A tough questions for a blind man...

[k4c]

Question: When was the seventh day blessed and called holy?
Blind man: The seventh day was blessed and called holy on the first day of creation.

Question: Which day is the seventh day Sabbath?
Blind man: The first day is the seventh day Sabbath.

Question: Which seventh day Sabbath is Jesus Lord of?
Blind man: Jesus is Lord of the first day seventh day Sabbath.

Question: Can you show me in the Bible where it says all this?
Blind man: Now that's a tought question....

 

[Cribstyl]

The reasons I think that the blind man is being asked to show anything or having to answer countless questions from the man who can see is; The man with eyes is either braindead or he is trying to mislead the blind man from the first chapters of the word of God.

If you read the first 5 chapters of the bible to the blind man, would he have a preconceived notion that man was given rest, when the texts say and prove that God rested because He was finished creating the worlds in 6days and rested on the seventh day?

If the bible spoke about what happened the day after God rested, we would know more about the following day, but the bible is silent because God had finished all His creation. The end, finished, complete, Hellooooo???

Why argue with a blind man that by God "blessing and sanctifying" the seventh day of creation, this means that man was commanded to rest weekly? The blind man has only heard you read about what God did; on the 1st day, 2nd day, 3rd day, 4th day, 5th day, 6th day, and seventh day (Gen 1-2:3).

The blind man knows that the following chapters should be where we find what God commands to man or humanity. Why should commentary get ahead of what is written? Who would confuse God's word to a blind man?

If the place of God rest from creation is His heavenly throne, could it be possible that God does invite people to enter His rest somewhere in history? Where did God rest, and does the first 5 chapters reveals that God dwelled among man?
Isa 66:1Thus saith the LORD, The heaven [is] my throne, and the earth [is] my footstool: where [is] the house that ye build unto me? and where [is] the place of my rest?

The blind man want to know;
Did God subjected Himself to earthly time or did He subject His creation to time?

If God's rest is in the realm of the spirit, how can we put 24hrs on His days and rest?

 

[k4c]

Cribstyl;The reasons I think that the blind man is being asked to show anything or having to answer countless questions from the man who can see is; The man with eyes is either braindead or he is trying to mislead the blind man from the first chapters of the word of God.

If you read the first 5 chapters of the bible to the blind man, would he have a preconceived notion that man was given rest, when the texts say and prove that God rested because He was finished creating the worlds in 6days and rested on the seventh day?

Before I begin I want to say that the blind guy is spirituallty blind, not physically blind. We know this because he missed the truth about which day the seventh day is. Either way, spiritaul blindness is just as real as physical blindness.

Now let me help you see.

You are focusing on the fact that God rested. This really has no bearing on the fact that the seventh day was different than all the other days.

Words have meaning and with meaning comes responsibility. God tells us that He sanctified the seventh day and only the seventh day. Now what does sanctify mean?

Sanctify:​

To set apart for sacred use; consecrate. To make holy; purify. To give social or moral sanction to. To make productive of holiness or spiritual blessing. ​

Not only did God sanctify the seventh day He blessed it and called it holy.

What does it mean when God calls somethng blessed?

Bless:​

To make or pronounce holy; to consecrate to make happy,blithesome,or joyous; to confer prosperity or happinessupon;tograntdivinefavorto.

How do you feel about God blessing Adam and Eve after they were created? Do you think they were special?

If the bible spoke about what happened the day after God rested, we would know more about the following day, but the bible is silent because God had finished all His creation. The end, finished, complete, Hellooooo???

Why argue with a blind man that by God "blessing and sanctifying" the seventh day of creation, this means that man was commanded to rest weekly? The blind man has only heard you read about what God did; on the 1st day, 2nd day, 3rd day, 4th day, 5th day, 6th day, and seventh day (Gen 1-2:3).

Resting is not what made the day special, the day is special because God blessed it and sanctifed it. Because of this He and we cease labor to honor the meaning of the day and what it represents. Do you have holidays off with pay where you work? Do you question why and refuse to honor the holiday by demanding that your boss make you work?

The blind man knows that the following chapters should be where we find what God commands to man or humanity. Why should commentary get ahead of what is written? Who would confuse God's word to a blind man?

Can you show me where it says we should honor a seven day weekly cycle today?

Can you show me where God tells Adam to marry Eve and stay married until death do them part?

