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A real quick question for Muslims
- Thread starter BWSUQ
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Can you elaborate please. What happens when the Mahdi comes? I am not attempting to attack Islam, I am simply trying to learn as much about the issue of the Mahdi as I can. I am curious as to Islamic end-time prophecies. THanks
BWUSQ
BWUSQ
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See the following web addresses:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shi'a
http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/islam/blfaq_islam_twelver.htm
http://philtar.ucsm.ac.uk/encyclopedia/islam/shia/shia.html
Farside
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shi'a
http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/islam/blfaq_islam_twelver.htm
http://philtar.ucsm.ac.uk/encyclopedia/islam/shia/shia.html
Kind Regards,The last Imam, the Mahdi, is believed not to have died but to be in hiding
Farside
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I'm not sure if I'm right but I think Muslims believe that the Mahdi will come and fill the world with justice. He will come at a time when the world is very unjust, and he will have 313 followers that will fight with him. There will also be many fake 'Mahdi's' and some true followers, or supposed true followers will say that this isn't the true Mahdi when it is 
. Or at least, that's the Shia perspective.
You can find out more about the shia perspective on the Mahdi, the 12th Imam, here: http//)shia.org/mehdi.html - soz I can't make this into a link :o, have to have at least 15 posts to post a url.
. Or at least, that's the Shia perspective.You can find out more about the shia perspective on the Mahdi, the 12th Imam, here: http
//)shia.org/mehdi.html - soz I can't make this into a link :o, have to have at least 15 posts to post a url.
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The Shi'a are actually not Muslims for a number of reasons, but I won't get into that here. A good analogy is: Shi'a are to Islam what Mormons or Jehovah's Witnesses are to Christianity, except they're even more deviant. Nothing they say is reliable, so you should just disregard the addresses farside posted.
Anyways, the Mahdi will be a khalifah ("caliph" in English) whose time will be characterized by prosperity and progress. That's pretty much it. He will be an excellent leader who uplifts and enriches the Muslim community immediately before the return of Jesus. There's nothing in the Qur'an or from any sound narrations that mention him converting the world to Islam. In fact, there will always be non-Muslims in the world, and at the very end, only non-Muslims will populate the world.
Anyways, the Mahdi will be a khalifah ("caliph" in English) whose time will be characterized by prosperity and progress. That's pretty much it. He will be an excellent leader who uplifts and enriches the Muslim community immediately before the return of Jesus. There's nothing in the Qur'an or from any sound narrations that mention him converting the world to Islam. In fact, there will always be non-Muslims in the world, and at the very end, only non-Muslims will populate the world.
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ammuslim
Active Member
Bismillah:
The Mahdi or the guide to the truth is one of the major signs of the coming of the last day.,during the terrible chaos of the final times, Allah will use a servant having superior morality known as the Mahdi, to invite humanity back to the right path. The Mahdi's first task will be to wage a war of ideas within the Islamic world and to turn those Muslims who have moved away from Islam's true essence back to true belief and morality. At this point, the Mahdi has three basic tasks:
1. Tearing down all philosophical systems that deny Allah's Existence and support atheism.
2. Fighting superstition by freeing Islam from the yoke of those hypocritical individuals who have corrupted it, and then revealing and implementing true Islamic morality based on the rules of the Qur'an.
3. Strengthening the entire Islamic world, both politically and socially, and then bringing about peace, security and well-being in addition to solving societal problems.
According to many hadiths, Prophet Jesus pbuh will return to Earth at the same time, and will call upon all Christians and Jews, in particular, to abandon their current superstitions and to live by the Qur'an. As the Christians harken to him, the Islamic and Christian worlds will come together in one faith, and the world will experience that period of great peace, security, happiness, and well-being known as the Golden Age.
