A question about differences

[Anto9us]

I DO mean "for the better" circuitrider

I think things regarding Race Relations have generally GREATLY IMPROVED since I rode the bus as a kid

down to the tennis courts

and saw the "Colored to the back of the bus" signs

I would think most of the posters here today have NOT seen the signs and the water fountains - it is GOOD that they did not have to see 'em

but in the last six years -- I see some things slipping BACKWARDS

and cop cars being set on fire

and cops being assassinated in their cars by someone who wants to make a statement for "Social Justice"

This is a long way from

people holdin hands and singin "We Shall Overcome"

and it is really SAD

 

[circuitrider]

The murder of police officers is indeed sad, as is the unnecessary killing of black young men by police.

We have come a way but have a much farther way to go.

 

[Anto9us]

got a long ways to go

but much gained so far on the whole

 

[circuitrider]

got a long ways to go

but much gained so far on the whole

My fear is that in some ways we are going backwards though. I've heard remarks made about or President that really go to his being black. Some of the remarks would have never have been made about a white President. I feel like it has brought out a great deal of racism.

 

[RomansFiveEight]

My fear is that in some ways we are going backwards though. I've heard remarks made about or President that really go to his being black. Some of the remarks would have never have been made about a white President. I feel like it has brought out a great deal of racism.

I hear those remarks all the time. The KKK is headquartered not far from me. Although these folks didn't become 'more racist' when we got a black President, just the reality of who they are bubbled to the surface.

A common phrase I hear out here is "We don't hate black people, we just hate n*****s". Their justification is, they don't mind black people who dress and act like they do. But if their pants sag, if their grammar is more 'urban', if they are receiving any sort of government assistance, etc., then they don't like them. An enormous percentage of this community (A poor, mostly white community.) is on government assistance. There are few complaints. But some of these same people who themselves receive government assistance, complain about blacks that receive government assistance. If a white person is receiving assistance, it's because Obama ruined the economy. If a black person is receiving assistance, it's because they are lazy. At least, that's the dynamic I hear by a small, loud portion of people. We've got a ways to go in some areas.

And to be clear, that's a vocal minority; but not the majority out here. But it's a loud minority.


Of course, just ask good ol' Philly Robertson. He remembers the 'whites' and 'coloreds' sections, and says the blacks were much happier back then, and thinks they'd be better off if they went back to that!

 

[circuitrider]

Of course, just ask good ol' Philly Robertson. He remembers the 'whites' and 'coloreds' sections, and says the blacks were much happier back then, and thinks they'd be better off if they went back to that!

He is living in the wrong century. And given the Jesus wasn't a white guy, where would Jesus get to sit?

 

[RomansFiveEight]

He is living in the wrong century. And given the Jesus wasn't a white guy, where would Jesus get to sit?

Actually I read the other day that good ol' Loo-Zi-Anna is among the states with the highest percentage of sub-saharan African DNA in whites in the U.S. So there's a statistical probability that the Robertsons aren't so 'pure' themselves.

 

[circuitrider]

Actually I read the other day that good ol' Loo-Zi-Anna is among the states with the highest percentage of sub-saharan African DNA in whites in the U.S. So there's a statistical probability that the Robertsons aren't so 'pure' themselves.

Yes, file that under "irony."

 

[Anto9us]

I have never seen an episode of "Duck Dynasty" - cannot say

although I am savin' on razor blades these days and I look like sumpn outta the Old Testament -- coulda been in the new "Exodus" movie I guess

savin on haircuts too -- I cannot get outta the house to work among humans these days - I must keep close to my aged Dad

so I look more of a hippie than in the hippie days

the "great equalizer" of race to me in my life has been the military - and sports

it has been "2 steps forward - 1 step back" about race relations for a good while

but still forward overall

 

[circuitrider]

I have never seen an episode of "Duck Dynasty" - cannot say

although I am savin' on razor blades these days and I look like sumpn outta the Old Testament -- coulda been in the new "Exodus" movie I guess

savin on haircuts too -- I cannot get outta the house to work among humans these days - I must keep close to my aged Dad

so I look more of a hippie than in the hippie days

the "great equalizer" of race to me in my life has been the military - and sports

it has been "2 steps forward - 1 step back" about race relations for a good while

but still forward overall

I don't believe in razors either, though I do trim my beard to avoid the ZZ Top look.

