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A thought on Matthew 16: 18-19

Discussion in 'The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox' started by Light of the East, Aug 19, 2018.

  1. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    These two verses are the favorites for Roman Catholic apologists to insist upon their understanding that Peter is the head of the Church and therefore the See of Peter is without the possibility of error. This, in their mind, makes the Roman Catholic Church THE Church.

    I had a thought this morning that I would like to run by you. This might take a while to come to a conclusion, so be patient with me.

    1. As a Preterist, I find ample evidence that Matthew 24, the favorite chapter used by Dispensational Premillennialists to prove a future return of Christ in the "Second Coming" is actually talking about the Destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70. In that chapter, there are numerous "time-indicators" which speak of the "coming of the Son of Man" (vs 3) and the "end of the age" (aion). Thus, from verses 1-3, we see the destruction of the Temple connected to the coming of the Son of Man." This ended the covenant with national Israel forever as a dejuris act.

    2. Matthew is the Gospel which is strictly Jewish in its scope and appeal. The Jews would have understood Matthew better than any other Gospel because of the numerous references that are specifically Jewish in nature. We see it beginning in 1:1 with the genealogy from Abraham, something that would be very important to a Jew who understood the promises of God to Abraham. We see in the first four chapters numerous references to Jewish prophecies. These would make no sense to Gentiles, but were significant to a Jew.

    3. Beginning with Matthew 3:2, a significant term appears in that Gospel that appears nowhere else - the Kingdom of Heaven. Not the Kingdom of God, but something different. Words mean things, and it is lazy exegesis and a lack of thinking to make one into the other. What is the Kingdom of Heaven? It is the promised earthly rule of the Messiah. That was promised to the Jews specifically if they would be faithful to the covenant promises between them and Abraham. My opinion (and that's all it is - an opinion) is that the Kingdom of Heaven is specifically offered to the Jews as the Promised One comes to offer Himself as their King.

    4. Now notice this:
    In Revelation 21 and 22, the coming of the New Jerusalem is described. I believe this coincides with the Destruction of Jerusalem as described in the Book of the Apocalypse. Jerusalem (and not Rome) is the city of wickedness, the harlot that sits upon seven hills. The New Jerusalem comes down to earth, the gates are ever open to all who will enter into Her (by repentance and baptism) and outside are the wicked.

    5. Here is where I tie this altogether. The Bible is a Book of Covenant. It describes the Fall of man from the covenant with God, the promise of the One who would restore the covenant, and the promise to Abraham to be a "father of many nations" as a covenant blessing. Revelation is the end of the book and describes this whole process up until the Destruction of Jerusalem and with that destruction, the establishment of the Church, the New Jerusalem

    Why is this significant to Matthew 16: 18-19. Because through the ages, men have treated the Bible as having yet to be fulfilled. On the other hand, if the Bible is a book written to Jews about the covenant and the possibility of their being the covenant Kingdom, then with the Destruction of Israel, the whole thing is finished and we are in the time when the gates of the New Jerusalem are open to everyone.

    Therefore, the promise given to Peter was a limited time promise in which Peter was sent to the Jews to open the gates of the Kingdom of Heaven. That is, in Preterist eschatology, if the Jews hearing Peter's preaching, had repented of their killing of their Messiah, they would have been given the Kingdom of Heaven (an earthly rulership). This is alluded to in Luke 13: 6-9, where the vinedresser for three years (the three years of Christ's preaching) found no fruit and was told to tear down the fig tree (National Israel). The response is "Let it alone. Let me dung it and see if it bears fruit. If not, it shall be torn down. The preaching of the Gospel was the time of dunging of the fig tree, but rather than bearing fruit, national Israel killed the Apostles and brought judgment on themselves in AD 70.

    When AD 70 was finished, there was no longer a need for the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven. The New Jerusalem, come down from heaven to mankind, was open to all mankind. No one was needed to unlock it because the gates are ever open to any who will come.

    Thus, the Roman Catholic claims regarding the Keys of Peter are utterly bogus. He used the keys, he opened the doors of the Kingdom by his preaching, and for his trouble, he was crucified upside down. In AD 70, Jerusalem was destroyed as prophesied in Apocalypse ant the gates of the New Jerusalem are open.

    NO NEED FOR KEYS!!!!

    Remember, this is just an opinion I have. Now have at tearing it apart, but remember your Christian charity as you do so.

    OH......one other thought. It is because Matthew is specifically Jewish in nature, the "keys of the Kingdom of Heaven" do not appear anywhere else in any other Gospel. Peter is noted as a leader of the Apostles, but not in the manner that Roan Catholicism posits him. He was sent to the Jews for one purpose - that has been fulfilled.
     
