A lighthearted look into why God cares about free will:

[Belk]

Observation of nature is not excluded by the bible, but pointed out by the bible:

The heavens declare the glory of God,
and the sky proclaims the work of His hands.

Day after day they pour out speech;
night after night they communicate knowledge.

Quantum theory is not excluded by scripture.

Indeed. Many scientists are Christians eager to know how the universe functions. However to make claims to knowledge of how space time works outside the universe is not something that can be supported by science.

 

[zephcom]

if I think of something it is inside of me but in some sense I am outside of it due to what thinks it being greater than the thought

And all of that remains within the universe and composed of elements of the universe. There is nothing irrational about elements of the universe interacting with each other regardless whether they inside you or outside you.

 

[Ana the Ist]

if a bowl is submerged in water then the water is both inside and outside of it. or you could just say that the bowl is inside of the water. it does not seem illogical to me to say something is both inside and outside of time.

Actually, that wouldn't make much sense...the bowl is in the water, not the other way around. Also, he isn't saying god is "inside" time...whatever that means.

 

[Ana the Ist]

This is what the whole video is about. It is about God maintaining a logically consistant world for us so that we can act freely. Its about him NOT disrupting the laws of logic too often to that we can act in a world that is predictable. If we are talking about the God of the bible then we have to accept everything that is claimed he did. He brought a man back from the dead, parted a sea, used a few fish and loafs of bread to feed 5000. All these things break logic. We can not break logic becuase it is just an inherent part of the universe that we live in. The being who created the universe, who created matter, time, causality, he is not confined by it. The video was saying how God chooses not to break logic too often so that we can love freely.

Here's the problem...I asked you a couple of tough questions about whether or not god chooses what he does, if he has free will, etc. You respond with the whole "we can't talk about god that way, he's non-temporal" and "it doesn't make sense to think of god as a temporal being, because he experiences every moment at once" and "he's incomprehensible to us" and so on ...here's why I called it a cop out...

Right in the paragraph above you talk about him in a temporal fashion as if he has free will. He "maintains" this, he "created" that, he "did this and that and this" he "chooses this and that". Which is it? Is he a temporal being who makes free will choices? Or is he some incomprehensible non-temporal being and we can't talk about him that way? Pick one and stick with it...to go and pull the old "god is mysterious/incomprehensible/unknowable" cop out every time you run into a difficult question is, in fact, just a cop out if you go back to talking about him as you did above.

Come on. Use your imagination. Im trying to make a point about a 2 dimensional being trying to comprehend 3D and how it couldnt do it. I was trying to do this to show how a 3 dimensional being (4 if you include time) can not comprehend more dimensions that they already exist in. How would you explain 5D or 6D? Apparently there are 13 dimensions.

I don't know if any 2D beings exist.

Ok so you dont like the word "outside". Lets choose a different one. God exist throughout the universe. He existed before matter but created matter. the whole universe was created at the same time so that must mean he is equal or greater in size to the universe (note these are useless terms to use about a being not made of matter but really, what other option is there.)

I don't know...it's your concept...I'm just trying to get you to clear some things up. Also, what do you mean "he created the universe"? Doesn't he also exist in a non-temporal place where he also hasn't yet created any universe? Wouldn't it be more accurate to say he's created the universe but hasn't yet created the universe, if he chooses to do so?

 

[Hammster]

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