IMHO a man without a beard is like Sampson with his hair shorn.

 

[RomansFiveEight]

I have never seen an episode of "Duck Dynasty" - cannot say

although I am savin' on razor blades these days and I look like sumpn outta the Old Testament -- coulda been in the new "Exodus" movie I guess

savin on haircuts too -- I cannot get outta the house to work among humans these days - I must keep close to my aged Dad

so I look more of a hippie than in the hippie days

the "great equalizer" of race to me in my life has been the military - and sports

it has been "2 steps forward - 1 step back" about race relations for a good while

but still forward overall

Phil Robertson didn't say any of that on Duck Dynasty, it was during an interview. He was asked about race relations and he mentioned how he worked with blacks in the cotton fields back in the 50's and 60's, saying he was "White trash so we had to work with the blacks", and said they were singing songs, happy, carrying on, etc. He said when Jim Crow laws were lifted, that's when the "Entitlements" and "Welfare" started and blacks became unhappy. It's a pretty disturbing interview. I don't care how many times they make a show of public prayer on television cameras (Didn't Jesus say something about showing off prayers?), that's a disturbing point of view to have.

 

[Anto9us]

Jesus wouldn't get to "sit"

He would have to be serving...

 

[RomansFiveEight]

Jesus wouldn't get to "sit"

He would have to be serving...

 

[circuitrider]

Jesus wouldn't get to "sit"

He would have to be serving...

I was thinking of the bus rather than the lunch counter. I think he would be sitting in the back on purpose with those who are oppressed.

 

[RomansFiveEight]

I was thinking of the bus rather than the lunch counter. I think he would be sitting in the back on purpose with those who are oppressed.

I think Jesus could've been doing that; or something else. He was pretty good at knowing what was the most effective way to handle a problem

He also knew when the time was right. Sometimes he stirred the pot, and sometimes he quietly backed off.

If only we could have that sort of discernment.

 

[GraceSeeker]

Have to interrupt to say that I'm uncomfortable with the tenor of the conversation at present. I still sense that we aren't seeing people as people. We don't build a better more equaitable society by tearing people down. It might be possible to level the playing field by saying that Robertson isn't so pure or pointing out the failings of the KKK. Sure, you all might be right in all that you say, but how does saying any of it on here, rather than to them, make society better? I don't think it does. It probably isn't any one's actual intent, but I can't tell the difference between the above and simple gossip. So, can we move away from that aspect of the conversation, please?

 

[circuitrider]

Have to interrupt to say that I'm uncomfortable with the tenor of the conversation at present. I still sense that we aren't seeing people as people. We don't build a better more equaitable society by tearing people down. It might be possible to level the playing field by saying that Robertson isn't so pure or pointing out the failings of the KKK. Sure, you all might be right in all that you say, but how does saying any of it on here, rather than to them, make society better? I don't think it does. It probably isn't any one's actual intent, but I can't tell the difference between the above and simple gossip. So, can we move away from that aspect of the conversation, please?

GraceSeeker, what would be the best way to discuss these disturbing cultural issues? We have Christian books stores that would rather display DuckDynasty knick knacks exactly because Mr. Robertson made some of the statements he made.

When he made those statements and he was threatened with job loss evangelical Christians came out of the woodwork to protect him yet if any of us were to make such statements in conjunction with our jobs we'd probably be fired for at least being inappropriate in a way that would hurt the companies bottom line. I know if I made racist statements here in Iowa that I'd find myself without an appointment, and rightfully so.

The cultural captivity of the US Church is a huge problem in this world be that the cultural captivity in the north of the mainline Church being the former political darlings of the political left or the cultural captivity of many churches in southern and border state culture that goes back to the vestiges of the Old Confederacy and the anti-black, states rights, anti-US government sentiment that came out of the Civil War.

When you have churches giving away guns as door prizes, Christians defending TV darlings with real issues of racism and sexism, persons who are Christians claiming it is ok to slur a President because of the color of his skin or the sound of his middle name, we have some serious issues to deal with.