here are some hadiths about the Mahdi's energebce:
The Mahdi, one of my children, comes into being, by the blessing of Allah, upon the approach of the Day of Judgment and the weakening of the hearts of the faithful because of death, hunger, and the disappearance of the sunnah, and the emergence of innovations and the loss of means by which to enjoin the right and forbidding the wrong. His justice and prosperity will ease the hearts of the faithful, and friendship and love will settle between the non-Arab and Arab nations. (Al-Muttaqi al-Hindi, Al-Burhan fi `Alamat al-Mahdi Akhir al-Zaman, p. 66)
The Mahdi will not emerge unless disbelief invades everywhere and is openly committed in the public. What rules in such times is the invasion by disbelief... That is its power. (Mektubat-i Rabbani, 2:259)
The Mahdi will emerge following the instance of such vile corruption (fitnah) whereby all of the prohibitions are regarded as lawful. (Ibn Hajar al-Haythami, Al-Qawl al-Mukhtasar fi `Alamat al-Mahdi al-Muntazar, p. 23)
There will be tumult in Shawwal (the tenth Islamic month), talks of war in Dhul-Qa`dah (the eleventh Islamic month), and the outbreak of war in Dhul-Hijjah (the twelfth month). (Allamah Muhaqqiq Ash-Sharif Muhammad ibn 'Abd al-Rasul, Al-Isaatu li Asrat'is-saat, p. 166)
The three months referred to in this hadith coincide with the months during which the Iran-Iraq war developed. The first uprising against the Shah took place on 5 Shawwal 1398 (8 September 1976), as indicated by the hadith, and a full-blown war broke out between Iran and Iraq in Dhu'l-Hijjah 1400 (October 1980).
Another hadith describes the details of this war as follows:
A nation/tribe will come from the Farsi direction, saying: 'You Arabs! You have been too zealous! If you don't give them their due rights, nobody will have an alliance with you... It must be given to them one day and to you the following day, and mutual promises must be kept...' They will be going up Mutekh; Muslims will be coming down to the plain... Mushrikun (idolaters) will be standing over there on the bank of a black river (Rakabeh) on the other side. There will be a war between them. Allah will deprive both armies of a victory... (Al Barzeenji, Signs of the Judgment Day, p. 179)
- Those coming from the Farsi direction: those coming from the Iranian side
- Farsi: Iran, Iranian
- Coming down to the plain: Plain, Iranian Plain
- Mutekh: Name of a mountain in the region
- Rakabeh: Region where the oil wells are concentrated
This hadith draws attention to the outbreak of a racial dispute that would cause both sides to come down to the plain (Iranian Plain) and wage war. Further, as noted by the hadith, the Iran-Iraq war lasted for 8 years and, despite the many thousands of casualties, neither side could claim victory or a decisive superiority.
actually there are lots of hadiths concerning the coming of Mahdi, but i think the above information is enough for now.
Source: Harunyahya.com
peace
ammuslim
The Mahdi or the guide to the truth is one of the major signs of the coming of the last day.,during the terrible chaos of the final times, Allah will use a servant having superior morality known as the Mahdi, to invite humanity back to the right path. The Mahdi's first task will be to wage a war of ideas within the Islamic world and to turn those Muslims who have moved away from Islam's true essence back to true belief and morality. At this point, the Mahdi has three basic tasks:
1. Tearing down all philosophical systems that deny Allah's Existence and support atheism.
2. Fighting superstition by freeing Islam from the yoke of those hypocritical individuals who have corrupted it, and then revealing and implementing true Islamic morality based on the rules of the Qur'an.
3. Strengthening the entire Islamic world, both politically and socially, and then bringing about peace, security and well-being in addition to solving societal problems.
According to many hadiths, Prophet Jesus pbuh will return to Earth at the same time, and will call upon all Christians and Jews, in particular, to abandon their current superstitions and to live by the Qur'an. As the Christians harken to him, the Islamic and Christian worlds will come together in one faith, and the world will experience that period of great peace, security, happiness, and well-being known as the Golden Age.
here are some hadiths about the Mahdi's energebce:
The Mahdi, one of my children, comes into being, by the blessing of Allah, upon the approach of the Day of Judgment and the weakening of the hearts of the faithful because of death, hunger, and the disappearance of the sunnah, and the emergence of innovations and the loss of means by which to enjoin the right and forbidding the wrong. His justice and prosperity will ease the hearts of the faithful, and friendship and love will settle between the non-Arab and Arab nations. (Al-Muttaqi al-Hindi, Al-Burhan fi `Alamat al-Mahdi Akhir al-Zaman, p. 66)
The Mahdi will not emerge unless disbelief invades everywhere and is openly committed in the public. What rules in such times is the invasion by disbelief... That is its power. (Mektubat-i Rabbani, 2:259)
The Mahdi will emerge following the instance of such vile corruption (fitnah) whereby all of the prohibitions are regarded as lawful. (Ibn Hajar al-Haythami, Al-Qawl al-Mukhtasar fi `Alamat al-Mahdi al-Muntazar, p. 23)
There will be tumult in Shawwal (the tenth Islamic month), talks of war in Dhul-Qa`dah (the eleventh Islamic month), and the outbreak of war in Dhul-Hijjah (the twelfth month). (Allamah Muhaqqiq Ash-Sharif Muhammad ibn 'Abd al-Rasul, Al-Isaatu li Asrat'is-saat, p. 166)
The three months referred to in this hadith coincide with the months during which the Iran-Iraq war developed. The first uprising against the Shah took place on 5 Shawwal 1398 (8 September 1976), as indicated by the hadith, and a full-blown war broke out between Iran and Iraq in Dhu'l-Hijjah 1400 (October 1980).
