hazelelponi said:

As this one people, race shouldn't make a joke either funny or insulting. We are all raised in the same culture. If a white guy thinks Lopez is funny he should be able to tell the same joke. If he cannot - the joke was never funny...

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If an American made a joke, that it was somehow cute or clever to steal from Mexico or Mexicans the entire illiberal world would be screaming.
However Lopez made that joke.
And you are right. It would not be funny if an American made a joke about stealing from Mexicans (ain't they cute?")

Meanwhile back to the topic: Harris tosses off laundry lists of what wonderful things she is going to do for whoever needs a promise that day but meanwhile she is bulling her way to the nearest beer.

The only thing some Americans seem to care about is sex, money and drugs.
When abortion is a top issue in a country that is a target of dangerous world alliances, has an inflation rate of 25% and doesn't have the energy to power its current technology, the fact that abortion is a top issue likely means there is hell to pay right on down the road.

QvQ said:

If an American made a joke, that it was somehow cute or clever to steal from Mexico or Mexicans the entire illiberal world would be screaming.
However Lopez made that joke.
And you are right. It would not be funny if an American made a joke about stealing from Mexicans (ain't they cute?")

Meanwhile back to the topic: Harris tosses off laundry lists of what wonderful things she is going to do for whoever needs a promise that day but meanwhile she is bulling her way to the nearest beer.

The only thing some Americans seem to care about is sex, money and drugs.
When abortion is a top issue in a country that is a target of dangerous world alliances, has an inflation rate of 25% and doesn't have the energy to power its current technology, the fact that abortion is a top issue likely means there is hell to pay right on down the road.

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100% !!!

Hazelelponi said:

Honestly, that's silly.

I don't have to be a Mexican to tell certain jokes. Things are either funny - regardless of race - or they aren't.

If they aren't funny said by a white guy then they aren't funny said by anyone.

That's just honest. We are all Americans and as such one nation and one people.

As this one people, race shouldn't make a joke either funny or insulting. We are all raised in the same culture. If a white guy thinks Lopez is funny he should be able to tell the same joke. If he cannot - the joke was never funny...

White people, black people, brown people, we are one people here. A white person is going to be watching Dave Chapelle and George Lopez and and and..

But then you demand white people not laugh at the jokes everyone else laughs at? Really?

You don't think if you tell people from birth something is funny they are going to eventually believe it?

Then why punish them for telling the same jokes, or the same type of jokes?

It's abuse what the left does to whites.

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I used to work with a white woman that referred to her kids as "yard apes". Let her say that about black kids and the reaction would have been totally different, regardless of intent.

Its disingenuous to say certain comments don't hit differently depending upon the audience, subject and speaker.

Whether or not I think what he said is offensive, a large number of Puerto Ricans have taken offense. Trump can apologize OR have his surrogates continue to dismiss them and tell them all the reasons why they shouldn't be offended and how they need to learn how to take a joke. Let's see how bad he needs their votes.

DaisyDay said:

What was the watermelon joke? I missed that one.

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A black guy in the audience shouted something at Tony. Tony claimed to know him (I'm unclear as to whether he actually did or if that was just part of the joke) and said they carved watermelons together.

rambot said:

IS that true?

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It was something reasonably sourced I saw online, but it is certainly not verified. (It was a personal, though I think second hand, account.)

stevevw said:

Well then he should have learnt from that. Gee if a comedian tests his material and he doesn't get any laughs you would think they would join the dots. Afterall their business is to make people laugh.

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You'd think so.

stevevw said:

Nevertheless I don't think a political venue is a good place to tell such a joke.

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It certainly wasn't.

stevevw said:

But it also doesn't mean a person should not be able to tell such jokes in the right place.

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And apparently he has similar "jokes" in other venues prior. No one is trying to stop him.

Larniavc said:

....a light hearted micro benevolence said with a lot of love and kindness.

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Wow. Drinking that MAGA vodka!

stevevw said:

I don't think in any way the Trump rally intended such a hateful idea. It was something Hinchcliffe has done and he has misread the situation wanting to make an impression. But I don't think he would have meant it as meaning certain people are like garbage.