Can you show me where God tells Eve not to eat of the tree?

Can you show me where God teaches Cain and Able what to do to worship God?

There is more evidence of the seventh day being blessed, set apart for God's use and sanctifed then there is of the above questions yet you have not problem with the about questions.

If the place of God rest from creation is His heavenly throne, could it be possible that God does invite people to enter His rest somewhere in history? Where did God rest, and does the first 5 chapters reveals that God dwelled among man?
Isa 66:1Thus saith the LORD, The heaven [is] my throne, and the earth [is] my footstool: where [is] the house that ye build unto me? and where [is] the place of my rest?

Six days we have for labor but the seventh is holy unto God, just like He created it. Now, if you want to rest in your recliner on the Sabbath like God is doing on His throne then by all means go for it.

The blind man want to know;
Did God subjected Himself to earthly time or did He subject His creation to time?

If God's rest is in the realm of the spirit, how can we put 24hrs on His days and rest?

God's creation is subject to time just because that's how God created creation.

 

[Cribstyl]

Before I begin I want to say that the blind guy is spirituallty blind, not physically blind. We know this because he missed the truth about which day the seventh day is. Either way, spiritaul blindness is just as real as physical blindness.

If you're not misrepresenting him you could have a point.

Now let me help you see.

Since I'm the blind guy, let the record show that you're misrepresenting me in each of those answers.

You are focusing on the fact that God rested. This really has no bearing on the fact that the seventh day was different than all the other days.

If you wanted to help.......
My question is; "What does the text say that Adam did on the seventh day of creation?
Your questions are tilted to ignor the context.
If I dont agree with you... I'm I going to Hell?

Words have meaning and with meaning comes responsibility. God tells us that He sanctified the seventh day and only the seventh day. Now what does sanctify mean?

Sanctify:​

To set apart for sacred use; consecrate. To make holy; purify. To give social or moral sanction to. To make productive of holiness or spiritual blessing. ​

Not only did God sanctify the seventh day He blessed it and called it holy.

What does it mean when God calls somethng blessed?

Bless:​

To make or pronounce holy; to consecrate to make happy,blithesome,or joyous; to confer prosperity or happinessupon;tograntdivinefavorto.

One of those definition applies to what God did because He was finished creating...Where does it apply to man?
And what if God bless and sanctified the heavens as His place to rest? Does that mean that blessing and sanctification is solely dependant on man having to do something without God commanding them to do it?

How do you feel about God blessing Adam and Eve after they were created? Do you think they were special?



Resting is not what made the day special, the day is special because God blessed it and sanctifed it. Because of this He and we cease labor to honor the meaning of the day and what it represents. Do you have holidays off with pay where you work? Do you question why and refuse to honor the holiday by demanding that your boss make you work?

First of all, God's word is true, when you post it I'll say AMEN. When you've gone off text, expect me to ask for clarifications.

Your saved and sanctified, law abiding bretheren wont see where you're calling me blind,they will insinuate that I'm the one attacking what SDA believes. With all that you've said above, you still have not reference where the word of God agrees with your commentary above.

Can you show me where it says we should honor a seven day weekly cycle today?

Can you show me where God tells Adam to marry Eve and stay married until death do them part?

Can you show me where God tells Eve not to eat of the tree?

Can you show me where God teaches Cain and Able what to do to worship God?

There is more evidence of the seventh day being blessed, set apart for God's use and sanctifed then there is of the above questions yet you have not problem with the about questions.

Spinning a web of questions dont mean that you've proven anything as truth. God's word is truth.

Six days we have for labor but the seventh is holy unto God, just like He created it. Now, if you want to rest in your recliner on the Sabbath like God is doing on His throne then by all means go for it.

No thanks, I like to hear SDA pastors preaching on Saturdays.

God's creation is subject to time just because that's how God created creation.

The question is; Does God work weekly and rests on Sabbath days? Show that God is not retired to His throne? Show us where God lives and is subjected to the sun?

 

[k4c]

Cribstyl;If you're not misrepresenting him you could have a point.

Since I'm the blind guy, let the record show that you're misrepresenting me in each of those answers.

Well, since you say you can see then it must be a hearing thing then...

If you wanted to help.......
My question is; "What does the text say that Adam did on the seventh day of creation?

I can't be sure but it seems to me that it says he ate and died, which changed everythng.

Your questions are tilted to ignor the context.
If I dont agree with you... I'm I going to Hell?