Another hadith describes the details of this war as follows:
A nation/tribe will come from the Farsi direction, saying: 'You Arabs! You have been too zealous! If you don't give them their due rights, nobody will have an alliance with you... It must be given to them one day and to you the following day, and mutual promises must be kept...' They will be going up Mutekh; Muslims will be coming down to the plain... Mushrikun (idolaters) will be standing over there on the bank of a black river (Rakabeh) on the other side. There will be a war between them. Allah will deprive both armies of a victory... (Al Barzeenji, Signs of the Judgment Day, p. 179)
- Those coming from the Farsi direction: those coming from the Iranian side
- Farsi: Iran, Iranian
- Coming down to the plain: Plain, Iranian Plain
- Mutekh: Name of a mountain in the region
- Rakabeh: Region where the oil wells are concentrated
This hadith draws attention to the outbreak of a racial dispute that would cause both sides to come down to the plain (Iranian Plain) and wage war. Further, as noted by the hadith, the Iran-Iraq war lasted for 8 years and, despite the many thousands of casualties, neither side could claim victory or a decisive superiority.
actually there are lots of hadiths concerning the coming of Mahdi, but i think the above information is enough for now.
Source: Harunyahya.com
peace
ammuslim
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ammuslim said:
ibn_leroy said:
Let me unravel the three quotations.Farsides Quote said:
Quotation 1: Ammuslim must be a Shia Muslim,
Quotation 2: ibn_leroy must be a Sunni Muslim.
Quotation 3: If the Mahdi is still living, where is he hiding? Could he be hiding out with Usama Bin Laden? How old is the last Imam?
Enquiring minds need to know.Kind Regards,
Farside
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ammuslim
Active Member
Bismillah:
No im 100% sunni Muslim, i actually dont like using the word sunni or shia or any so called sects of Islam. the Prophet Muhammad called himself Muslim and he also called his followers Muslims so who am i to call myself sunni? . im only Muslim who follow the Qur'an and the sunnah of all prophets. Alhamdulelah.
peace
ammuslim
farside said:
Let me unravel the three quotations.
Quotation 1: Ammuslim must be a Shia Muslim,
Quotation 2: ibn_leroy must be a Sunni Muslim.
Quotation 3: If the Mahdi is still living, where is he hiding? Could he be hiding out with Usama Bin Laden? How old is the last Imam?
Kind Regards,
Farside
No im 100% sunni Muslim, i actually dont like using the word sunni or shia or any so called sects of Islam. the Prophet Muhammad called himself Muslim and he also called his followers Muslims so who am i to call myself sunni? . im only Muslim who follow the Qur'an and the sunnah of all prophets. Alhamdulelah.
peace
ammuslim
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M
markie4u2001
Guest
Some suni muslims say they are and some say they aren''t. They have differant ideas about some things but they are still muslims IMO. Don't the shia say there is no god but allah and mohamed is his prophett? They are muslim, somebody said that was all you had to do. If you are going to eliminate all the sects i don't think islam won't be the fastest growing religion in the world and yoou can''t claaim as many members as you do.ibn_leroy said:
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It takes more than just saying, "no god but God, Muhammad is God's Messenger". You have to actually believe it, and belief in that statement has conditions. The Shi'a (or "Twelvers") violate the conditions of "la illaha illa Allah." For example, they believe that their imams are infallible, omniscient, and omnipotent. However, in Islam, only God has those qualities. Some of them also believe 'Ali, radi Allahu 'anhu, was the incarnation of God, the same thing that some of you all believe about Jesus, 'alayhi salam. So, if they are Muslims, you guys may as well be Muslims too!
The Shi'a try to deceive some Sunnis into thinking that they believe in the Mahdi like we do. This is false. What they actually believe is that their twelth imam will return. And guess what their supposed "mahdi" is going to do to us Sunnis when he comes back? Well, to just give you an idea, Shi'a believe that the twelth imam will resurrect (again, a power only God has) Abu Bakr and Umar (the first two caliphs), kill them, resurrect them again, kill them again, resurrect, kill, resurrect, kill. . .over and over again. He will also resurrect 'A'ishah (the Prophet's wife) and whip her for adultery, even though God said she was innocent in the Qur'an (another matter of the disbelief of the Shi'a). That's just the tip of the iceberg. Don't even get me on Khomeini . . .