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It wasn't just Hinchcliffe. The Trump campaign had an objective....to energize their base.

And yes, I do wake up in the middle of night wondering how on earth did we get to his point?

The party of Lincoln and Reagan no longer exist....it's been replaced by an autocrate who thinks degrading groups of fellow Americans is an attribute.

camille70 said:

I used to work with a white woman that referred to her kids as "yard apes". Let her say that about black kids and the reaction would have been totally different, regardless of intent.

Its disingenuous to say certain comments don't hit differently depending upon the audience, subject and speaker.

Whether or not I think what he said is offensive, a large number of Puerto Ricans have taken offense. Trump can apologize OR have his surrogates continue to dismiss them and tell them all the reasons why they shouldn't be offended and how they need to learn how to take a joke. Let's see how bad he needs their votes.

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Hasn't the Trump organization already said they didn't properly vet the comedian?

I had thought something was already said... @hislegacy seemed to indicate so earlier.

But Trump can't apologize...

It was a comedian who is well known and supposed to be funny. He was hired (or invited) he won't be rehired. It's not like Trump said it.

Trump cannot apologize though. It's the one thing he can't do.

If people think a joke in poor taste by some random comedian is more important than the very real issues we all face together then that's on them, and a failing on their own part to have properly ordered priorities.

The PR joke

Hazelelponi said:

Hasn't the Trump organization already said they didn't properly vet the comedian?

I had thought something was already said... @hislegacy seemed to indicate so earlier.

But Trump can't apologize...

It was a comedian who is well known and supposed to be funny. He was hired, he won't be rehired. It's not like Trump said it.

Trump cannot apologize though. It's the one thing he can't do.

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They should have vetted the person who called Harris "evil" and "the antichrist". That sort of vile talk about a person ought to be off the table.

Given the amount of nastiness that "slipped through" vetting, I'm thinking its more likely they knew what they were getting.

durangodawood said:

The PR joke

They should have vetted the person who called Harris "evil" and "the antichrist". That sort of vile talk about a person ought to be off the table.

Given the amount of nastiness that "slipped through" vetting, I'm thinking its more likely they knew what they were getting.

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They should have vetted Kamala...

rambot said:

I understand and I agree with what you're saying.
It is important to note, that definitely NOT all Trump supporters should and could be characterized that way.

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I think the majority.

rambot said:

The issue is that, there are quite a few people who do deserve that label.

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I am not sure about that. I think much is a reaction to PC and Woke. But as with identity politics the extremes always make the loudest noise and don't represent the majority. There is a variety of positions within the spectrum.

I think as the extremes are well remembered and they dominate peoples thoughts. But also because politics has become so personal that words are taken as everything especially for the Left. The mere mention of certain words are taken as the whole person. Trump only has to mention something alone the lines of a off the cuff remark about Hitler and its taken immediate or rather turned into something personal about Trump, about the Right.

There is this ideological difference of the Right always being stereotyped as the facists and the Left as the Totalitarians or Communists. So when it becomes personal and politics becomes everything like its a matter of life or death the extremes come out. So its no so much that people are really being hateful, they truely believe that the other side is a danger.

Thats the state of where things are at and that is why theres been assassinations attempts. The climate is that sensitive that more people are going to the extremes on both sides. But I think this is primarily a reaction to PC and Woke that had been brewing and coming out in the past couple of decades. Thats not to say that the reaction from the right is good either. But I think at least in Trump being more open and inclusive of a variety of views its closer to the middle.

rambot said:

The left would do better in being more pointed in their critique. And the right would benefit from not circling the wagons and just saying "Yeah. That was kinda awful" instead of mental gymnastics to justify some pretty misanthropic behaviour.

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Yeah as with politics both sides can do with coming into the middle more. It use to be that way where both sides had many common beliefs and fundemental politics.

Thats why I think going back to the basics, the fundemental principles we built our nations on is important. They were not made foundational principles for nothing. They were wrought out of lived experience of making the same mistakes we are repeating today and have done in the past.

Like Human Rights being wrought our of world war and the horror of the Nazis. How humankind can hate so much. IT seems the further we move away from that the more we begin to forget.