You don't have to agree with me but you have to agree with God and since I agree with God...you can do the math.

One of those definition applies to what God did because He was finished creating...Where does it apply to man?

If God tells you something is holy, sacred and blessed, you had better pay attention. Then if God tells you to remember to keep it holy and sacred you had better really pay attention. Keep in mind, when God says remember to keep it holy He is referring to something in the past that was already made holy.

And what if God bless and sanctified the heavens as His place to rest? Does that mean that blessing and sanctification is solely dependant on man having to do something without God commanding them to do it?

What if God said marriage is holy and blessed, does that have anything to do with man?

First of all, God's word is true, when you post it I'll say AMEN. When you've gone off text, expect me to ask for clarifications.

Sir yes sir...

Your saved and sanctified, law abiding bretheren wont see where you're calling me blind,they will insinuate that I'm the one attacking what SDA believes. With all that you've said above, you still have not reference where the word of God agrees with your commentary above.
Spinning a web of questions dont mean that you've proven anything as truth. God's word is truth.

I was making a point with my questions to show you that just because something is not said or done when you want it to be said or done does not mean it's not going to be said or done. God blessed the seventh day and called it holy at creation. Did Adam keep it holy? It doesn't say he did but it dosen't say he didn't. We also have to understand how Adam was banished from the garden and spiritually dead so would he have kept it as a dead man? Maybe, maybe not. But I can tell that God wants His people keeping it holy because He tells us to keep it holy, just as He created it. He also tells us how He made it holy and blessed it for mankind and last time I checked, Adam and Eve were the only mankind around when God created, blessed and sanctified it.

No thanks, I like to hear SDA pastors preaching on Saturdays.

The question is; Does God work weekly and rests on Sabbath days? Show that God is not retired to His throne? Show us where God lives and is subjected to the sun?

Tell me how much eggs cost in Mexico as opposed to Florida? The answer to my question, as well as, your above question has no bearing on anything.

 

[Cribstyl]

You are focusing on the fact that God rested. This really has no bearing on the fact that the seventh day was different than all the other days.

The question is; Does God work weekly and rests on Sabbath days? Show that God is not retired to His throne? Show us where God lives and is subjected to the sun?

Tell me how much eggs cost in Mexico as opposed to Florida? The answer to my question, as well as, your above question has no bearing on anything.

If we talking about Genesis 1-2:3 I'm focusing on what God's word about the seventh day, "God rested".

God's word say only what God did on days #1 through #7, but your words are saying what man should should do on days 8-forever.

Where does creation story reference the days following God's rest?
​

 

[k4c]

If we talking about Genesis 1-2:3 I'm focusing on what God's word about the seventh day, "God rested".

God's word say only what God did on days #1 through #7, but your words are saying what man should should do on days 8-forever.

Where does creation story reference the days following God's rest?
​

God called the seventh day holy at creation, even before sin. He tells His people to remember to keep it holy. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath and teaches us much on how to keep it holy. That might not be good enough for you but it's good enough for me.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

God called the seventh day holy at creation, even before sin. He tells His people to remember to keep it holy. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath and teaches us much on how to keep it holy. That might not be good enough for you but it's good enough for me.

Works for me as well... if the only mention of Sabbath was in the creation story, then Crib would have a point, but the fact it was reminded of in Exodus and claimed by Jesus and we are told a requisite to eternal life, leaves zero doubt about it's importance...

The big thing to me is how we view and keep it... legally or in the spirit of love as it was intended.

 

[Cribstyl]

God called the seventh day holy at creation, even before sin.

The text dont say that Adam was commanded to keep the seventh day Holy and sanctified.

He tells His people to remember to keep it holy.

Your comments reflex on scriptures 2500yrs later to where God has given the sabbath to one people as sign and part of a covenant between Himself and them only?
If God made Sabbath a creation institution, would He change His mind and make it a sign for one group and exclude all other nations of the world?
The fact that Sabbath is a sign for one people proves that it was not a creation institution and no longer for all nations.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath and teaches us much on how to keep it holy.

Again, your comments now refers to 5000yrs from creation and still under the covenant that would not be seal by His blood.

That might not be good enough for you but it's good enough for me.

This may work for ECR but these are not biblical truth to gamble your life on.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

If God made Sabbath a creation institution, would He change His mind and make it a sign for one group and exclude all other nations of the world?
The fact that Sabbath is a sign for one people proves that it was not a creation institution and no longer for all nations.