The Shi'a try to deceive some Sunnis into thinking that they believe in the Mahdi like we do. This is false. What they actually believe is that their twelth imam will return. And guess what their supposed "mahdi" is going to do to us Sunnis when he comes back? Well, to just give you an idea, Shi'a believe that the twelth imam will resurrect (again, a power only God has) Abu Bakr and Umar (the first two caliphs), kill them, resurrect them again, kill them again, resurrect, kill, resurrect, kill. . .over and over again. He will also resurrect 'A'ishah (the Prophet's wife) and whip her for adultery, even though God said she was innocent in the Qur'an (another matter of the disbelief of the Shi'a). That's just the tip of the iceberg. Don't even get me on Khomeini . . .
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ibn_leroy said:It takes more than just saying, "no god but God, Muhammad is God's Messenger". You have to actually believe it, and belief in that statement has conditions. The Shi'a (or "Twelvers") violate the conditions of "la illaha illa Allah." For example, they believe that their imams are infallible, omniscient, and omnipotent. However, in Islam, only God has those qualities. Some of them also believe 'Ali, radi Allahu 'anhu, was the incarnation of God, the same thing that some of you all believe about Jesus, 'alayhi salam. So, if they are Muslims, you guys may as well be Muslims too!
The Shi'a try to deceive some Sunnis into thinking that they believe in the Mahdi like we do. This is false. What they actually believe is that their twelth imam will return. And guess what their supposed "mahdi" is going to do to us Sunnis when he comes back? Well, to just give you an idea, Shi'a believe that the twelth imam will resurrect (again, a power only God has) Abu Bakr and Umar (the first two caliphs), kill them, resurrect them again, kill them again, resurrect, kill, resurrect, kill. . .over and over again. He will also resurrect 'A'ishah (the Prophet's wife) and whip her for adultery, even though God said she was innocent in the Qur'an (another matter of the disbelief of the Shi'a). That's just the tip of the iceberg. Don't even get me on Khomeini . . .
I find it weird how the Shia can totally the teachings of the Quran and follow their own false beliefs.
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S
Sunil Bhalla
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what is farsi direction and where is Rakabeh river? i have seen some muslims posting endtime hadits related to India and Hindus but found them very confusing. Can anyone explain end time hadits related to India,China and Hindus, if hadits relating to them really exist/
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ibn_leroy said:It takes more than just saying, "no god but God, Muhammad is God's Messenger". You have to actually believe it, and belief in that statement has conditions. The Shi'a (or "Twelvers") violate the conditions of "la illaha illa Allah." For example, they believe that their imams are infallible, omniscient, and omnipotent. However, in Islam, only God has those qualities. Some of them also believe 'Ali, radi Allahu 'anhu, was the incarnation of God, the same thing that some of you all believe about Jesus, 'alayhi salam. So, if they are Muslims, you guys may as well be Muslims too!
The Shi'a try to deceive some Sunnis into thinking that they believe in the Mahdi like we do. This is false. What they actually believe is that their twelth imam will return. And guess what their supposed "mahdi" is going to do to us Sunnis when he comes back? Well, to just give you an idea, Shi'a believe that the twelth imam will resurrect (again, a power only God has) Abu Bakr and Umar (the first two caliphs), kill them, resurrect them again, kill them again, resurrect, kill, resurrect, kill. . .over and over again. He will also resurrect 'A'ishah (the Prophet's wife) and whip her for adultery, even though God said she was innocent in the Qur'an (another matter of the disbelief of the Shi'a). That's just the tip of the iceberg. Don't even get me on Khomeini . . .
Pleas let me clarify some of your points.
We believe that there is no God but Allah, and that Muhammad (pbuh) was his messenger.
We believe that the Prophets and Imams are infallible, yes. However we do not believe them to be omniscient, all knowing, although, they can be given knowledge by Allah through inspiration, dreams, or voices, like Musa and the burning bush, like Yusuf and his dreams, and like the mother of Musa when she put Musa in the basket and into the river. We also DO NOT believe that the Prophet (pbuh) was omnipotent, neither the Imams.