And just as an aside, once someone has agreed to put their life on TV for money, I don't have a huge amount of sympathy then if they get in trouble for saying something inappropriate in that venue. TV personalities are not above the same scrutiny that all of us should be under.

 

[Qyöt27]

'Reality TV' as an entire genre deserves a very quick and excruciatingly painful death. Even if it were to happen tomorrow, that's still 14 years too late (arguably, the genre is older than that by some standards, but prior to 2000 it wasn't really organized and was only a fraction of a fraction of a fraction as annoying).

So I couldn't stand Duck Dynasty and its ilk even before those reprehensible series of comments (not just the stuff about segregation, all of it) were made. That was just icing on the cake. And of course, at the same time, my parents (mostly my dad) suddenly became enamored with the show (sure, the timing was just coincidence...yeah, right), because they're Christians and so automatically, any criticism or controversy is 'they're being persecuted'. No, they're not, and anyone claiming that has no idea what they're talking about, especially if they try to invoke the First Amendment.

If they've got that garbage on (or really, any time he starts going off on politics or religion) I just grit my teeth and leave the room, while reminding myself of the value of choosing battles wisely - my posts on here may be collected, but that's only because I have time to think them out. In real life, I can't articulate well when I get angry.

 

[BryanW92]

When you have churches giving away guns as door prizes, Christians defending TV darlings with real issues of racism and sexism, persons who are Christians claiming it is ok to slur a President because of the color of his skin or the sound of his middle name, we have some serious issues to deal with.

Excuse me, is that a log in your eye? You forgot to list the sins of the Christian Left while you were cataloging all the sins of the Christian Right.

While you are painting us all as racists for not liking Obama, how do you explain our support for Allen West, Ben Carson, Walter Williams, Clarence Thomas, Thomas Sowell, Herman Cain, just to name a few very popular Conservatives?

 

[RomansFiveEight]

I don't think that's what Circuitrider was saying. I know conservatives who don't like Obama because of his policies. You forgot Hermann Cain and some other black conservative leaders. There are also black leaders who have some scathing things to say about the President.

But at least where I live, we've had Obama dolls hanging from trees, "get that n****r out of office" signs in yards, and the ever popular "It's called the WHITE house for a reason". These sort of slurs have nothing to do with conservativism but with racism. Only 15% of my county voted for Obama, and not 85% of them are racist. Some are just conservative, or even some liberals I know who felt he was ineffective in his first term and though a non-polarizing conservative would be better than a liberal that led a gridlocked congress. (Their words). Our numbers are similar to that of several past elections since the conservative shift of the 1960's. 15~20% of the votes go to Dems. The rest to republican candidates. Except for the occasional race where the republican has just been someone off the wall, like Todd Akin (of "legitimate rape" fame), who only managed 45% of the vote in a county where he would historically have won in a landslide. The 45% is probably representative of folks in this county who vote straight ticket republican regardless of candidates. And perhaps even some who vote straight ticket and don't even look at the candidates.

GraceSeeker makes a fair point about gossip. We should be cautious about how we say things. I just have to admit a bit of uncomfortableness of fundie Christian culture that vehemently defends statements like Mr. Robertsons.

Though, we also watch movies with Hollywood actors who treat marriages like publicity stunts, drugs becomes a part of their culture, the law doesn't apply, etc. Folks on TV are not immune to sin. I guess it's just a bit of a sore spot when people I care about, who espouse to love the same God I do, vehemently defend actions that should be considered the antithesis of the Christian faith. Loving Phil is the Christ like thing to do. But defending the actions is puzzling.

As an aside, I also hate the abuse of the term "free speech". "Free speech" means that the US government can not arrest or fine you for being critical of the government or others. I can say "I think the Republicrats are the worst party ever and President George W. Obama is the worst man to ever hold that office" and I cannot be arrested, charged, or fined. BUT, others are free to disagree with my opinion. It doesn't mean that we can say whatever we want and people have to just sit there and accept it. It also doesn't mean that there won't be free market ramifications, like boycotts, job loss, etc. because of what we choose to say.