The Laws weren't for the Israelites only Crib.. they were the only people worshiping God at that time and were chosen through Abraham to spearhead the campaign of bringing all nations under God. The Israelites were not to keep their inheritance to themselves but were to evangelize the world. Therefore, the Law given to them would have been for all as it is a sign between God and His people... His people being all those that would worship and obey Him, of every nation, creed and tongue.

Do you believe that anyone in our world today can receive salvation? It was no different back in OT times. If Christians today did not evangelize to the rest of the world, it would not be because God only meant for us to have the promise but because we have selfishly horded it.

 

[Cribstyl]

Works for me as well... if the only mention of Sabbath was in the creation story, then Crib would have a point, but the fact it was reminded of in Exodus and claimed by Jesus and we are told a requisite to eternal life, leaves zero doubt about it's importance...

The big thing to me is how we view and keep it... legally or in the spirit of love as it was intended.

First of all, sabbath is not mentioned at creation, God resting is what is mentioned.
Secondly, saying that Ex20:8 reminds people about creation is wishful thinking. If you take time to study rather that swallowing every word that people spit out, you might learn from the word of God.

The fact is "Remember the sabbath day to keep it Holy" is a commandment of itself.
The command simply means "keep the sabbath day Holy" not remember creation. It make no sense to imply creation in the command, if creation is mentioned in the explanation why to keep the sabbath.

When we isolate words or phrases, the sentence changes for commentary to go wild.

Moses explained that he was between God and them, and told them what God said in Ex 20:8 back at Sinai.......Deu 5:12¶Keep the sabbath day to sanctify it, as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee.

The fact is, Why to keep the sabbath take us back to the truth that God had made the world in six days and rested on day #7 (not Adam keeping sabbath)Exd 20:11For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day:


wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

"Sabbath day" and "the seventh day" is distinct and not interchangable in this text.
Secondly, blessing and sanctifying the sabbath day make the sabbath a sign for the children of Isreal to keep.

The fact that God tells us later in time about who He gave the sabbath cannot be denied.
The fact that Jesus said that sabbath was made for man, implies that angel never kept it and it was given to Moses.

God's word is true without having to pull strings.

 

[k4c]

Cribstyl;The text dont say that Adam was commanded to keep the seventh day Holy and sanctified.

The very words holy (regarded as deserving special respect or reverence), sanctified (to set apart for sacred use; consecrate) and blessed (to invoke divine favor upon) carry meanings that deserves mankind's attention.

Your comments reflex on scriptures 2500yrs later to where God has given the sabbath to one people as sign and part of a covenant between Himself and them only?
If God made Sabbath a creation institution, would He change His mind and make it a sign for one group and exclude all other nations of the world?
The fact that Sabbath is a sign for one people proves that it was not a creation institution and no longer for all nations.

The Sabbath as a sign of the covenant is only one use of the Sabbath day. It's also used as a sign of creation and it's Creator. It's also a sign that when people remember to keep it holy it tells people around them which God they serve. It also separates a people for God that He can call His own. A people He calls, a royal priesthood, a peculiar people, a holy nation and the Israel of God.

By the way, where did God get the idea that the seventh day was anything special anyway? Why not use the 6th day as the sign of the covenant since man was created on the 6th day. Do you think that maybe it's because the seventh day was created a special and holy day in the begining?

Again, your comments now refers to 5000yrs from creation and still under the covenant that would not be seal by His blood.

Just because God uses a holy thing as a sign or a symbol does not make it void for anything else. God uses marriage as a symbol of the relationship between Him and His people but that does not make void marriage itself.

This may work for ECR but these are not biblical truth to gamble your life on.

I don't expect you to be able to receive the same deep spiritual truths as ECR, you have to have eyes to see and ears to hear. This is why I've so patient with you. Maybe God will grant you repentance.

Just some food for thought.

Jesus kept the Sabbath holy and He's called, the last Adam. In other words, Jesus did what Adam should have done.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Crib, it saddens my heart that you may be lamenting your stubborness when standing outside the city, unless you open your eyes.

If you cannot see the direct link between these two verses my friend, there is no sense in any of us here continuing to dialogue with you on this subject..

Ex 20:10,11
But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:3
And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.


It's exactly the same language Crib...