Why do we believe that the Prophet and Imams were infallible? One sidepoint here, the Ahle-sunnah believe that the Prophet made mistakes, and that the Prophet (pbuh) frowned and turned his back on a blind man!
[font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 80:1] He frowned and turned (his) back, - I think most people will agree with me that it is unreasonable to follow such a man if he made such mistakes. If he made mistakes, how would we know whether what he was doing was a mistake, or a true teaching? Hence, we believe that the Prophets and Imams were infallible and did not make mistakes, they were the greatest creations of God.[/size][/font]WE DO NOT BELIEVE THAT Imam Ali (a.s.) WAS AN INCARNATION OF GOD. We follow the same Quran as the Ahle-sunnah, and in Surah Ikhlas it says:
[font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:1] Say: He, Allah, is One.
[/size][/font][font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:2] Allah is He on Whom all depend.
[/size][/font][font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:3] He begets not, nor is He begotten.
[/size][/font][font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:4] And none is like Him.
[/size][/font]
I would love to know where you have got your sources from, and, I'm open-minded, if you want to challenge me on my beliefs feel free, but please refrain from 'faith bashing'
. It definitely does not reflect well on the Muslim population, and it is one thing I have to thank our fellow Christian brethren with their 'What Would Jesus Do' campaigns. I have many Christian friends at school, and their Akhlaq (manners) are impeccable. We cannot believe that by 'faith bashing' we are putting forward a good image of Islam .King Regards,
Azhar
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Azhar said:Pleas let me clarify some of your points.
We believe that there is no God but Allah, and that Muhammad (pbuh) was his messenger.
We believe that the Prophets and Imams are infallible, yes. However we do not believe them to be omniscient, all knowing, although, they can be given knowledge by Allah through inspiration, dreams, or voices, like Musa and the burning bush, like Yusuf and his dreams, and like the mother of Musa when she put Musa in the basket and into the river. We also DO NOT believe that the Prophet (pbuh) was omnipotent, neither the Imams.
Why do we believe that the Prophet and Imams were infallible? One sidepoint here, the Ahle-sunnah believe that the Prophet made mistakes, and that the Prophet (pbuh) frowned and turned his back on a blind man!
WE DO NOT BELIEVE THAT Imam Ali (a.s.) WAS AN INCARNATION OF GOD. We follow the same Quran as the Ahle-sunnah, and in Surah Ikhlas it says:
[font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:1] Say: He, Allah, is One.
[/size][/font][font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:2] Allah is He on Whom all depend.
[/size][/font][font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:3] He begets not, nor is He begotten.
[/size][/font][font=VERDANA,ARIAL, HELVETICA][size=-1][Shakir 112:4] And none is like Him.
[/size][/font]
I would love to know where you have got your sources from, and, I'm open-minded, if you want to challenge me on my beliefs feel free, but please refrain from 'faith bashing'
King Regards,
Azhar
Yes we do believe that the prophet Muhammad made mistakes, but that was before he knew what he was doing was wrong. Allah makes sure to always correct his prophets before their life is over. For instance when the prophet David was tested by Allah to see if he would judge justly between two men, and the prophet David ended up failing that test. But he learned from his mistake, and the scholars agree that he was better after he made the mistake than before he made the mistake. I'd like to ask you a question. Why do the Shia's claim that Ali is more special than Abu Bakr, Uthman, and Umar, when Allah doesn't even mention Ali once in the Quran. Yet Allah mentions Abu Bakr(not by name). Also, the prophet Muhammad's dearest companion was Abu Bakr. After that his dearest companion was Umar. So, where do you get the justification to claim that Ali is somehow more special than those three richeous men?
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farside said:
Let me unravel the three quotations.
Quotation 1: Ammuslim must be a Shia Muslim,
Quotation 2: ibn_leroy must be a Sunni Muslim.
Quotation 3: If the Mahdi is still living, where is he hiding? Could he be hiding out with Usama Bin Laden? How old is the last Imam?
Kind Regards,
Farside
The Mahdi is not some kind of super human. He is just a descendent of the prophet Muhammad who will be given the knowledge and authority by God to lead the Muslims in troubled times. He will win many military victories and free the Muslims from oppression. He will not do forced conversions, don't know where you heard that from. He will rule over the Muslims for 7 years, and then he will die. After that, the prophet Jesus will take his place as ruler of the Muslims, and the world.
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Sunil Bhalla
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if you can plz give me the link of that thread or post it here again (i am intrested only in india and hindu related prophecy if they really exist)Muslim said:
thanks.
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