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  2. frienden thalord

    frienden thalord Well-Known Member

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    Then as a preterist , be warned , when the dark one stands in the name of peace
    unity and love , you are in grave danger of his deception .
    JESUS is going to return to destroy this all inclusive anti Christ for world peace when it does stand .
    But first it will have many true biblical saints killed .
    its spirit is at work , to now unify all faiths and religions and secular into a one common ground mindset .
    HEED IT NOT . This is satan at work to unify the world that he will soon hand unto the beast .
    and his prophets of this false unity for world peace will cuase the world to worhship the beast .
     
  3. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    What do you make of these two verses?

    Mat 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
    Mat 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

    There are several verses speaking of the same parable or event where Matthew says kingdom of heaven and Mark, Luke, or both say kingdom of God.

    The reign of heaven would surely be the reign of God as well?
     
  4. frienden thalord

    frienden thalord Well-Known Member

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    Hank. I remember when that owl was a buck deer . You throw those hands up and praise the Lord .
     
  5. RobNJ

    RobNJ CF Olde Pharte

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    I'd like to mention, to any sensible visitors, here in this forum... Wherever the above demented screed comes from,,,,,
    IT AIN'T ORTHODOX, doesn't belong here, and IS NOT depiction of the beliefs of The Church!
     
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  6. frienden thalord

    frienden thalord Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reminder that preterism is erroneous . THANK YOU .
     
  7. RobNJ

    RobNJ CF Olde Pharte

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    Preterism isn't the problem.. It's the Premil Dispensationalist Fractured Fairy Tales (drivel, like the "rapture"), that have no place here.
     
  8. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    even if you want to tie the keys and authority to St Peter, nowhere does Scripture say that only follows in Rome. that's the bogus idea
     
  9. Lost4words

    Lost4words Like a puppy, i need guidance. Supporter

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    'Eye of the needle' is referring to a gate in Jerusalem that heavily packed camels could not pass through. They had to be unloaded first. Same as the rich man. He cannot get into Heaven with all the trappings of his wealth!
     
  10. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Well, Father, like I said, it was just a passing thought. Not something I intend to claim as dogma. But I thought in interesting to consider that perhaps Peter did have the keys for a temporary period of time and then they were not needed any longer.
     
  11. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Why was the term "Kingdom of Heaven" only used in the Gospel of Matthew? It appears nowhere else. So when I was pondering this, I thought that perhaps it had to do with the fact that Matthew is the Gospel to the Jews. Luke and Mark would be speaking to Gentiles who wouldn't understand Jewish terms, thus the use of "Kingdom of God."

    Again, nothing dogmatic here, just some thoughts.
     
  12. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    duplicate post by accident
     
  13. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes. :)
    But my post is asking about the difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God, per the OP discussion.
     
  14. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Well, what do you think the difference is?

    Does it not strike you as odd that the phrase "Kingdom of Heaven" only occurs in Matthew?
     
  15. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I understand and that could be true. Why do you think Mark was speaking to Gentiles?
     
  16. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Well, I think I remember reading that somewhere in my studies.

    Here - from Wikipedia:

    Mark was written in Greek, for a gentile audience (that they were gentiles is shown by the author's need to explain Jewish traditions and translate Aramaic terms) of Greek-speaking Christians: Rome (Mark uses a number of Latin terms), Galilee, Antioch (third-largest city in the Roman Empire, located in northern Syria), and southern Syria have all been offered as alternative places of authorship.[12] The author may have been influenced by Greco-Roman biographies and rhetorical forms, popular novels and romances, and the Homeric epics; nevertheless, he mentions almost no public figures, makes no allusions to Greek or Roman literature, and takes all his references from the Jewish scriptures, mostly in their Greek versions from the Septuagint.[13] His book is not history in the modern sense, or even in the sense of classical Greek and Roman historians, but "history in an eschatological or apocalyptic sense," depicting Jesus caught up in events at the end of time.[14]
     
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  17. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    No, I think Matthew may have first been written in Hebrew, Mark in Greek and Luke as well. But remember that many Jews were Hellenized and spoke and read Greek. That's why the Jews wrote the Septuagint in Greek.
    Interesting video about the Jewish document, Hebrew Matthew, if/when you have time.
    https://www.nehemiaswall.com/hebrew-gospel-matthew-nehemia-gordon
     
  18. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    well, I think we would say he does have the keys, and he passed his authority to all bishops.
     
  19. gurneyhalleck1

    gurneyhalleck1 Has the Kavorka

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    What a great possible name for a metal band!----DEMENTED SCREED!!

     
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  20. gurneyhalleck1

    gurneyhalleck1 Has the Kavorka

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    He was at Antioch and Rome both; people forget his itinerant ministry and the fact that the Lord did not create a situation where the charisma of an individual bishop somehow metaphysically transfers to the next bishop. All bishops contain all the apostolic authority. The direct bishop right after St. James was not somehow "the new James." He didn't retain that man's charisma and unique character. He received the ability to rule as a bishop, period. Obviously some Sees were venerable and respected, but there were many reasons why....

     
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