Also, how can you say that the seventh day and Sabbath are not interchangeable in Exodus 20:11? The mention of the seventh day is sandwiched in between two Sabbath statements.... please brother, open your heart to the truth!

What exactly are you afraid of? Do you think God will be upset for keeping the seventh day or are you just hardened to principle??

 

[ricker]

The big thing to me is how we view and keep it... legally or in the spirit of love as it was intended.

This is interesting, I seem to remember the origional Sabbath law as saying those who picked up sticks on the Sabbath were to be stoned to death. Legalistic?

 

[k4c]

This is interesting, I seem to remember the origional Sabbath law as saying those who picked up sticks on the Sabbath were to be stoned to death. Legalistic?

Times under the old covenant were different. Also, why was the guy picking up sticks? Was it necessary to life or to heal someone or was he violating the letter of the law, of which the old covenant was founded on? Jesus corrected many of the llegalistic misconceptions regarding how to keep the Sabbath holy. Doing good, healing and caring for the needs of others Is not a violation of the sabbath according to Jesus. Jesus was a carpenter buy trade but you never hear of Him building a house on the Sabbath.

 

[ricker]

Times under the old covenant were different. Also, why was the guy picking up sticks? Was it necessary to life or to heal someone or was he violating the letter of the law, of which the old covenant was founded on? Jesus corrected many of the llegalistic misconceptions regarding how to keep the Sabbath holy. Doing good, healing and caring for the needs of others Is not a violation of the sabbath according to Jesus. Jesus was a carpenter buy trade but you never hear of Him building a house on the Sabbath.

Thanks for your view of Sabbath observance, but I posted what I did in response to the statement of ECR:

The big thing to me is how we view and keep it... legally or in the spirit of love as it was intended

My reply was my attempt to say that the origional written law concerning the Sabbath seemed somewhat legalistic to me, contrary to what ECR said.

 

[k4c]

Thanks for your view of Sabbath observance, but I posted what I did in response to the statement of ECR: My reply was my attempt to say that the origional written law concerning the Sabbath seemed somewhat legalistic to me, contrary to what ECR said.

May I ask you a question?

How do you define legalistic?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

This is interesting, I seem to remember the origional Sabbath law as saying those who picked up sticks on the Sabbath were to be stoned to death. Legalistic?

I keep the Sabbath by separating my activity and my focus from all the rest of the week, onto God. I keep it the way it was commanded, not because of fear of punishment but because I want to spend that time with the Father and Son to draw close to them and learn about their character, to be immersed in their love.

If you ever had the privilege of going to your grandparents every Sunday, where they could love on you and you could discover new things about them, you wanted to go, not because they would be disappointed if you didn't, but because you so enjoyed being in their presence, in their love for you.

 

[realtruth101]

The Laws weren't for the Israelites only Crib.. they were the only people worshiping God at that time and were chosen through Abraham to spearhead the campaign of bringing all nations under God. The Israelites were not to keep their inheritance to themselves but were to evangelize the world. Therefore, the Law given to them would have been for all as it is a sign between God and His people... His people being all those that would worship and obey Him, of every nation, creed and tongue.

Do you believe that anyone in our world today can receive salvation? It was no different back in OT times. If Christians today did not evangelize to the rest of the world, it would not be because God only meant for us to have the promise but because we have selfishly horded it.

I have only one question, where in the bible old or new, does it mention or elude to Abraham spearheading any campaign of bringing all nations under God, or evangelizing the world......I've never heard of anything like this?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Thanks for your view of Sabbath observance, but I posted what I did in response to the statement of ECR: My reply was my attempt to say that the origional written law concerning the Sabbath seemed somewhat legalistic to me, contrary to what ECR said.

The Law was established at creation and wasn't a burden or a list of rules, it was the product of love for one another. As time went on and man became more corrupt through sin, the intended purpose became lost and was almost forgotten until Moses delivered the Israelites from their laodician state. Because they did not know God anymore and His character and how to worship Him and honour Him through obedience and love, the Decalogue was written down, so they could understand, at a basic level, the start of what loving God and one another entailed. They were to grow from this milk message but instead they became more and more legalistic till they were in the place that Jesus found them in.

Jesus' purpose was to bring His people back to the true understanding of what the Law is and why it was there in the first place. The principles He laid out were not new to God's understanding of the Law but was to a backslidden, apostate people.